Wikipedia:Meetup/Melbourne/2

< Meetup/Melbourne

Meetup in March
EuropracBHIT has enthusiastically suggested that the members of WikiProject Melbourne need to organise a new meetup to discuss project issues and the proposal, discussed at a recent Meetup/Sydney, for an Australian Wikimedia chapter. I agree. There is so much going on in different areas of Wikipedia that you could spend most of you time on-line just reading rather than contributing. I think the occassional get together to discuss ideas and generally chat about a common subject has merit.

The last meetup was the last Tuesday of November at Centre for Ideas (CFI) postgrad lounge. I am going to suggest the last Tuesday of March (28th) 21st at 7pm at the same place (could someone check if it's available). Other suggestions and comments are welcome.

For those who are unfamiliar with the concept of a Local Chaptor (like myself), checking the following will at least give you some idea of what has been happening, and what is being proposed:


 * Local Wikimedia chapter
 * Local chapter FAQ
 * Wikimedia Australia
 * Talk:WikimediaAustralia
 * Meetup/Sydney
 * Meetup/Sydney/February 2006/Minutes
 * IRC Log summary 19 February 2006
 * Possible projects of Wikimedia UK

EuropracBHIT has said that we need to take the initiative. This has been my two cents worth of initiative. So dig in your pockets and make a donation. Cuddy Wifter 00:31, 26 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Strong support abakharev 06:50, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment. The Centre For Ideas postgrad lounge was organised by User:Mark Elliott. Might be best to contact him to make another booking. Cnwb 10:36, 26 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Support Thank you ever so, Cuddy. We will (make a donation). What about a gold coin? I am so moved you would do this. I will try to come to the Centre of Ideas on the 28th, it is in my holidays anyway, or we just start back. Even if I don't end up coming, I should know we made the effort to do so. --EuropracBHIT 17:31, 27 February 2006 (UTC).
 * It's fairly ironic that the person who talked about taking the intitative isn't able to come. Couldn't someone give the speech/presentation in my stead (Bainer, or pfctdayelise or someone who knows the issues)? It is an hour before it all begins, and it is looking increasingly unlikely. I did say something about going to bed, and I am really really sorry that I can't make it. I did want to very badly. But headache and sinuses make it a trial to travel. --EuropracBHIT 06:24, 21 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Meetup Date User:Mark Elliott informs me that Tuesday March 28 is not available. How about Tuesday March 21st? Cuddy Wifter 03:55, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Does not matter with me abakharev 04:21, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * How lovely. March the 21st happens to be my birthday, so you can imagine I'm pretty happy about that. --EuropracBHIT 08:09, 28 February 2006 (UTC).
 * Support for a meetup. However, I'm fairly sure I can not make the 28th, but I could possibly make the 21st. --Bduke 06:44, 28 February 2006 (UTC). I'll be there. --Bduke 02:41, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support, but I probably won't be there because I'll be getting ready for work. --BenM 10:37, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Support, I would love to attend. Tuesday should be fine for me. --Canley 11:33, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Support: March 21 should be fine. --Robert Merkel 23:52, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * support anytime bar Sat/Sun evenings pfctdayelise (translate?) 01:12, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support: 7pm March 21 (or 28) suits me. I think there is value in us meeting Peter C Talk! 02:36, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support: Any time after the 21st of March suits me. I think it's a great idea. scott a 06:30, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support: although can't attend in March/early April as will be travelling interstate. --Takver 08:36, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support: although I probably wont be able to attend, Brendanfox 10:31, 1 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Support: I wont be able to attend (not in melbourne right now) but sounds like a great idea -- Sploggers 21:05, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support. Not entirely sure if I can make it, but if I can - I'll definitely be there. Cnwb 22:31, 1 March 2006 (UTC). Update - I won't be there, but I look forward to reports and photos. Cnwb 02:43, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I'll be there. --bainer (talk) 23:44, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I'll be there. My few days in Melbourne at the time of the first meetup turned out to be longer than expected... so I'm still here. :) Angela. 16:32, 3 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Tim Starling will be there.
 * Goody goody gumdrops! The glamour couple of Wikipedia will be there! But won't you be moving to Sydney soon? And doesn't this have implications for the incorporation of the organisation? In terms of manpower and such? --EuropracBHIT 20:13, 3 March 2006 (UTC).
 * No, we're more likely staying in Victoria for another year at least now. I've never been described as part of a "glamour couple" before. :) Angela. 02:32, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support Keen to attend, should be able to do so. Excellent idea. DarrenRay 06:30, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Support I would very much like to attend one of these meetings, but I am in Canberra during Parliamentary sitting weeks, the next one of which begins on Monday 27 March. Could we try to make it before that date? Adam 07:36, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Adam, can you try to come on the 21st? --EuropracBHIT 09:32, 4 March 2006 (UTC).
 * I think so. My only other suggestion is that it is somewhere quiet. I hate meetings in restaurants. Adam 10:09, 4 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I think the Centre for Ideas is quiet. I hate noisy restaurants too. I have never been to the Centre of Ideas, though. We'll try not to address anything too important while we're eating. --EuropracBHIT 10:17, 4 March 2006 (UTC).


 * As I said before, what was good about the last meetup was that we had a meeting in a quiet venue (Centre for Ideas) and then a more social side at the restaurant afterwards. Best of both worlds. Cnwb 00:43, 5 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Pde expects to attend.
 * Support but I won't be able to come unfortunately. Got tickets for the basketball semi-finals on the evening of the 21st. Sarah Ewart (Talk) 09:14, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Dem I miss the debate, to bussy drinkng and making bread. Poor me la. Can I come cause I have no friends, so sad. Enlil Ninlil 04:35, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I wish I could travel, this sounds like it would have been great to come to. One day I will come to beautiful Victoria again :( - Cartman02au 05:15, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Not sure whether I need to sign in or anything, but I guess it won't harm. I'll come (if I can find the place). -- Jitse Niesen (talk) 02:26, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Eating

 * What about something to eat at the Centre of Ideas, or does anyone know good restaurants in the inner city which are easy to walk to, without falling behind in the group? --211.28.229.184 09:43, 28 February 2006 (UTC).
 * The Blue Train worked well last time. It's (relatively) cheap, is close by, and has a fairly wide menu. I think it was good to change venues last time, we had a business end and a social end. Cnwb 22:28, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I wonder if they serve birthday cakes? Or do we have to bring our own? --EuropracBHIT 22:37, 28 February 2006 (UTC).
 * They don't even take bookings, so perhaps unlikely. But then again they do have a good range of cakes there and I'm sure we can arrange something :) --bainer (talk) 11:21, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Can I put in a plug for Inkari (on Lygon Street, Carlton)? It's Latin American food, and they have a good range of coffees and cakes. Plus the people that work there are super friendly. Otherwise, I like Blue Train a lot. How many people came last time? scott a 06:30, 1 March 2006 (UTC)
 * From the photos of the last meetup it looked like about a dozen people turned up. Since eating was the first subject for discussion perhaps we can make it the first item on the agenda. Cuddy Wifter 06:19, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I can bring lots of bread, for Vegemite and Bread, yum. And also we should have egg tart yummy. Enlil Ninlil 04:28, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Meetup Date confirmed
CFI postgrad lounge is booked for 21 March, 2006 from 7pm. From the previous meetup: The pgrad lounge is located downstairs (to the left of the red staircase) in building H on this map. Best parking is usually on Grant street and the CFI's location details are also listed on the map. Cuddy Wifter 06:23, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

Collecting money
What sort of money are we meant to collect? Sarah Ewart wants to know. She enquired specifically about start-up costs. And what about a summer picnic at the end of the academic year, so that we can go to the Mornington Peninsula/or a barbecue? That way we can have fun for all the family. (What about a Wikihat in CafePress?) --EuropracBHIT 03:17, 4 March 2006 (UTC).


 * Startup costs is something we can put aside for now I think. And in any event, it won't just be the Melbourne people contributing! --bainer (talk) 11:21, 7 March 2006 (UTC)


 * The Wikimedia Foundation can give a startup grant to new chapters if needed. Angela. 05:37, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

Quiz
Several Wikimeetings have had a quiz. What about a quiz between now and the 21st? We could all cooperate in thinking up questions. They can be about Wikipedia or about us. --EuropracBHIT 07:19, 4 March 2006 (UTC).

Photography
Who will play the role of our official photo-taker? I intend to bring my digital camera, and I imagine several Wikipedians would do the same. Does anyone have a camera mobile phone? --EuropracBHIT 00:11, 5 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Every 12-year-old has one. Adam 04:53, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Festival
Festival Melbourne (timetable) is on this week. Perhaps the meetup could end there for people who want to go on somewhere after we eat.
 * That would be excellent. Unfortunately I should probably have to come straight home again after my excursion in the city. I would have to discuss this with some people. Have a great time experiencing Festival Melbourne, if that's what the preponderance of members decides to do! --EuropracBHIT 07:36, 20 March 2006 (UTC).

Videos and podcasting
I am aware that some Wikipedians have a blog, and others have the capacity to podcast. I think it would support the written report as well as pictures. Could someone let me know if they are able to do this soonest? It would be good to get everything which is happening. --EuropracBHIT 06:30, 21 March 2006 (UTC).

Agenda
With just over a week to the meetup on March 21 I thought it might be time to consider an agenda of items or proposals people want to discuss.

In particular, I would appreciate if someone who has been involved with the discussions on a local chapter of Wikimedia could post a brief summary of where this proposal stands at present.

Please add to the following lists any subjects, proposals, items or ideas which you would like to discuss. - Cuddy Wifter 00:20, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Wikimedia Australia




This is a problem inherent in free Yahoo. The username is wikimedia_australia, and the password is wikimania. I'll have to change the password, so here we are: http://au.briefcase.yahoo.com/bc/wikimedia_australia/lst?.dir=/My+Documents&.src=bc&.view= --EuropracBHIT 12:04, 18 March 2006 (UTC).
 * The present situation and next steps.
 * Could someone kindly tell me a nice open-source presentation programme? I do have something up in Microsoft PowerPoint which explains the issues nicely.
 * OpenOffice.org Impress, part of the OpenOffice.org suite. --bainer (talk) 11:30, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Thank you, Stephen. Indeed I have used OpenOffice previously, with success. But it is taking ten years to download and this with a fast UK server. I thought to download it to Yahoo Briefcase while I was waiting, and you may open up the links with your own browsers. Do feel free to ask questions or raise issues I may have left out. Oh dear, everything is private. I'll have to set it differently.
 * Logo
 * It looks more like a pair of buttocks to me. I hate to say this and Lower the Tone. --EuropracBHIT 06:34, 18 March 2006 (UTC).
 * It's suitably irreverent (just like the token God Save the Queen to Betty at the opening ceremony) but perhaps just the regular Wikimedia logo with "Australia" underneath would do? --bainer (talk) 09:34, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Allow me to leap to the defence of buttocks. Buttocks have had a bad rap over the years, and it's time this stopped.  They are among the most beautiful body parts of all.  Body parts have had a long and colourful history, and most of us seem to quite enjoy the parts we have.  Having said that, all I saw in the logo was a stylised map of Australia in the form of a W.  I didn't see any buttocks, breasts or testicles.  If others see such things, good luck to them, I hope they enjoy it.  JackofOz 13:06, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
 * It's all terribly ... Freudian, isn't it? By the way I like Van Gogh's contribution to the logo. Does that mean we won't get business from British expatriates? That's what worries me.

Darren's is verry good, but the impact of that ad will wear off soon. Xtra 23:29, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Champion buttocks! This should be our official unofficial logo. pfctdayelise (translate?) 01:14, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Buttocks are not permitted by the Wikimedia visual identity guidelines. :) Angela. 05:50, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Melbourne Project

 * Project review and discussion
 * Any areas of Melbourne which are not covered.

Ideas for recruiting new members
Bayswater Secondary College, an outer eastern Government secondary college, for their VELS interdiscplinary work in years 9 and 10, are doing Melbourne: Diverse and Delightful Communities for Semester 1 and Future Melbourne: the next 100 years for Semester 2. We could contact Terry Walsh, the person in charge of the Interdisciplinary teaching. Here is the relevant page: --EuropracBHIT 05:37, 16 March 2006 (UTC).
 * U3As
 * High schools
 * Neighbourhood houses
 * TAFEs and universities

Future Meetups including social events

 * Where to eat after meetup?
 * Autumn BBQ?
 * Posting of a report and photographs of meetup.

Any other topics

 * Wikipedia as an authoritative source
 * Stable versions
 * The only subject I am really interested in discussing is how Wikipedia can be saved from the folly of its own structure - endless circular rewriting of articles, open access to cranks and vandals, no protection against the inevitable ruinous defamation suit which will come sooner or later, the pointlessness of an encyclopaedia which is never finished, never stable, never of guaranteed accuracy in any particular... etc. The rest is just deckchairs@Titanic.org Adam 07:04, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I think that's a bit unfair to Wikipedia, Wikipedians, and what we've achived. I know you've had cause to be seriously disillusioned with the Wikipedia in recent months, Adam. Speaking of cranks and vandals, what do you think about Mel Ettis and his literal interpretation of the no-link-spam rule? It is really affecting a project known as Librivox Librivox - free audio project! and lots of people are going there. Any Australian literature you would like recorded?
 * I would also like to talk about this issue; article decay really really drives me nuts. --Robert Merkel 06:33, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Category math feature
 * And any gaps in the spoken articles on Wikipedia? That Australians are uniquely qualified to fulfill? I notice that Peter McGinley is not coming, which is sad. --EuropracBHIT 08:44, 13 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Also we should discuss the other projects on which we are involved like Wikibooks and Wikiversity and Wikiquotes. The creation and expansion of Australian content. --EuropracBHIT 08:44, 13 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Can we talk about userboxes? They are some of the most controversial things on Wikipedia. --EuropracBHIT 08:47, 13 March 2006 (UTC).
 * I know nothing of any of the first three of those matters. I think userboxes are a harmless indulgence, although I do find them tiresome. But all this is trivial compared to the fundamental issue of what Wikipedia is supposed to be and how it is going to achieve whatever its objective is. After five years Wikipedia still does not have one single article which is of certifiable accuracy, completeness and reliability, and under its present structure it never will have. Adam 10:06, 13 March 2006 (UTC)
 * I can think of one. It's schizophrenia. --EuropracBHIT 07:57, 15 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Au contraire. Anyone could mess it up with their crackpot theory about schizophrenia or start a week-long edit war there at any moment. Adam 08:34, 15 March 2006 (UTC)


 * There is nothing wrong with fancruft when handled properly. Look at Memory Alpha for instance. I'm not afraid of a little meta-discussion. --EuropracBHIT 07:57, 15 March 2006 (UTC).


 * 2006 Commonwealth Games
 * Good suggestion. There's plenty of work to be done here. If anyone will be attending any events, please consider taking a camera along and getting some photos for the commons! --bainer (talk) 10:08, 17 March 2006 (UTC)
 * You're a legend, whoever suggested that. I have been to the badminton and have been to Southgate (lower level though!), so I took 25-30 photos. I don't know whether they're good enough for Wikipedia or the Commons. This was the 17th March, afternoon session - the pool games. --EuropracBHIT 10:44, 17 March 2006 (UTC).

Can I confirm that this meeting is happening tonight, Tuesday 21 March at 7pm, at the location at the VCA discussed above? Adam 02:01, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, the venue is booked and awaiting our arrival at 7pm tonight as described above. I will be coming from across town, so if I'm a bit late, feel free to go in and make yourself comfortable on the couches. See ya tonight! Mark Elliott 02:34, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Wrapup
The meetup was held as scheduled at the VCA Centre For Ideas Lounge: as finding things on a university goes, this one was relatively easy!

Those the meeting included *FIXME* (a couple of people missing off the list)...:

Angela, Tim Starling, Pde, Mark Elliott, Robert Merkel, Thebainer, Adam Carr, Canley, Bduke, Jitse Niesen, Cuddy Wifter, User:Pfctdayelise Roisterer

After people introduced themselves, a fairly free-ranging discussion was held on the listed agenda items.

Reliability/stability of Wikipedia
Adam Carr spoke about the perceived need for a reliable and stable encyclopedia source, sparking considerable amicable discussion. Key points included:


 * According to Tim, there's nothing in the pipeline from the developers in this area: if consensus formed around a proposal something could emerge fairly quickly though.
 * Getting consensus on any particular proposal is difficult now that the Wikipedia is so large. Bduke commented on this WRT Scientific peer review process.  Mark Elliott brought in some interesting points from his academic research on decision making in collaborative projects.
 * Suggestion that Melbourne-related articles might be a suitable venue where an experiment in some kind of stable versioning system could be tried. Some interest, but will see what happens!
 * Good idea. I'm for it. We've got so much development first, though! And be more specific in the proposal... EG. something about trains or institutions or the suburbs.
 * Other points from this discussion
 * Regarding Stable versions/WP 1.0, Adam's point was that a lot of maintenance is required after getting an article into a decent state to actually keep it there. Angela commented on the huge discussions that went into the main page redesign, an apparently minor undertaking. So the point was made that it can be better to do first, gain consensus later. ;) Obviously due to the POV forking restriction we couldn't do that within WP. But perhaps we could set up an external wiki (OK, not a wiki in the true sense of the word, but stay with me) as a test case and take all FAs at the point at which they became featured and freeze them on this external wiki. As many FAs are substantially written by only one or a few people (this is my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong), those people could be appointed as guardians of those articles. Then either: 1) any changes made to the article on the external wiki are submitted to a kind of moderation queue, the article guardian deciding whether or not to incorporate them or 2) the article is periodically compared to the latest WP version and the article guardian again incorporates the best of the WP changes. Also you could just nominate people in certain areas of expertise, esp. for natural sciences. pfctdayelise (translate?)
 * We discussed a bit about what the general perception of WP is compared to how we know it to be. ie. we know you can't always trust it, but Adam made the point that by calling ourselves an encyclopedia, we are assuming that authority, so we have a responsibility to back it up and actually have accurate articles. pfctdayelise (translate?)
 * But when people first hear about Wikipedia and find out that anybody can edit it, they must have some suspicions on its credibility. So they have the same state of knowledge as we do when it comes to trusting it. Or are they just looking at the encyclopedia part? --EuropracBHIT 03:14, 22 March 2006 (UTC).



Local Wikimedia chapter
Another free-ranging discussion:

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Australia/Meeting_2 --EuropracBHIT 01:45, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * One of the big attractions about forming a local chapter is tax-deductability of donations. Unfortunately, it's not that easy; apparently we don't fit the categories for charitable organizations.  Sending money to developing countries counts: the US is not a developing country...
 * I have three issues with this. 1. It isn't entirely true, as far as I am aware, we can send money overseas if we prove that it furthers our objects (which may be hard, we may need to consult a taxation lawyer on this one). 2. Not all chapters send money to the foundation (because of similar problems) 3. It isn't that big of an attraction, I feel that promoting the projects, bringing in more contributors is more important right now. - Cartman02au 10:16, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Spending money locally may be a possibility at some stage, on Wikimedia Foundation employees, for instance
 * However, a chapter might have other useful purposes; for one thing, it makes it easier to deal with organizations/companies.
 * What are you thinking of as far as organisations/companies? --EuropracBHIT 01:45, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * One thought floated - organization doesn't really need to be incorporated until it starts handling money; maybe we could set up first, worry about paperwork later.
 * Discussion to continue online (IRC??) about this.
 * Yes, we will discuss it around April sometime. See here:
 * As EuropracBHIT said :) - Cartman02au 10:16, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Angela made the point that we don't necessarily need a hard and fast goal to form WMA, as things are likely to come up that we couldn't anticipate anyway (eg. the collaboration b/n WM Germany and Directmedia, who distributed de.wp on CD and also donated 100,000 images to the Commons, old artworks). Someone also said that the easiest way to get tax-deductability-donation status is to lobby some politician directly to insert a small amendment somewhere specifically for us. :) I dunno about that. My feeling now is that we should make a flexible organisation with a minimum of commitment required from members, until some definite directions start to form. Maximum flexibility incase it is in our advantage to incorporate etc in the future. Re: domain names, apparently  .com.au is hard to get, but .asn.au (association) is quite easy. pfctdayelise (translate?) 03:08, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Agree about getting an .asn.au name, and also about lobbying the politician. What about Nick Minchin or someone? Or Barry Jones could help us. If every Wikipedian in Australia writes a letter to their local member it represents a 1000 or 10,000 people's interest in the matter concerned. I don't know what my local member thinks about Wikipedia or even if he knows about it. (For the record, my local member is Jason Wood in La Trobe electorate, and he was a police officer). As for the 'limited committment' thing, agree, agree, agree. You want to build a critical base, though... --EuropracBHIT 03:17, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * I think we need to get some form of direction. If other chapters are anything to go by, WMA will take off and we will need structure.
 * Thanks to my Melbournian friends who are keeping this on the radar. I believe that we are slowly getting there :) - Cartman02au 10:16, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
 * If we set up an incorporated association called the Melbourne Wikimeida Foundation (example only) I think it would be ridiculously easy apply (successfully!) for inclusion on the Register of Cultural Organisations which would allow tax deductible donations to be taken. If anyone's still seriously considering doing this, leave me a message and we can thrash something out. Sambo 13:19, 14 June 2006 (UTC) (not currently resident in Melbourne, but returning at year's end)

Melbourne coverage/Comm Games

 * Not many Wikipedians are mad keen Comm Games fans!
 * A few have attended events; it's damned hard to get good photos from the stands.
 * Yes, especially of things which move, and keeping the camera still. --EuropracBHIT 01:40, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Can we get photographers into the press pool (obviously not this time round, but in future)? Zane (what's your username?) mentioned that photographers are their own breed, and they may not be entirely keen to have amateurs in their domain.  Also issues with what terms press photographers get their access to events on; what restrictions on image use are there; some of the more law-oriented people rolled their eyes at this point :)
 * Do you mean the Melbourne Swimming Games in 2008, Robert? --EuropracBHIT 01:40, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * The press pits? :) Note: find out about how to gain official press accreditation for photographers to events like the Games, tennis, etc. Maybe we can bluff that someone is our official photographer (for wikinews?) if we have WMA to back us up. pfctdayelise (translate?)
 * Anything else on this topic

Food

 * Remarkable unanimity that food was a good idea, though some people had other committments (partners with morning sickness amongst them).
 * I hope the partner is feeling better for the moment. --EuropracBHIT 01:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Blue Train provided a venue for further interesting discussions of Dirk Hartog Island, Herschel Grynszpan, and undoubtedly a bunch of other things up the other end of the table.
 * Would love to hear other perspectives on this - on the other end of the table of course. Who sat where, by the way? --EuropracBHIT 01:37, 22 March 2006 (UTC).
 * Tim pointed out that more developers are needed. That's right, fix your own bugs! Learn PHP, submit bug fixes, gain trust of existing devs, get dev status and chicks! What could be easier?! (...But seriously: if you can, please recruit devs. my personal plea.) pfctdayelise (translate?)
 * Also briefly discussed the technical problems of vandalism and blocking bored schoolkids vs blocking WoW-style vandals. "Collateral damage" of blocking IPs (/ranges), ringing up school sysadmins to inform them that "your students have hacked into Wikipedia"... ;) (and the likelihood that they would even care) pfctdayelise (translate?)
 * You would be surprised at the response you would get from schools with regards to vandalism. I know the school I work at one day a week would take action about it - Cartman02au 10:19, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Page move
Should we move this to Meetup/Melbourne 2?

Oh, and I haven't got round to taking the photos off the camera yet, I'll do so this evening. --Robert Merkel 02:35, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, we should move it. And I hope the pictures are good too.