Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2024 June 6

__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__ = June 6 =

I nominated an article and it got a merge consensus, but it has not yet been merged.
the article is Caspar Babypants Coddlebean (talk) 04:53, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Someone has to do it. Feel free to do so yourself, otherwise someone will get to it eventually (WP:NODEADLINE). * Pppery * it has begun... 04:58, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * but i dont know how to do it :( Coddlebean (talk) 05:01, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Then that leaves someone else getting around to it, I suppose. Remsense  诉  05:40, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Done, assuming the merge template replaces itself as it says it will. CMD (talk) 06:13, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * thanks ^^ Coddlebean (talk) 06:28, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Category sorting order
I need categories to be sorted numerically (1, 2, 10) and not alphabetically (1, 10, 2). Category:Births by year is sorted numerically (as well as chronologically) but I am not able to figure out how it is achieved. I know that I can affect the sorting by putting leading zeros into the categorisation wiki syntax (e.g.,  ,  ) but then they are grouped by the leading zeros into sections in the parent category (e.g. categories 1 and 2 under section 0 and category 10 under section 1). Stefán Örvar Sigmundsson (talk) 05:23, 6 June 2024 (UTC)


 * It might help us help you if you could provide an example of where this is needed? You say you need it but you didn't link to any articles or categories as examples. Thanks! DonIago (talk) 05:39, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * The OP did provide an example. In that case the sorting is achieved by using templates such as Template:BirthyrBC, which might or might not be appropriate for what you are trying to do. Shantavira|feed me 07:00, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * The template has a mathematical expression for its sorting and  has  which I think just puts the year there. I am not sure what the trick is exactly but then the parent category groups the years either under "-" in the case of the BCE years and "0–9" in the case of the CE years. The best I can do is get the sorting right but split the grouping (category sections) into 0 for numbers 1–9, 1 for numbers 10 to 19 and so on. I feel like I am missing some code that instructs the parent category to group all categories starting with a digit under a single section. Stefán Örvar Sigmundsson (talk) 08:39, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Over at WP:SORTCAT, it seems that this Wikipedia is configured to sort by numeric value by default: Thus "9 dogs", "25 dogs", and "112 dogs" will all appear under the "0–9" heading in numeric order -- John of Reading (talk) 09:11, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * SAY WHERE YOU NEED IT. Sorry for shouting but you ignored the first request. Give a link to a category you want changed, not one which already does what you want. I suspect you are wasting everybodys time including your own by concealing it's about some secret wiki with another MediaWiki version or configuration than us. This is a help desk for the English Wikipedia. We sometimes try to help users of other wikis but you have to reveal which wiki you are posting about. PrimeHunter (talk) 20:11, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * This was the information that I needed. I had read this page before but when you mentioned that numeric sorting was default on this project I noticed the link to the Meta-Wiki page from 2016 about converting a few projects to numerical sorting. Stefán Örvar Sigmundsson (talk) 22:36, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * You could sort all numbers under a special character like space or asterisk, e.g. with sortkeys like  if all numbers are integers from 0 to 9999. If it's a Wikimedia wiki (what's the big secret?) then we might say how to request numerical sorting of all categories in the wiki. It may require a link to a consensus at the wiki. I don't think it can be done for selected categories only. If you control the MediaWiki installation then we can say how to configure it yourself. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:14, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Userbox not working??
In my account page my userboxes are not working, may i know why and how to fix? Thx. Datramguy (talk) 07:21, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * That's because there are  tags around all the pairs of braces. Maproom (talk) 07:30, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Ok - I suspect that's not the only reason. I suggest working on just one userbox at a time, until you get it to work. Maproom (talk) 07:35, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * I've fixed the one that is currently on your userpage in order to give an example of what each one should look like – the others will be formatted in a similar way. Tollens (talk) 07:46, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks!!! :) Datramguy (talk) 07:50, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

wikipedia business page not displaying
Hi I am the Marketing exec for a notable legal expenses insurer in South Africa. I created and published a wiki page for Scorpion who I work for. It has not been published. Why is this, and what do I still need to do? Peter-John Mason (talk) 07:31, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Maproom (talk) 07:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Hello – your draft was never submitted for review so nobody knew it existed. It is, however, entirely promotional, and will likely not be retained at all. Please be aware that Wikipedia is not a venue for advertising or other promotion. Please also see the instructions for making the mandatory paid-contribution disclosure and the conflict of interest guideline – you should likely not be writing an article about your company. When your boss tells you to edit Wikipedia may also be a useful read. Tollens (talk) 07:39, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Where did all the bytes go?
A new user made two edits, this one to their userpage and this one to ANI. The system reported that the user added 10K bytes (a bit more at ANI) to each page - where are they?--Bbb23 (talk) 12:49, 6 June 2024 (UTC)


 * Let me know if you find out. Mysterious. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 13:16, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Looked in the html source, can confirm that the page history is wrong. The page at that revision has one (paragraph) tag with no content in it. Also, an automatically added comment called "NPP limit report" credits the page with a Post-expand include size of zero bytes. Mach61 13:56, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Per VPT post, they added a bunch of invisible Unicode characters. Very deliberately, seems like. 57.140.16.48 (talk) 14:08, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * For the record, the breakage of template on WP:ANI was reverted in Special:Diff/1227522396, a minus 10,000 bytes edit. —⁠andrybak (talk) 12:51, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

How to (if possible) use Special:ContentTranslation with the source editor?
I am trying to translate a dewiki page to enwiki and it appears that ContentTranslation uses VisualEditor by default. I find this incredibly grating, especially for working with templates (particularly citation templates). Is it possible to disable VE? Cheers, Mach61 13:47, 6 June 2024 (UTC)


 * I think your question is best asked here Teahouse for future assistance. However, after looking at https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Content_translation, it doesn't say how to turn off VisualEditor when using Special:ContentTranslation at all. If you want use the source editor, you could create a page for it and then source edit it from there. Just make sure to move the page to Draft as it is not ready to be public yet.
 * This is the only method I know how to avoid using VE with Special:ContentTranslation I think. Soafy234 (talk) 14:39, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * @Soafy234 No comment on your answer to my question, but I am confused why you said I should go to the Teahouse, seeing as ai am a fairly experienced editor at this point. Mach61 15:03, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Can Netflix Playlist be a reference to show Japanese Anime available area?

 * If no, is there any policy/guidelines to support that?


 * If yes, which policy/guidelines allow me to do that?

I hope there is someone can help me. HK5201314 (talk) 13:57, 6 June 2024 (UTC)


 * If I'm understanding your question correctly, no, that would be original research. You would need a reliable source for such information, our own observations don't count for anything here. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 21:21, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * I would like to share some interesting point to you. It is come from ZH Wiki Village pump (policy) and this interesting pointis said by Chinese Wiki Admin.
 * He said that
 * 假設某人在香港，從播放清單觀看得到某節目，然後該人在該節目的條目中寫香港區可以看，這是一個非常直觀的描述，不屬於「產生或暗示新的結論」. 內容有沒有原創研究，完全要看編者寫成怎樣才會知道，不可能事先認定使用某種來源就一定是原創研究.
 * In English
 * Suppose someone is in Hong Kong and gets a program from the broadcast list, and then the person writes that Hong Kong can be seen in the entry of the program. This is a very intuitive description and does not belong to "producing or implying new conclusions". Whether the content is original or not depends on how the editor writes it. It is impossible to determine in advance that the use of a certain source must be original research. HK5201314 (talk) 23:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Each project makes its own rules and has its own standards, so what we do here has no influence on the Chinese Wikipedia and vice versa. Just Step Sideways from this world ..... today 23:49, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * So, if I want to argue with him, what point should I take it? HK5201314 (talk) 00:14, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * You go by what zhWiki's policies are, not enWiki's. — Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 01:03, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * 90% of ZH wiki policy and guideline are come from (translated from) English wiki. (Including  WP:original research )
 * So, I just come here to get some idea of how to argue with the ZH admin.
 * All editors and other admin are shut up after the admin was show up his claimed.
 * After you read the ZH admin claims, do you think his claimed have problem? If he comes to English Wiki and use his claimed to edit Netflix related article, is there any problem?
 * P.S. This argument is talking about translating English WIKI guideline MOS:TVINTL to ZH Wiki. All editors in the proposal are supported and only the ZH Admin reject it based on the previous point.
 * HK5201314 (talk) 11:09, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * To repeat what said above: en.Wikipedia has no influence over, or involvement in, zh.Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, and very few responders on this Help desk will have any knowledge of them. Most will not even even be able to read MSM or other Chinese languages/topolects. We cannot therefore advise on how to interpret a particular case according to zh.Wikipedia's interpretation of what counts as 'Original research', because we do not know what that is, and we do not know (and cannot read) all the details of the case and Article being discussed.
 * On en.Wikipedia, 'Admins' do not have any more authority than any other editors (and editors do not even need to have a Wikipedia account. I do not, for example). There is no formal hierarchy, and all arguments must be made, and can be contested, on the basis of written policy. Admins here merely have access to a few more powerful tools to help them in their self-chosen tasks, which we often liken to a janitor mopping a floor. It is true that editors must demonstrate considerable experience and competence before being given Admin access to those tools.
 * There would be no problem with a zh.Wikipedia Admin coming here and editing, because he or she would have to edit according to exactly the same en.wikipedia rules and guidelines that all editors, Admins or not, are required to follow.
 * I hope this is helpful. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 188.220.136.217 (talk) 15:36, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
 * To repeat what said above: en.Wikipedia has no influence over, or involvement in, zh.Wikipedia's policies and guidelines, and very few responders on this Help desk will have any knowledge of them. Most will not even even be able to read MSM or other Chinese languages/topolects. We cannot therefore advise on how to interpret a particular case according to zh.Wikipedia's interpretation of what counts as 'Original research', because we do not know what that is, and we do not know (and cannot read) all the details of the case and Article being discussed.
 * On en.Wikipedia, 'Admins' do not have any more authority than any other editors (and editors do not even need to have a Wikipedia account. I do not, for example). There is no formal hierarchy, and all arguments must be made, and can be contested, on the basis of written policy. Admins here merely have access to a few more powerful tools to help them in their self-chosen tasks, which we often liken to a janitor mopping a floor. It is true that editors must demonstrate considerable experience and competence before being given Admin access to those tools.
 * There would be no problem with a zh.Wikipedia Admin coming here and editing, because he or she would have to edit according to exactly the same en.wikipedia rules and guidelines that all editors, Admins or not, are required to follow.
 * I hope this is helpful. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 188.220.136.217 (talk) 15:36, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Can't revert vandalism (??)
Hi all,

cannot be reverted due to some issue with a blacklisted link. Requesting help from a more experienced editor to resolve this significant blanking.

Best regards, Shazback (talk) 19:52, 6 June 2024 (UTC)


 * Mostly fixed now. I will keep working on it and make sure the article titles for those refs show up again as well. Archived links to about.com are whitelisted here so it should just be a matter of replacing the links. Tollens (talk) 20:44, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Ah, it appears they all redirect to a live version. I'll just change out the links for the already-redirected ones. Tollens (talk) 20:57, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks! Shazback (talk) 21:04, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Oh, they aren't at all the same. I guess I'll use the archives after all. Tollens (talk) 21:05, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
 * ✅ Tollens (talk) 21:43, 6 June 2024 (UTC)