Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2019 February 10

= February 10 =

Editing inquiry
Why can't I say that my grandpa is a great grandpa on his page.Jerry Obermueller — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.29.30.221 (talk) 00:53, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Because this is an encyclopedia not a form of social media or somewhere for you and other family members to trade insults. You can add constructive, encyclopedic information if you also provide a reliable source (see also WP:REFB for how to add references). If you continue to disrupt Wikipedia, as you have so far, you could well be blocked from editing. Eagleash (talk) 01:19, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Do not see a Save Changes Button in my Sandbox?
In My Sandbox I do not see a "Save Changes" button.

I only see a "Publish Changes" button.

How to make a "Save Changes" button appear in my Sandbox as I only wish to practice using my Sandbox.

I do not wish to Publish my changes or work worldwide. I am only learning using the Sandbox.

Please help. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Branchtwig (talk • contribs) 01:15, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * 'Publish' is the button you want. It changed from 'save' some time ago now. It appears confusing initially but the reason for the change was to do with copyright, I understand. Please remember to sign your posts on talk pages by typing four tildes . Thank you. Eagleash (talk) 01:21, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Now I know whey the keyboard shortcut for publish is Alt+Shift+S, not to be confused with Alt+Shift+P, which is not publish, but preview. --Cornellier (talk) 02:53, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Using Wiktionary link in an article
I wish to use the term "iteration" in a context not specifically covered by any English WP articles. On what I thought was the right help page, it mentions using   and   , but it is not explained how to use them. My most recent failed attempt:

, yielding: (not what I wanted).

How do I format the link without having the "wikt" showing on the page? I'm fairly certain that isn't correct.--Quisqualis (talk) 02:20, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * What are you trying to do? Something like this: iteration ? If you do edit source you'll so how I wrote that. --Cornellier (talk) 03:01, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you, Cornellier. That is all, and exactly, what I needed.--Quisqualis (talk) 08:56, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

2020 NCAA Men's Final Four Logo
Can you Upload the 2020 NCAA Men's Final Four Logo Please. 68.103.78.155 (talk) 03:17, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Why Didn't You Answer Me. Answer me NOW. 68.103.78.155 (talk) 16:40, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * We don't work this way. Drmies (talk) 16:56, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

What No logo. Can you upload the 2020 NCAA Men's Division I Final Four Logo Please. 68.103.78.155 (talk) 01:21, 12 February 2019 (UTC)

Why Didn't You Answer Me. 68.103.78.155 (talk) 03:42, 13 February 2019 (UTC)
 * None of the 100,000 or so unpaid volunteer editors here are interested, apparently, so I guess you will just have learn how to upload it yourself. It's not hard. If you show just a little willingness to learn and if you are polite, you might just find that a friendly editor will come along and help you. If you persist in appearing to be hostile, you will probably continue to be ignored. -Arch dude (talk) 06:24, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Television title card image upload
Hi, I am looking to upload a title card for the Australian television series Grace Beside Me. However, I am trying to be cautious in regard to copyright regulations. The following image is available towards the bottom of this link;

http://www.cuttingedge.com.au/case-study/grace-beside-me-2/

If the source is referenced, is this an acceptable use of the title card on Wikipedia? Or does the image have to directly come from a screenshot of the television program? (To classify it as an "own work"?) Or is the show's logo from the Facebook page more suitable? Thanks in advance. SatDis (talk) 04:48, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Hello, . Since that is copyright, and unlikely to be released under a compatible licence, the only way in which it could be used on English Wikipedia is if all the conditions in non-free content criteria are met. This is often done for covers of books and albums, and I don't see why it might not be done for a TV series as well. If you are using these criteria, the actual source doesn't matter (as long as you are sure it is the correct image); and you might have to put it through an image processing package to reduce the quality, to meet the "Respect for commercial opportunities" criterion. Then you can use the Upload wizard to upload it to Wikipedia (not to Commons). Certainly do not claim a screen shot as "own work". --ColinFine (talk) 11:10, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * (e/c) A screenshot is a derivative work not own work. And the logos on cuttingedge and Facebook are also non-free. But one non-free logo in the infobox of an article is usually acceptable to visually identify the subject. Upload a low resolution logo to Wikipedia (not Commons), tag it with non-free logo and use non-free use rationale logo with the Use=Infobox parameter for the required non-free use rationale. —teb728 t c 11:29, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Thank you both for the clarification. I will give it a go and follow those instructions. Thanks SatDis (talk) 11:41, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Are we sure about this? Our rules protect the WMF from violating US copyright law, and the image will be stored on a WMF computer in the United states. Our rules do not protect others from prosecution in other jurisdictions. The uploading editor will not violate US law as the WMF interprets it, but we cannot provide legal advice as to the legality of such an action taken elsewhere. The uploading editor must get appropriate legal advice elsewhere. I personally think this entire mess is ridiculous and that any that our rules are should be considered fair just about anywhere, but I'm not a lawyer and unfortunately I do not get to make the rules. -Arch dude (talk) 15:34, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I don't know the legal position,, but I observe that WP:NFCC says "Other non-free content—including all copyrighted images, audio and video clips, and other media files that lack a free content license—may be used on the English Wikipedia only where all 10 of the following criteria are met", and does not mention the US or any other polity or legal system. --ColinFine (talk) 17:41, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * , I'm sure that the WMF lawyers believe that the WMF is not breaking any US law when WMF allows editors to upload images to our servers under those rules, and that the US government agrees. I'm not sure that the WMF or its lawyers have an opinion on whether or not it is legal under Australian law for an Australian to upload those same images while sitting at a computer in Australia. -Arch dude (talk) 01:22, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

Institutional Contribution
Can a group of writers and researchers working together in entities such as a research institute, study group, journal, magazine, and the like, contribute to Wikipedia entries under their collective identity? Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2604:2000:6B49:AE00:9887:3FBF:7D8B:BEF8 (talk) 15:51, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * NO. Please see WP:USERNAME. Each editor needs an individual user name. Each editor is also free to state their affiliation with a group on their user page. -Arch dude (talk) 15:57, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Journal name
Hi, There is a journal entitled, "The Canadian Journal of Psychiatry/La Revue canadienne de psychiatrie" which is referenced twice in the article Posttraumatic stress disorder. The French is part of the journal's official name. An editor removed the French part of the title from the references with the explanation "the paper is in english, that the journal has a bilingual title does not mean we need to cite the bilingual part of it. no style guide recommends citing both languages of a publication" - but there is also no style guide which says not to use cite both languages of a publication, so that is not a compelling argument. Canada is a bilingual country with two official languages and to arbitrarily erase one of those languages doesn't seem right. My question is, should the full name of the publication be cited? (I didn't post this on the article's Talk page as it isn't directly related to Posttraumatic stress disorder). - thanks - Epinoia (talk) 16:29, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * If you are going to mention a particular editor by name, courtesy demands that you ping that editor so that they are aware that you are discussing them or their actions/viewpoints/comments.
 * You argue that Canada is a bilingual country with which point I agree. However, en.wiki is an English language encyclopedia so use of English is preferred because most readers of this Wikipedia don't speak or read French.  Where there isn't an official English language journal title then use of that non-English title is obligatory.  In this case, The Canadian Journal of Psychiatry is sufficient and correct.
 * —Trappist the monk (talk) 16:38, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * The case would be different if the article cited had been in French, then we could cite La revue canadienne de psychiatrie, but it's not. No one calls journals by there dual names just like no one calls the local store Dépanneur Jones / Jones' Convenience Store. I should know, I'm French-Canadian. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 17:22, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * - I don't want to belabor what is really a minor point, but colloquial usage does not determine academic usage - the editor who originally provided the citation thought it important to include the journal's full name and there is no reason to change a good faith edit - WP:DONTREVERT says that the "edit must actually make the article worse" - having the full name of the journal does not make the article worse (I realize this is not a revert, but an edit, but the guideline still stands) - removing the full name does not make the article better - I believe that the full name of the journal should be restored - cheers - Epinoia (talk) 16:50, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
 * - I don't want to belabor what is really a minor point, but colloquial usage does not determine academic usage - the editor who originally provided the citation thought it important to include the journal's full name and there is no reason to change a good faith edit - WP:DONTREVERT says that the "edit must actually make the article worse" - having the full name of the journal does not make the article worse (I realize this is not a revert, but an edit, but the guideline still stands) - removing the full name does not make the article better - I believe that the full name of the journal should be restored - cheers - Epinoia (talk) 16:50, 11 February 2019 (UTC)


 * The journal's name was added by a bot/script looking up an entry in database . And even if it had been added by a human, it's still not how you cited journals. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 02:01, 13 February 2019 (UTC)

Sgt. Monica Lin Brown's profile is being used in a scam
I don't know if you put such warnings on your wiki pages but if you do, can I alert you to the fact that the page on Sgt. Monica Lin Brown has been used by a scammer to send begging letters to email addresses.

I am sure that the real Sgt. Monica Lin Brown would be appalled at this and I am certain she has no involvement in this at all.

Regards,

Fiona Reid — Preceding unsigned comment added by SamsCat (talk • contribs) 16:43, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Courtesy link: Monica Lin Brown. 331dot (talk) 16:46, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately we have little control over what others do with Wikipedia articles or their content. If you are aware of a crime being committed, you should contact the relevant authorities. 331dot (talk) 16:47, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * If the scam itself has been reported in a reliable source, then you can add a description of the scam and any noteworthy events associated with it to the article. Be sure to cite your source. Mention of subject (the scam, in this case) in an existing article is perfectly acceptable. such a subject does not need to meet the same level of notability that would be required for a separate article on the subject, it merely needs to be non-trivial. -Arch dude (talk) 18:18, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Sorting with "Mc"/"Mac" separate from M?
Many years ago, I used to see sorting that had Mc/Mac as a separate sort section in between M and N. Are there any situations where that sorting would be used in Wikipedia? (So Michael would occur before McCalister?)Naraht (talk) 23:54, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * FWIW, when I worked in office admin in England, and in bookselling in Scotland, in the 1970s and '80s, the convention was to sort M‘/Mc/Mac between L and M. (Here ‘ represents the "turned comma" – M‘ is a now rare and slightly archaic way of writing the Scottish prefix under discussion. It appeared on some of J. T. McIntosh's books.) {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.122.1.40 (talk) 07:00, 11 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Same policy was used in card filing systems such as library indexes. Small manual index tabs use one of two schemes IME, either "A"-"X"+"YZ" or "A"-"W"+"XYZ"+"Mac" so as to give 25 tabs per pack.  In a big card index (Central library size, say 200 drawers) tabs are individually written so are at the librarian's discretion.  I have seen "O'" separated off from "O", but as it would file at the front of "O" anyhow, this was just a labelling convenience. I can see only one reason more perpetuating this tradition into electronic text however, and that is to keep "McTavish" and "MacTavish" together.  I would suggest considering "Mc" as a variant of "Mac" and filing accordingly. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 10:01, 11 February 2019 (UTC)