Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:Serbia100/Squads

 __NOINDEX__
 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the discussion was  delete. OK, I have tried with this guy but in the light of further abuse of his talk page I've given up. I'll remerge the pages when I get home tonight. TerriersFan (talk) 16:32, 18 April 2012 (UTC)

User:Serbia100/Squads


Admin and user TerriersFan recently moved a WP:WEBHOST violation comprised of soccer team rosters to this subpage in response to an ANI discussion here, though there was no consensus to do so. The content was originally on the user's talk page.

The following is copied from the ANI thread to give a little background to this page: "To lay out the chronology here, Bwilkins deleted the content, then the user reverted Bwilkins on the same day. Then Drmies reverted it clean again and left them a personal message  (still on the 6th) and the editor reverted and put it back on their page 1.5 hours later .  A few days later, Bwilkins caught the revert and cleared the page yet again on the 10th of March  and blocked them for 48 hours.  This isn't the second time, this is the 4th time.  Three times in 4 days, and now here again in a 2nd ANI.  I'm not a fan of blocking, but this might be the right time to use the tools.   Dennis Brown    (talk)   (contrib)"

S Æ don talk 02:32, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment - I am trying to deal with a problem user who hasn't got the message on the use of his talk page. I moved his work in progress to a subpage as an alternative to immediate blocking. There are countless user subpages in various stages of work in progress. If this material remains on this subpage for longer than is reasonable for development then it can be deleted but I see no policy reason for immediate deletion. Better, I suggest, to try to educate him to become a constructive user. TerriersFan (talk) 02:43, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * It's obvious to me, though I could of course be wrong, that this page has nothing to do with the encyclopedia. This is solidified in my mind by the chronology above, as well as the fact that this user only has 2 or 3 edits outside of his talk page.  He has also never responded to any other editor's concerns about the material.  IMHO this user simply has good taste and recognizes that Wiki software is pretty awesome, but that's not what this particular Wiki is for unfortunately.   S Æ don talk  02:46, 18 April 2012 (UTC)


 * [ecx2] Delete. I knew this user name sounded familiar. I wish, Saedon, that you had dropped me a note. Anyway, I realy appreciate TerriersFan's softly, softly, approach, but I see no possible use for this. So they're rosters that might could be used, but essentially they're no different from the fantasy football things and reality show tables that we run into all the time. NOTWEBHOST obviously applies here. The editor is simply not listening and they've had ample opportunity to start learning what Wikipedia is. On the other hand, if this doesn't get deleted, good luck TF and congratulations. You are a better person than I am, probably. Drmies (talk) 02:47, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Interestingly I did leave Bwilkins a note a little more than a week ago but he for what ever reason didn't take any action and I wanted to avoid the

perception that I was admin shopping (you know how that goes), but you have my apologies. I'm actually really surprised that neither of you guys caught it! S Æ don talk 02:50, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * My watchlist has more entries than your list of edits, probably--both yours and Noformation's, haha. I liked that name, BTW--why'd you get rid of it? This wouldn't be admin shopping. I can only speak for myself, but if something happened over a week ago and I don't still feel it in my wallet or my pants I have forgotten about it. Drmies (talk) 03:10, 18 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Request clarification Could someone please point me to the specific part of WP:WEBHOST that applies? Quinn &#9617; RAIN 03:30, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * The first item. What we seem to have here is a user who composes lists of something (allegedly soccer clubs) without doing anything with it, without verification, in short without encyclopedic purpose, purely for themselves. Drmies (talk) 03:34, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * The first item is Personal Webpages. I don't see any personal info here.  It's not a resume'...it's not social networking (two of the examples given). This is an organized list of (mainly) existing articles.  I'd also point out that if the first item of WP:WEBHOST was taken to the literal extreme, then most user pages would be in violation. Generic (sarcastic) example:  "Hi, my name is So & So, welcome to my user page.  Here is a list of articles I am interested in and some pictures of my cats.  Look at all my neat Barnstars!" Quinn &#9617; RAIN  14:36, 18 April 2012 (UTC).
 * I think "Personal" in that situation means "For your own purposes" as opposed to "For the benefit of the encyclopedia". Achowat (talk) 14:50, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep: NK Rudar Velenje is the first team. Safet Jahič played for the team. These look like lists like they can be verified on pages like this one and that past rosters for the team likely exist.  I assume the lists could be used on something like NK Rudar Velenje 2009-10 season as they appear historical in nature.  If the user has abandoned their account, this would seem unlikely but they have not. --LauraHale (talk) 04:26, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Delete - User has been given ample opportunity to explain the purpose of the page, or develop it if it was for an article. They have chosen to not communicate in any way during two ANIs, this discussion, or on their talk page in spite of multiple warnings and at least one personal message left by Drmies.  They have reverted 4 times to re-add the material, even after a block, and have not participated at Wikipedia in any other meaningful way excepting to create and maintain this page.  All I can conclude is that the totality of the circumstances indicates that they are not WP:HERE to build an encyclopedia but instead to host a page of their design, in violation of the WP:WEBHOST policy.   Dennis Brown    (talk)   (contrib)  11:58, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Is response required to admin inquiries, otherwise you get punished? Not everyone is here to build an encyclopedia. Most are here to use it. Can we not take notes/keep lists on our user-space for our own research/reading purposes as long as it is not disruptive?  It's not like he was posting his resume' or hosting one of those stupid hide-and-seek games.  This was a list of articles in a category, formatted rather nicely, and wiki-linked.  Rather than disruptive, if I were a soccer fan, which I'm not, I would find the page informative Quinn &#9617; RAIN  14:18, 18 April 2012 (UTC).
 * We can not use Wikipedia servers for are own purposes. See WP:NOTWEBHOST. Achowat (talk) 14:48, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment - Quinn, it's only "nicely formatted" because it was moved to a subpage and most of the headers fell out. Imagine this on a talkpage and see how difficult it becomes to use said page. MSJapan (talk) 16:07, 18 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Delete - per above. Achowat (talk) 14:48, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Delete - WP:NOT. All of those rosters are at least a year old, and I don't think this user designed those tables for inclusion. Rather, I think the user is copy-pasting information from articles to his talk page (cross-namespace), not creating original content for contribution.  As a matter of fact, his very first entry for Rudar Velenje, Safet Jahič, no longer plays for that team, and hasn't since probably July of 2011.  Furthermore, Talk pages are not for "keeping notes"; they are for having discussions, which this user has never done with anyone.  So from what I can see, the user pops in every few weeks or so, pastes something in from an article to talk, and leaves again.  There is no creation of content, no interaction with the community, and most importantly, no editing of pages. To be more succinct, NOTWEB #2 states, "The focus of user pages should not be social networking, or amusement, but rather providing a foundation for effective collaboration," and the tail end of the NOTWEB section reads: "Many of the content restrictions listed above apply to your user page and user talk page as well. Your user page is not a personal homepage, nor is it a blog. More importantly, your user page is not yours. It is a part of Wikipedia, and exists to make collaboration among Wikipedians easier, not for self-promotion."  While this isn't self-promotion, the guideline is very clear that a user cannot use WP resources for something other than WP, and that appears to be exactly what is happening here. MSJapan (talk) 16:02, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment - On further inspection, I noticed that the "Current Squads" lists include players who have never played together on any team, must less for any Eastern European teams, such as Theo Walcott, Gareth Barry, and Eric Abidal. Note also Ailton and Douglão, who despite being both Brazilian, have never played in the same country together, but they're on Serbia100's roster.  This is clearly being used for some sort of fantasy league, and therefore most definitely needs to go. MSJapan (talk) 16:18, 18 April 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.