Wikipedia:Peer review/Barry Cogan (footballer)/archive1

Barry Cogan (footballer)
This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because I think the article could reach Good Article status.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for July 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for July 2008.

Thanks, --Jimbo[online] 19:23, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

There are many minor grammatical/semantic issues I could comment on (but I had a late night last night and can't be too late to bed tonight), but it looks thoroughly referenced, and there are no obvious problems of Wiki-technique. Are there similar rules for U21 international teams as for senior teams, that only games against teams of the same status are regarded as caps? Kevin McE (talk) 22:35, 1 July 2008 (UTC)
 * No work tomorrow, so I might get those comments, and some proposals, done now, although Brian has raised many of the things I would have mentioned:
 * Intro: The FA Cup final did not take place in Millwall, and Millwall and not, I would suggest, so much bigger a team than his others as to merit that phrasing. Dates of transfers to previous clubs seems too detailed for an intro. He previously played for Millwall, for whom he played in the 2004 FA Cup Final, Barnet and Gillingham. Cogan had been with Grays Athletic on loan in March 2008, before signing for them in July 2008.
 * Career: If he previously played for Belvedere, it is odd to say that he started his career at Millwall (he was not pro at 15). Cogan joined Millwall from Dublin side Belvedere at the age of 15,[2] waiting four years, until 20 April 2004, before making his debut in a Championship game ...
 * If he was at Millwall 4 years before he played, what does it mean to say his time there spanned over three seasons? (How many more than three?) Why is the score in the UEFA cup worth mentioning if the FA Cup final result is not?
 * The construction of "time lasting" an amount of time seems odd. He was at Barnet for just one season before....  What is a "matchwinning goal"?  Are we certain that none of those matches were won by 2 or more goals?
 * Comma after 1st mention of Jepson, and ...Jarvis, who had left Gillingham...: pluperfect tense (but I agree with Brian in terms of tone).
 * Tautologous to say "away defeat at Watford": away defeat to Watford or 3-0 defeat at Watford.
 * That Jepson was Gills manager had already been mentioned: the date of Stimson's replacing him, or at least the month, would be illustrative.
 *  Gillingham released Cogan at the end of the 2007–08 season, after he made...; given what goes before, it is scarcely necessary to mention that he did not hold down a regular first team place.
 * announced that Cogan would sign for: conditional voice for historic future. Has he actually now signed for Grays? If so, this sentence needs updating, if not the lead is seriously erroneous.
 * If his only appearance for RoI U21s was against a "Madeira select", does that actually count as an U21 international appearance?
 * References  The link on footnote 14 does not give any details of him refusing a loan. Link on note 19 is entirely misdescribed
 * One paragraph would be fully sufficient for his time at any of the clubs.  Kevin McE (talk) 23:27, 4 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Most of these now done. Still not actually clear that the signing at Gray's is confirmed, although I have made that assumption.  Kevin McE (talk) 21:08, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Brianboulton comments:

This is a rather short article, presumably reflecting that Cogan's career is still in a relatively early stage. If his career should subsequently flourish, then the article could grow accordingly. At present, however, there's not a lot to say.

The prose, meanwhile, needs a lot of attention. Writing in single-sentence or near single-sentence paragraphs should be avoided. The following are specific style points that need attention:-


 * "…replacing Peter Sweeney in the 80th minute" and "signed his professional contract in November 2004" are two entirely separate events which require separate sentences, not connection by "and".
 * Separated sentances.


 * "…two UEFA cup appearances against Hungarian side Ferencvaros, losing 4-2 on aggregate" is not grammatical.


 * Fourth paragraph: wrong punctuation, typos, inappropriate non-encyclopedic language ("Jepson tipped Cogan to fill the void…", and "Championship outfit Wolves") written in football magazine style.


 * " …a bad string of results" should be "a string of bad results"
 * Done


 * Punctuation: full stop required after "…on loan in February 2008".
 * Done


 * "During which he scored five goals in thirteen Conference National matches." Is not a full sentence.
 * Reworded to "..., scoring five goals in thirteen Conference National matches."


 * The sentence beginning "Gillingham released Cogan…" requires re-punctuation.

I agree with the above comment that the referencing is thorough. However, the subject himself needs to develop before the article can.

Brianboulton (talk) 20:54, 4 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Comments from
 * Phrases such as "the Underhill side" are possibly a little journalistic. Someone not familiar with football would not know that Barnet play at Underhill, so Underhill needs to be linked or explained. Better still, rephrase to remove it, as it doesn't seem to add much value in the context it is used.
 * Changed to Barnet.
 * In the lead, the bit about "He left Millwall in 2006, spending a year with before joining..." doesn't seem to make sense. Should it be "spending a year with them" or something similar? --Jameboy (talk) 22:03, 12 July 2008 (UTC)
 * I accidentally left stray words behind when I edited the lead, meaning to leave it as it appears now in the article, and can be seen above as my proposal.