Wikipedia:Peer review/Cogan House Covered Bridge/archive1

===Cogan House Covered Bridge===


 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for May 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for May 2008.

This peer review discussion has been closed. I've asked for a peer review because I believe this article on a covered bridge that is on the National Register of Historic Places is nearly ready for FAC. While the article includes almost every bit of information I can find on the bridge itself, I am not sure on the level of detail, especially for the background. Should I include the name of the man who drive the wagon of timber when the bridge was being built (not in), how about the people who "cut the ribbon" after the rehab (in), or the names of the speakers then (not in). There are some photos I have not used in the article which are on Commons - thoughts on those would be great too. In fact, any comments from fresh sets of eyes would be useful and appreciated.

Thanks in advance, Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 15:59, 15 May 2008 (UTC) :Note: Because of its length, this peer review is not transcluded. It is still open and located at Peer review/Cogan House Covered Bridge/archive1.

Comments This is another example of your incredible work and detail on a very small bit of history and geography. It is an interesting read. My experience with Francis Bok leads me to say that the names of the driver, ribbon cutters and speakers should be left out. I personally favor having more detail, but wouldn't be surprised if someboday wants them out come FAC. I guess it depends on who is looking at it. I like the pic of the plaque, but don't know where it should go. That's all for now. More soon. Dincher (talk) 19:41, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

More comments I think a wikilink to township (Pennsylvania) would be good in the lead. Townships are different from state to state. A wikilink to grand jury doesn't make immeadiate sense. The article deals mainly with criminal stuff. Perhaps this could be tweaked. I will admit that I only scanned the grand jury article. Other than that it looks good and I think it's ready for FAC. Dincher (talk) 19:49, 15 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Reply Thanks very much for your kind words and comments. None of the politicians present at the ribbon cutting have articles here, though I suppose the state senator and state rep are notable. There was a flap at the NRHP WikiProject where someone removed a bunch of photos of similar plaques over copyright concerns, so I am hesitant to put the plaque photo in the article. I do wikilink it. I also debated using Image:Larrys Creek Covered Bridge.JPG, which is the lead photo for Larrys Creek and, I recently discovered, for Covered Bridge. While it is a pretty picture, I think the ones currently in the article add more to the reader's understanding about the bridge and its structure and surroundings. Links are one of those things I need to work on before FAC (perhaps add some, plus check for duplicates and overlinking). I will add the township link and remove grand jury's link. It seems that before county commissioners, the grand jury made such decisions. I also need to start articles for the two other covered bridges in the county and check out another Landis source I found. Thanks again, Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:10, 15 May 2008 (UTC)
 * PS I found the second paragraph of Grand jury to be useful and linked to that instead. Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 16:50, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes. I saw this. It is the perfect link. Dincher (talk) 00:08, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Comments Nice article, interesting read. Interesting that we can have such a detailed article in wikipedia. I like the table comparing various sources on bridge measurements, need to emulate that for Old Blenheim Bridge in NYS.

I fear i once contributed towards phrasing what is now "A major flood on 1 June 1889 washed out every other bridge on Larrys Creek, except for the Cogan House Covered Bridge. It was also one of the few bridges in Lycoming County to survive this flood." Every other ... except... now seems redundant. How about "A major flood on 1 June 1889 washed out every bridge on Larrys Creek, except for this one, and also washed out most others throughout Lycoming County." ? doncram (talk) 17:52, 16 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Reply Thanks very much for your kind words and comments. Landis was a resident of Cogan House Township and had talked with some of the people who helped build the bridge and others who had lived near it in its heyday, so his histories were quite valuable. Glad you like the table - I just got frustrated with the differing figures and so decided to put them all in the article. I can see your point but wonder what you think of this version: "The Cogan House Covered Bridge was the only one on Larrys Creek to survive a major flood on June 1, 1889, which also washed out most other bridges throughout Lycoming County." Thanks again, Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:29, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

Comments by Moni3 Otherwise an interesting article that reminds me too much of that awful book, but that's not the article's fault. --Moni3 (talk) 18:04, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Can you include the names of the bridge in the lead, specifically if people would be searching for them by the alternate names?
 * Done, there are also redirects to Cogan House Covered Bridge for all four names, as well as "Larry's Creek Covered Bridge" Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:34, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
 * As someone who knows nothing about bridges, it would be helpful to mention what makes a Burr arch truss bridge unique in the Background section.
 * Hopefully done, I am not an expert on bridges either Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:34, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Perhaps add some information about how impassable the river gets. I read it gets high in floods and impassable in bad weather, but can examples be given, because I look at the pic at the top and I think, they needed a ford for that? That looks like a ditch!
 * I added a note explaining how high the creek got here during the worst flood for whcih there was a stream gauge in place. There is a picture which shows the creek better - I could perhaps fit it in if that would help. Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:34, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
 * It might help to include the years the studies were made for the comparison table at the bottom. Done
 * It appears to be well-researched and an interesting article. I think some points could be moved to different sections for better flow. The location information at the end of Restoration I think should be placed at the top of everything. In the Construction section, can you mention that the bridge remained unpainted by 1981, otherwise describing the bridge as unpainted - I had to check the photo again to make sure my mind didn't create the red color. It's confusing.
 * Reply Thanks very much for your edit, comments and kind words (and sorry for the book reminder). I have tried to address all your points but am uncertain about having the location at the start of the name section (how I interpreted "at the top of everything"). I think it might work better at the start of the History section or its Background subsection. Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:34, 19 May 2008 (UTC)


 * It's ok if I make a suggestion, you try it and change it if you hate it. I think the location information is fine at the top of Names because it rather fits in to the surrounding area since the bridge is named for stuff nearby. But ultimately, it's your choice. --Moni3 (talk) 04:07, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, I think I will sleep on it for a few nights and see what I think then - thanks for pointing out the connection the surrounding area. Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 04:18, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Comments from
 * Current ref 7 gives the publisher in the link. The rest of your references give it outside the link. Consistentcy is your friend.
 * Fixed, thanks Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:03, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
 * What makes http://nationalbridges.com/nbi_record.php?StateCode=42&struct=417208078401120 a reliable source?
 * It is a user friendly and formatted scrape of the US government site, which is not user friendly or very formatted - here is the link for all the PA bridge data at the federal government site:
 * http://www.lostbridges.org/details.aspx?id=PA/38-41-02&loc=n Do they have persmission to publish these photos?
 * No permission stated on the web site so the note is gone.
 * What makes http://www.ohiobarns.com/covbri/pa/lyco/palycocb.html a reliable source?
 * The source is gone - it was backed up by several others, so I replaced it in one use and removed it from the table.
 * You said you were wanting FAC soon, and I just looked at sources like I would have at FAC. I did not look over the prose. 16:08, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much for your helpful comments! Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 20:03, 22 May 2008 (UTC)