Wikipedia:New contributors' help page/Archive/2012/December

Locking an Article of my own
I need help in locking or preventing it by users which edit it without any knowledgeArbabraja (talk) 20:52, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
 * You cannot do this. See Protection policy and Ownership of articles.  You cannot lock down an article merely because you want to keep it from being changed from what you want it to say.  -- Jayron  32  00:56, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 2 =

= December 3 =

= December 4 =

Linking a new article to an existing one
Hi,

In a Wikipedia article there is mention of a company - which currently has no Wikipedia page. I want to create a page for that company and link it to the existing article.

Can you tell me how to do this.

Thanks

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Edgoenergy (talk • contribs) 12:27, 4 December 2012 (UTC)


 * If the company meets the requirements of Notability (organizations and companies) you can create an article, but please read WP:1st before you do so. In the new article the link to the existing article is achieved by putting the name of the existing article between double square brackets:  name of existing article  . - David Biddulph (talk) 12:43, 4 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Is the company notable by Wikipedia's standards? That is, specifically, has it been discussed in detail in multiple independent reliable sources - like newspapers, books, magazines or respectable news websites, not just press release sites or profile sites?


 * If so, begin by drafting the new article at WP:AFC.


 * If and when the new article is successfully accepted, you can add one or more Help:Links from the existing article to the new one. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 12:47, 4 December 2012 (UTC)


 * But before you attempt to create an article about Edgo Energy, please read WP:COI, WP:BFAQ and WP:BESTCOI.--ukexpat (talk) 14:35, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

TBM-3E
Would like to contrbute additional information on the the TBM-3E used by the USN during the Korean war. Is this possible ?DAVE LINDSTROM (talk) 22:24, 4 December 2012 (UTC)  (Personel involvement active duty USN ).


 * You are very welcome to contribute to Wikipedia, as is anybody. But information is required to be referenced to reliable published sources: see WP:Verifiability for why this is important. So if you add information which is only from your experience, and not from published sources, it is liable to be removed again. --ColinFine (talk) 11:17, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 5 =

References format
How would you like references to be formatted and cited on a wikipedia page? Is it MLA style? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.72.167.226 (talk) 14:06, 5 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Several styles are accepted here, including MLA and others. For further guidance, see WP:CITE. -- Orange Mike &#x007C;  Talk  14:32, 5 December 2012 (UTC)
 * MLA is certainly acceptable, but it's also acceptable to use Citation, APA style, The Chicago Manual of Style, Author-date referencing, Vancouver system, Bluebook and others. If there's anything approaching a "house style", it's probably the use of the template; but that's by no means obligatory or even recommended. We'll even take raw URLs (although they're frowned upon) as long as they're solid references that support the article's claims. You can find more about accepted citation styles at this page. Yunshui  雲 &zwj; 水  14:34, 5 December 2012 (UTC)


 * And for a beginner, try WP:Referencing for beginners.--ukexpat (talk) 14:50, 5 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 6 =

Delete a page
I need to delete a Wikipedia page that I have created Mona L&#39;abeille (talk) 03:13, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
 * This question has been answered on your talk page. The instructions for WP:AFD are tricky, though, so if you post "a good and valid reason to delete" (Tbhotch's words) here, another editor may set up the AFD page for you. -- John of Reading (talk) 07:32, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 7 =

= December 8 =

Marked for speedy deletion
My fisrt article has been marked for speedy deletion. Can some advise if my article is inappropriate for Wikipedia or how i should proceed. Fintan FC is the article name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by FintanFC (talk • contribs) 13:30, 8 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I can't look at the deleted article, because I am not an administrator, but the information User WWGB put on your talk page should help. The simple answer is that you did not include in the article enough references to independent reliable sources to establish that the club meets Wikipedia's criterion for notability. I would advise you:
 * Read the page that WWGB linked to in the box on your talk page
 * Research if in fact there are enough references to establish that the club is notable.
 * If so, either ask WWGB to userfy the deleted article for you, so that you can work on it; or if you realise that your first attempt was not appropriate for an article (perhaps because the tone was wrong), begin again in a user sandbox.
 * Good luck. --ColinFine (talk) 15:42, 8 December 2012 (UTC)

Odd display of Unicode character
In the article Approximation there is a section titled "Unicode". This demonstrates various combinations of approximation signs. The explanation of these signs incorporates the wavy equals sign with the plain equals sign. But the display on the page shows two similar, ordinary equals signs. I have tried editing this, and in the editing window, the sign is displayed correctly, but not in the saved page. I.e. Unicode U+2248 displays as a wavy equals in the editor, but as a plain equals on the saved page.

NichoEd (talk) 20:21, 8 December 2012 (UTC)


 * It works for me. I suspect that the font your browser has chosen substitutes one glyph for the other. I'm not sure what can be done about this. --ColinFine (talk) 00:40, 9 December 2012 (UTC)


 * It also works for me in all five tested browsers. Different fonts are used for saved pages and edit boxes so it's not that odd if some browsers have differences. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:21, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 9 =

= December 10 =

Multiple references to a source
When citing a variety of facts from a single source throughout an article, is it necessary to reference each fact with a separate footnote? Aonghasmac (talk) 14:41, 8 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Section header added --ColinFine (talk) 15:37, 8 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, it is, but by using named references you can minimise what you need to insert for the second and subsequent references. The first reference will look like &lt;ref name=refname>(content of the reference>&lt;/ref>, and each subsequent one will look like &lt;ref name=refname/>, where refname stands for whatever name you wish to give this source. See WP:Referencing for beginners for more information. --ColinFine (talk) 15:46, 8 December 2012 (UTC)


 * And see also WP:NAMEDREFS.--ukexpat (talk) 16:53, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

Add photos and PDF's
I have some nice photos of the artist and his art. How do I add photos and how do I add PDF articles? I do know how to use word press but this is my first Wikipedia article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jacquiello (talk • contribs) 07:42, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
 * See Help:Files and the pages linked from there for how to upload and use photos. You can't use pdf for an article; you would have to convert it to wikicode. —teb728 t c 08:29, 10 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Are you wanting to add to an existing Wikipedia article, or to start a new one? If you want to start a new one, please be aware that newcomers to Wikipedia often find it difficult to write an article that will be acceptable. Please read WP:Your first article carefully. --ColinFine (talk) 17:24, 10 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 11 =

Ph.D. Dissertation count as a legitimate source?
Hello,

I hope I'm posting the question to the right place.

I would like to know if a Ph.D. Dissertation is considered a valid form of citation. If yes, which citation template should I use? I have just put a few dissertations as my sources, and used the book template. If anyone has used a dissertation as a source in their article, let me know how you handled your case.

Thanks 80thstwebservices (talk) 19:43, 11 December 2012 (UTC)80thstwebservices


 * See the third bullet point of WP:SCHOLARSHIP for usability. Short answer: completed, publicly available Ph.D. ones can be used. As far as I know, though I stand to be corrected, there's no set citation format. Just be sure to give enough information to uniquely identify it and where to find it. Regards, TransporterMan  ( TALK ) 20:21, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 12 =

Could someone please upload a logo for me
I'm new here and unfortunatly don't qualify to upload a logo on Milpark Business School.

I would really appreciate it if someone could assist me in that — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bradmconlin (talk • contribs) 12:47, 12 December 2012 (UTC)


 * ✅, file at File:Milpark Business School logo.png and I have also added it to the article.--ukexpat (talk) 14:54, 12 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank You - Loving Wikipedia at the moment — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bradmconlin (talk • contribs) 07:55, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

References for Mark Valenti
Hello -- I have been asked to provide some references for the entry I created for 'Mark Valenti' - and I have the following list -- could you please help me?


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=CoMjAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA479&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=23


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=CUMOAQAAMAAJ&q=%22Mark+Valenti%22&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=17


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=QdRNAQAAIAAJ&q=%22Mark+Valenti%22&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=25


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=2VvWm6_QZFEC&pg=PR8&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=13


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=kzwEMV491x8C&pg=PA186&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=12#v=onepage&q=%22Mark%20Valenti%22&f=false


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=QoJ4jTghUPYC&pg=PA355&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=14#v=onepage&q=%22Mark%20Valenti%22&f=false


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=UtfUmXAjQJAC&pg=PA264&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=32#v=onepage&q=%22Mark%20Valenti%22&f=false


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=QM9XQwAACAAJ&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=3


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=tj6UYdwsTGEC&q=%22Mark+Valenti%22&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=37


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=uHxZAAAAMAAJ&q=%22Mark+Valenti%22&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=53


 * http://books.google.com/books?id=WxngAAAAMAAJ&q=%22Mark+Valenti%22&dq=%22Mark+Valenti%22&as_brr=0&ei=xevIUJ7NOojqUMnTgaAB&cd=62

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.26.133.64 (talk) 20:47, 12 December 2012 (UTC)
 * ✅. I have provided some answers/resources on your talk page. - MrX 18:22, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 13 =

= December 14 =

= December 15 =

= December 16 =

abt
who is Fiifi Assie-Nkansah — Preceding unsigned comment added by 196.201.35.37 (talk) 23:49, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia the free encyclopedia has nothing about a person of that name. You might want to try Google, Facebook, or MySpace. —teb728 t c 00:40, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 17 =

Jack mowing the lawn boosting on the roads
<>

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Xfbgc (talk • contribs) 05:47, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Do you have a question about using or editing Wikipedia? You seem to be here to promote a website - please note that Wikipedia does not allow advertising. -- John of Reading (talk) 09:23, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 18 =

shortining my name but keeping my same identity
When I first signed up to wikipeidia it asked me for a user name and like on most websiteds i didn't put too much thought into it. I have been editing quite allot, over 1500 edits so far, and i have a problem with my name. The name that i chose is Learned69. This comes across as arrogant and out of place with other regular names. I am sure that many users think who is this guy who thins that he more learned thanthe rest of us, I surely would, and I am certainly not.

However I do have a lengthy record of conrib. and this is usually a way for other users to see what my areas are and I don't want to lose this. I am also known in the circle of the areas that I write on, I recognize others and they recognize me. So it is very important that i keep my identity. I would like to change it to L69. In fact most users refer to me that way on talk pages. Is there any way to do it. Please notify me on my talk page Learned69 (talk) 01:07, 18 December 2012 (UTC)


 * You can request a change of name at WP:CHUS.--ukexpat (talk) 02:32, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 19 =

= December 20 =

Citing a YouTube Video
Having problems finding a source for a fact that I know to be true about a person, and so my edits are being reverted. Is it sufficient to cite a YouTube video, if the link I cite goes directly to the time stamp where the information is relayed?

For clarification, the fact in question is a (semi) famous person's middle name, and the YouTube video is of a TLC special featuring his birth where his parents actually say his middle name.

Please reply on my talk page Credoinspiritu (talk) 13:24, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


 * This relates to 19 Kids and Counting? In any event, see WP:YOUTUBE.--ukexpat (talk) 15:27, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I would add to this that the normal practice would be to cite the TV program (if that's what "a TLC special" is), not the YouTube video. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 16:48, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Lost a saved page I was working on
I was creating a new wiki page which I had saved numerous times I then shut the page thinking could come back to it later- I'm now not sure where it is. Is it deleted permanantly or will I be able to find it? If the latter then could you please tell me how. Cheers. Lfcbrfc (talk) 14:46, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Your contribution record says that the only thing that you've saved from your account is this question. - David Biddulph (talk) 14:49, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The above commnent is the only edit you have made with this account on this wiki. Just a few questions:
 * Was the work done with this account, or another one?
 * Was the work done on en.wikipedia or another wiki?
 * Are you sure you hit the "save page" button and not the "show preview" button?
 * If you did do the work here, and on the account you are using now, then it is quite possible that you didn't save your work, but instead merely used the "show preview", which does NOT save your work. This is a common mistake, and is likely what happened here.  If that is what happened, you're going to have to re do it.  But check first to make sure you didn't save it with another account or on another wiki.  -- Jayron  32  14:52, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 21 =

New article
I am preparing a new article on my user page. How can I give particular people access to it for editing purposes without yet submitting it for publication and opening it up to everyone?

JHFitzhugh (talk) 02:03, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I've moved your draft to User:JHFitzhugh/William Wyvill Fitzhugh IV. Your userpage should be where you tell us about J.H. Fitzhugh: what he or she is doing here, what skills you have, what strong opinions you have which might shape your edits, etc.
 * All parts of Wikipedia, even your drafts in your userspace, are subject to editing by others; this server space belongs to the Wikimedia Foundation, not to you. -- Orange Mike &#x007C;  Talk  02:19, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

=December 22=

Personal life
Name : naveen kumar areti s/o narayana areti. Lives in kamareddy,nizamabad district.andhra pradesh. India. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Naveenkumar areti (talk • contribs) 06:30, 22 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Why are you posting personal information about yourself on this help page? What do you want help on? --ColinFine (talk) 08:05, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

=December 23=

Dance Mom reality show
Is the Dance Mom a dancer or has she ever been one???

174.134.25.107 (talk) 02:48, 23 December 2012 (UTC) No sources just a question curious


 * I'm sorry, but this forum is to obtain help on how to edit or use Wikipedia. To ask for information like that, post it at Reference Desk, Entertainment section. I'd move your question there on your behalf, but it needs some fine tuning. Dance Moms is about a number of different mothers of dancers. Are you asking about just one of them, about all of them, or about the dance instructor Abby Lee Miller? Don't answer here, just make your question clearer when you post it at the Reference Desk. Regards, TransporterMan  ( TALK ) 16:07, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

Uploading images
im writing, because i want to be able to upload images to help Wikipedia out, I mainly focus on the small pages and contribute useful information and now i want to upload images and you guys are having none of it. I have received a message saying some rubbish about new users are not aloud to upload image. Well, i want to upload images. You always say you listen to your users but really your just strict bast**ds. So i want to be able to upload images. Sorry about the manner i have written this in but i am angry with your replys. Thank you for reading. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Boomage (talk • contribs) 19:01, 23 December 2012 (UTC)


 * It looks to me that your account was confirmed as of 18th December, so you should be able to upload images. Although, judging by what's on your talk page, you might want to be careful about it. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 19:57, 23 December 2012 (UTC)


 * A little attention to spelling and grammar would be a good idea too.--ukexpat (talk) 01:34, 24 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The edit where you requested confirmed rights was your 10th edit so you got autoconfirmed with that edit. As the reply to your request said, you are already autoconfirmed. PrimeHunter (talk) 03:02, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

=December 24=

Create new page about my organisation
Hi - I've started working at Care for the Wild International, a charity which has been around for nearly 30 years. I see from the guidelines that I'm not able to submit an article myself because I work for them. Can someone help me, so I know how to get this article on Wikipedia?

Thanks! Additionally for information, a search for Care for the Wild International on Wikipedia results in a note saying that a page with this name was removed a few years ago - I can't work out why that was, though, or whether it would impact on what I'm trying to do now.

Care for the Wild is also referred to within the article on the Tiger Temple, by the way.

Thank you

Careforthewild (talk) 14:59, 24 December 2012 (UTC)


 * You may make a request at Requested Articles. The previous page was removed because it was a copyright violation as a copy-and-paste from the organizations website. Your account, however, will probably be blocked due to the fact that your username violates our username policy, see WP:ROLE. You may make the article creation request once you have renamed your account or obtained a new account that is unique to you, individually, and does not refer to your organization. Regards, TransporterMan  ( TALK ) 15:59, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
 * To rename your account, see WP:CHU.— Vchimpanzee  ·  talk  ·  contributions  · 21:29, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 25 =

Moving a sandbox
I am new to Wikipedia, so I'm not sure of this is the right spot for this question. I have researched and cannot find the answer. I recently moved a new article from my sandbox to the regular space. It seemed to move OK, but there is this message at the top: "This sandbox is in the article namespace. Either move this page into your userspace, or remove the template."

I was pretty sure I did everything correctly in the move procedure, so I don't understand what this means or how to fix it.

Can someone help? Thanks.

K828 (talk) 23:46, 25 December 2012 (UTC)


 * You did the move correctly, but you did not remove the template from the top of it. I have now done so.
 * --ColinFine (talk) 00:24, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Thanks very much! — Preceding unsigned comment added by K828 (talk • contribs) 01:03, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 26 =

Removing "unreferenced" header
Hello everyone!

I've made the page PINKK-Pécsi_424, first without listing any reference, therefore I got a header saying, the article does not cite any source, and it was true at that time. However, later I listed the sources of information that I used when creating the page, so now I would like to know, how this header could be deleted? Thank you in advance. Emberpók (talk) 14:02, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

(could you please answer me on my Talk page? Thanks.)


 * Answer is given here, rather than on your talk page, so that other readers can see the answer (and if necessary improve on it). Now that you've added references, you can remove the "unreferenced" tag yourself. - David Biddulph (talk) 14:13, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 29 =

Using information from another website.
I am new as a contributor. I would like to use information on my community that I have found on their website, giving credit to the website. Can I do that? I thought you could use the material as long as you gave credit to its origin. Please clarify for me Wschultz (talk) 05:12, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * It depends what you are trying to do:
 * You can hardly ever copy material verbatim: it will nearly always be copyright, and often inappropriate in tone for an encyclopaedia
 * You may cite it as a reference for uncontroversial factual data about the subject, but you also need references to independent sources for any information which is evaluative or might be controversial, and you also need these in order to establish that the subject is notable in the first place.
 * You may include a link to the website in an "External links" section, but it is unlikely to be appropriate to have more than one link to it, except as references (above).
 * See the various articles I have linked to for more information, and also WP:Your first article. --ColinFine (talk) 09:07, 29 December 2012 (UTC)

moving a stub
Is it possible to move a stub to a personal sandbox or subpage for expansion? There's a title and picture but nothing else. Do I just create the article on existing page? Jamie LaDawn (talk) 15:31, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Just expand the stub at it's current location. NtheP (talk) 15:39, 29 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Re: Thank You — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jamie LaDawn (talk • contribs) 16:07, 29 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 30 =

Captcha
I am trying to add a link to an extant page but after clicking 'Save page' I seem to be repeatedly cycled back to the Captcha test. I have tried four or five times - am I missing something (no error message appears)? Keith Sayers (talk) 05:26, 30 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Special:AbuseLog/8014559 says you have tried to add the code
 * That's not how external links are formatted at Wikipedia. See External links and Help:Link. If you enter the wrong Captcha text then you are cycled back to a new Captcha with no error message. They can be hard to read. Maybe you haven't read them correctly yet. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:03, 31 December 2012 (UTC)
 * That's not how external links are formatted at Wikipedia. See External links and Help:Link. If you enter the wrong Captcha text then you are cycled back to a new Captcha with no error message. They can be hard to read. Maybe you haven't read them correctly yet. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:03, 31 December 2012 (UTC)

Troposphere
The Wikipedia entry for 'troposphere' contains this sentence in the 2nd paragraph:

"The word troposphere derives from the Greek: tropos for "turning" or "mixing," reflecting the fact that turbulent mixing plays an important role in the troposphere's structure and behavior."

My understanding of the origin of the Greek word 'tropos' is that it similar to the late Latin term 'tropicus' whose origin indicates a turning movement, but no mixing. The 1913 Century Dictionary online shows the origin of the English word 'tropic' from the late Latin (LL) 'tropicus', which meant 'of, or pertaining to the solstice'. It goes on to talk about the sun turning back towards the Northern Hemisphere after it reaches the Tropic of Capricorn on, or around December 21st each year. No mixing of any kind is implied. The Century Dictionary online can be found here. Look up the English word 'tropic' and read about its origins to see what I have talked about above.

I believe that the second half of the sentence I quoted above for the troposphere definition should have the implication of the mixing of atmospheric gases removed from it. The origin of the Greek word 'tropos' does not support this implication, in my opinion. Instead, the turning should be referenced as the turning of the Sun with a citation given. Is the Century Dictionary online reference for the word 'tropic' suitable as a credible citation? What of the fact that 'tropos' is Greek, but 'tropicus' is late Latin? Does anyone know of an authoritative citation for the Greek word 'tropos' other than the Oxford English dictionary, which is a for-pay citation? Please discuss, and help me with my first Wikipedia entry edit. Thank you. RobL777 (talk) 09:51, 30 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The best place to discuss a question like this is at Talk:Troposphere. However, a general reply is that if information in an article is unsourced, anybody may remove it (though it is often more constructive to discuss this on the talk page first). Any additional argumentation needed to get from what is in the source to what is stated in the Wikipedia article is original research or synthesis, and would mean that the information cannot be regarded as reliably sourced.
 * In this case, the meaning of tropicus in Latin and tropic in English are wholly beside the point, unless you can show by a reliable source that one or other of them was in Teisserenc de Bort's mind when he coined the word. A statement like that in Etymonline is more pertinent, though it does not fully answer your question. --ColinFine (talk) 11:14, 30 December 2012 (UTC)

= December 31 =

adding references
I am having trouble adding references to the article I am writing -- Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/Literary Society of Washington Heritager (talk) 21:01, 31 December 2012 (UTC) I can't link the footnotes to the referenced books -- I would like to cite the book and the page number. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Heritager (talk • contribs) 21:02, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I have added Reflist to indicate where to display the footnotes. See more at Help:Footnotes. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:13, 31 December 2012 (UTC)


 * And referencing for beginners.--ukexpat (talk) 02:31, 1 January 2013 (UTC)