Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:1970 Colorado State Rams football team

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 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the discussion was: keep. Consensus is to keep as these are reasonable drafts; whether or not they will pass WP:NSEASON if moved to main is something to handle at AfD. &spades;PMC&spades; (talk) 20:17, 6 April 2019 (UTC)

Draft:1970 Colorado State Rams football team


Please note I am also including the following pages in this request: Rationale: AFC submissions resubmitted without any change whatsoever. left a rationale and in all of the above cases the submitter did not request guidance but resubmitted, which is a bit underhanded. Anyway, these are all patent WP:NSEASON failures, so further resubmissions are likely to be declined.  SITH   (talk)   15:55, 28 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Draft:1979–80 Wisconsin Badgers men's basketball team
 * Draft:1996 Penn Quakers football team
 * Draft:1996 Richmond Spiders football team
 * Draft:2002 Bethune–Cookman Wildcats football team
 * Draft:1970–71 Marquette Warriors men's basketball team
 * Draft:1980 McNeese State Cowboys football team
 * Draft:2009 Fordham Rams football team
 * Delete - The unregistered editor is being disruptive. Robert McClenon (talk) 04:58, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I do not see any disruptive behavior. To the contrary, this appears to be a new IP user making quality contributions on notable topics.  It is not surprising that the user isn't intimately familiar with AFC rules on resubmitting a draft.  Cbl62 (talk) 16:31, 31 March 2019 (UTC)


 * Comment User:StraussInTheHouse - I have put the MFD tag on the remaining drafts. Robert McClenon (talk) 05:04, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 1970 Colorado State. The 1970 Colorado State team is a clear WP:GNG pass.  Colorado State is a Division I FBS program, and its seasons are notable. Indeed, most of its seasons already have articles, and this draft fills one of the remaining holes. See Template:Colorado State Rams football navbox. This article should be promptly moved to main space.  I have added a few citations to the draft showing that it passes GNG. Each of the other articles should be dealt on its individual merits, rather than in a mass, bundled MfD. Cbl62 (talk) 12:16, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 1970-71 Marquette. The 1970-71 Marquette season is also a clear GNG keep. That team, coached by Al McGuire, was undefeated in the regular season, was ranked either #1 or #2 for the last two months of the season, and advanced to the NCAA tournament where it defeated Kentucky before ultimately losing. And McGuire was named college basketball coach of the year for the 1970-71 season. Cbl62 (talk) 12:22, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment - My advice is that if folks think these seasons meet GNG (and I don’t disagree), then do the work to add some prose/sources to prove it, as I did with 1979–80 Notre Dame Fighting Irish men's basketball team. I am not so inclined this time, though I think all of these seasons likely meet GNG. Rikster2 (talk) 15:36, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I have added prose and sources to Draft:1970 Colorado State Rams football team and Draft:1970–71 Marquette Warriors men's basketball team. Both should be promoted to main space and NOT deleted. Cbl62 (talk) 15:44, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * In addition to being a clear GNG pass, 1970-71 Marquette also passes WP:NSEASONS as "a season including a post-season appearance". Cbl62 (talk) 17:25, 31 March 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep 1970 Colorado State Rams football team and 1970–71 Marquette Warriors men's basketball team with Cb162’s added sources. Also, move to main space. Rikster2 (talk) 15:43, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep all, especially 1970 Colorado State Rams football team and 1970–71 Marquette Warriors men's basketball given Cbl62's expansion. The others are seasons for NCAA Division I football and basketball teams as well and are clearly notable. Jweiss11 (talk) 16:20, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 1980 McNeese. The 1980 McNeese team competed at the Division IA level, won its conference championship, and played in a bowl game. I have now added narrative text and sources demonstrating that it passes WP:GNG. McNeese also passes WP:NSEASONS as "a season including a post-season appearance". This article should now be moved to main space. Cbl62 (talk) 17:02, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 2009 Fordham. The 2009 Fordham team led by future NFL quarterback John Skelton led all Division I FCS programs in total offense, as Skelton led the FCS in passing and broke Fordham's career passing records. I have added some narrative and sources showing that the subject passes WP:GNG. The article should now be moved to main space. Cbl62 (talk) 19:29, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 2002 Bethune-Cookman. The 2002 Bethune Cookman team competed at the Division I level, won the MEAC championship and advanced to the NCAA Divsion IA playoffs. Passes WP:GNG with significant coverage in multiple, reliable, and independent sources. I have added a few such sources, plus narrative text, to the article, which is now ready to be moved to main space. Cbl62 (talk) 20:17, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep 1996 Penn. Penn is one of the all-time great historic football programs. The coach in 1996 was Al Bagnoli who ranks third among active college football coaches at all levels. See List of college football coaches with 200 wins. I have now added narrative text and sources showing that the 1996 team passes GNG. This article is now ready to be moved to main space. Cbl62 (talk) 21:37, 31 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep all, per improvements to the articles by Cbl62. These subjects all meet WP:GNG. Ejgreen77 (talk) 05:54, 1 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep all per above. It's this nomination that's disruptive. Smartyllama (talk) 18:21, 1 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep All. As stated above, the subjects are all notable; these are Division I sports seasons in the two most popular and well-covered college sports. If I were reviewing these I'd accept them as long as they didn't have other major issues. I feel like WP:NSEASON needs an update to reflect current consensus if it's being used to keep drafts of notable articles out of the mainspace and to accuse new users of being disruptive by writing about valid topics. TheCatalyst31 Reaction•Creation 00:59, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment and Move to Close Hello all! I want to remind you all that notability was not the concern here. The problem was not only a lack of WP:RS on most of these articles (which has thankfully taken care of), but also that Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate stats directory. Many of these articles in their current form just provide the schedule and the scores. We need more meat than that for it to better survive deletion discussions. Remember to assume good faith, as I did when I asked the user to add more sources and some of the information that many of you had provided. They did not do so, and instead kept resubmitting the draft with no changes. I am satisfied with 's additions, and have reached out to them on other topics, but I would be comfortable closing this discussion and moving the articles to mainspace. Bkissin (talk) 17:22, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Actually, notability was a stated concern, as the nom asserted "these are all patent WP:NSEASON failures, so further resubmissions are likely to be declined." Then, another editor accused the newbie IP of "disruptive" editing, i.e., did not assume good faith. In any event, I am pleased that there is now consensus that these articles pass WP:GNG and should now be moved to main space. Hopefully, the folks working at AFC now have a clearer understanding of notability standards as applied to Division I football/basketball seasons. Regards, Cbl62 (talk) 18:46, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
 * While I understand where you are coming from, I don't think that AfC editors are misunderstanding WP:NSEASON at all. We were simply looking at the following information from within that section:

"Team season articles should consist mainly of well-sourced prose, not just statistics and lists of players. Wikipedia is not a stats directory. It is strongly recommended that those articles be redirected to the team page if no sourced prose can be created."
 * Before your additions, there was perhaps one source on each of these articles, and no Well-Sourced prose. The issue of the sourcing has been addressed, which is barely enough for me to move these articles to mainspace. I would also suggest that if editors feel that AfC reviewers are shirking their duties or are not doing their work correctly, to join us as an AfC reviewer and help us bring down the 2600 article backlog. Bkissin (talk) 15:09, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.