Wikipedia:Peer review/Arthur Eve/archive2

Arthur Eve
This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because a previous PR was closed while I awaited receipt of an interlibrary loan source. The book just arrived this week. TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:51, 2 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Previous peer review

Brianboulton comments: I think the article looks more solid than it did at the last PR, but it still needs polishing. Here are some suggestions:- **First para: suggest add: "but was defeated in the following mayoral election" **Second para: suggest reword: "by the time of his retirement in 2003" **Second para final sentence: delete "also" since this does not follow from the earlier paragraph **There is more than "personal" information in this section – it covers his introduction to city politics. Could a more comprehensive title be found? **I have copyedited the beginning into the correct chronology **Dollar conversion looks better rounded to $80 **"...but he saw social issues with drugs in the parks and a lack of guidance for youth in the community." It's not a "but" clause since it doesn't contradict the first part of the sentence. Also "he saw social issues with drugs in the parks" is weaselly. Perhaps the whole sentence could be split and rewoked: "Eve's first job in Buffalo was in a Chevrolet plant.[6] While working there he became aware of drugs problems with local youths in the city's parks, and observed a lack of guidance for youth in the community." **"He surrendered his job to pursue a job in parks recreation, but learned that such jobs were doled out by political patronage to party loyalists." – "job", "job", "jobs" in rapid succession. Also "surrendered" is a bit dramatic. Suggest "He gave up his job to seek a post in parks recreation, but learned that such jobs were doled out by political patronage to party loyalists." **"...rising up as in insurgent" – far too dramatic and overwrought. Can this be expressed more moderately? My suggestion: "By 1958 he was blossoming as an independent activist within the party, pursuing minority rights, and was the only ward leader that was not part of the political establishment." **Constance wasn't "the former Constance Bowles" when they got married. Can you clarify that the date in parentheses is her birth date? **Give dates for Leecia's candidature as lt-gov. and as possible Senate replacement for Hillary. **Eve's educational qualifications should be given earlier, not tagged on after information about his chidren's careers.
 * Lead
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:58, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:58, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:58, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Personal
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 03:44, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 02:06, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Did you get that already?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 02:06, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 03:41, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 03:01, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 03:20, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:49, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 02:45, 9 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 02:01, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

More to come. Brianboulton (talk) 14:35, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

Second tranche: More **This section ought to start with a brief account of his election as an assemblyman. All we have at the moment is a short sentence buried in the previous section. **First sentence: "Eve fought against state construction union policies that disallowed minority participation in apprentice programs that led to high paying union jobs." This is very awkwardly phrased. I've tried to sort it out; this is my best effort: "Eve fought against union policies which disallowed minority participation in apprentice programs that led to high paying union jobs on state construction sites." **"He directly threatened then New York Governor Nelson Rockefeller..." You don't need either "directly" or "then" **"The resulting protests..." It's not clear who was protesting, or what the protest were "resulting" from. **I don't think "System" is part of SUNY's official name, so the word should not be capitalised. **POV formulation: "By 1988, he had distinguished himself enough to be a recipient of the Kennedy Center Distinguished Leadership in Arts-in-Education award." Simplify to: "In 1988 he received the Kennedy Center Distinguished Leadership in Arts-in-Education award." **I have copyedited third para to remove various problem phrasings. Can you say, however, what is meant by "accommodated" in this context? **"Believing that people with credibility within and without the prison were needed,..." I'm not clear what this phrase is saying. **"Farrakhan refused to attend,..." Refused to attend what?
 * Assemblyman 1967–79
 * Thanks.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:30, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:36, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:36, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:39, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:52, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * "...unable to attend college because of educational or financial circumstances." What "educational" circumstances are you suggesting here?
 * I am not too familiar with the details of the scholarship, but this is the language of the source.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:52, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The actual language of the source is "educational and financial circumstances". I have altered the text. I still don't really know what it means, but you're probably right in thinking it has something to do with scholarships. Brianboulton (talk) 18:08, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:07, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:07, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Fine now Brianboulton (talk) 18:08, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:11, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Fine now Brianboulton (talk) 18:08, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:13, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Clarified. Brianboulton (talk) 18:08, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Yet more to follow. Brianboulton (talk) 15:39, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Third tranche:- **"and" is an awkward conjunction in the first sentence. Personally I would turn the thing round and say: "On March 3, 1977, Buffalo's incumbent mayor Stanley Makowski announced he would not seek reelection in May; on the same day Eve announced his candidacy for the post" **To avoid repetition, start the second sentence: "Eve declared his intentons early..." etc **The rest of this sentence has another dodgy "and", a typo, and a confusing ending. **"He won the primary by a approximately 25,538–23,579 (37%–34%) margin..." What's "approximate" about that? **Another of those wrong "and" conjunction sentences: "Third-place primary finisher Leslie Foschio threatened to enter the general election and Griffin became the Conservative Party nominee." Apart from that, did Foschio follow through on his threat? If so, "threatened" should be replaced by "decided". That being so, the sentence would read better: "Griffin subsequently became the Conservative Party's nominee; third-placed primary finisher Leslie Foschio also decided to enter the general election." **"...who hoped to prevent a third Democrat from running in the general election..." Who was he hoping to prevent from running, and how was he proposing to prevent it? **Sort out the grammar: "Eve spurned Chairman Crangle's endorsement the endorsement caused him to be associated with the Crangle machine." **"That year the Democratic majority had fallen from 90–60 to 86–64, while the caucus' Assembly membership had grown from 15 to 16. This meant that for the first time the caucus had enough votes to withhold legislation, which brought about a shift in the balance of power." First, "fell" not "had fallen"; the words "for the first time" are probably unneccesary; "obstruct" rather than "withhold" legislation; "...which brought about a shift in the balance of power" is self-explanatory. So the passage could be shortened to: "That year the Democratic majority fell from 90–60 to 86–64, while the caucus' Assembly membership had grown from 15 to 16. This meant that the caucus had enough votes to obstruct legislation." **However, the passage seems out of place where it is. The first and last sentences of the first paragraph are connected and should be together. The bit in between seems to belong elsewhere. **Second paragraph: "vocal voice"??
 * 1977 mayoral campaign
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:43, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:47, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed. I believe.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:47, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I rearranged to make this clear.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:49, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I have rearranged, but I will have to research what happened with Foschio.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:53, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * How is it now?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 00:57, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 01:00, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The last two sentences of the section each need citations. As you have voting figures for the primary, it should be possible to quote the relevant figures for the general election.
 * Deputy Speaker 1979-2003
 * O.K.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:47, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I joined the two sentences together, but I do not know what to do with the remaining text and left it in that paragraph.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:50, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * It reads OK now. Brianboulton (talk) 21:54, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Is just voice O.K.?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:47, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Head spinning, got to take a break. Brianboulton (talk) 18:38, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Final comments **The following sentence appears in the middle of the second paragraph: "In 1984, Eve joined with James F. Notaro, the Liberal Party of New York chairman to create the "Coalition for a Better Buffalo", with the sole intention of identifying a candidate for the Democratic and Liberal party lines who could unseat Griffin." This sentence appears to be about the city poltics of Buffalo, regarding the mayoralty; the rest of the paragraph, before and after this sentence, is about state politics. This muddling of city and state affairs gives lack of coherence. What is the relevance of this sentence in a section headed "Deputy Speaker", which should be concentrating on Eve's rols in the state assembly?
 * Deputy Speaker section - continued
 * (added later): I see that the section is not, after all, about Eve's role as Deputy Speaker of the state assembly, but about all his various political activities after he acquired that office. Perhaps a broader section title is required?
 * I have renamed the section and assumes that this solves the problem above.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:55, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

**Third paragraph: "During his 1988 election campaign..." Need reminding: campaign for which office? **Third paragraph: "...over Gore and Michael Dukakis." Since Al Gore hasn't been mention since the lead, I don't think he should be suddenly reintroduced as just "Gore". **Final paragraph: I have copyedited this into some sort of shape. I wonder if this: "The holiday would have been the thirteenth state holiday" is important enough to be included? *Political themes: The section begins: "Eve is widely recognised as a champion of the American family ... " etc. The source for this seems to be a NYT report of a political beakfast in Eve's honour, arranged by feelow Democrats. So the "widely recognised" assertion is suspect. **I can't work out what the first sentence means. Check grammar? **It might also be a good idea to say who George D. Maziarz is. **I still find the terse statement "He became an evangelist" disconcerting, without any context or any previous indication in the article that he even had religious beliefs. The citation for this statement is a passing reference to the "Assemblyman-turned-evangelist", which is pretty meaningless. If he really did become an evengelical preacher, there will surely be some public record of his activities in this field, that would enable a context to be added. Otherwise, I think the statement should be taken out.
 * Changed to re-election.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:55, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I have linked Gore in its later year.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:56, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * If you want to remove it, I won't object.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:58, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, I've taken it out. Brianboulton (talk) 22:09, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I removed widely.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:02, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Retirement
 * Fixed.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:08, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Title added.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:09, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Above, I have it contextualized and you did not have a problem with the combined facts. I removed it in isolation at the bottom where I had forgotten to do so previously.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:12, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * It's OK now Brianboulton (talk) 22:09, 20 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think the final paragraph has got anything to do with Eve or his retirement and don't really see why it should be in the article.
 * I consider it to be a statement of his political influence.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 23:13, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Marginal, but...OK Brianboulton (talk) 22:09, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry to have been late with these final review comments, but hope yo find the helpful. Brianboulton (talk) 21:44, 19 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks so much.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTM) 22:56, 20 September 2009 (UTC)