Wikipedia:Peer review/Daisy (advertisement)/archive1

Daisy (advertisement)


This article was expanded by me, and is currently listed as a Good article. I seek comments to on what improvements needs to be made for a possible A class or FA nomination. I have already request WP:GOCE for a copy-edit. At 13,500 characters, it is relatively short, but is comprehensive in coverage for an 60 second advertisement that aired just once. Please see the ad (File:Daisy (1964).webm) before reading the article, and fell free to suggest anything possible.

Thanks Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 05:24, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Comments from Tim riley
Thank you for inviting me to take part in the peer review. First, addressing the point you raised on my user talk page, I don't think you should worry that the article is on the short side for a potential FA. There is no minimum word-count for an FA, and what matters is that the subject is comprehensively covered in as many words (and not more) as it takes to do so. This one seems about right to me: all the major points appear to be covered adequately, and there is no padding. The article is widely sourced, from what appear, at a glance, to be reliable sources. It all looks promising, I think. Some minor comments on the prose: That's all from me. I hope these few suggestions are helpful.  Tim riley  talk   09:46, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * As an Englishman and writer of BrE I am not expert in American usage, and it may be that "ad" for "advertisement" (passim) is acceptable in formal AmE, which it would not be, I think, in formal BrE. Others may have a more informed view of AmE usage in that regard.
 * I hope any issues in the prose related to American English would be fixed in the copy-edit. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Although he had high polling numbers throughout the campaign, he felt safe to use rhetorical techniques to ensure his victory – I don't see how the two halves of this sentence relate to each other. What had his polling numbers to do with his feeling safe? And why "although"?
 * Removed from the lead, and rephrased as "Despite his relatively high polling numbers, Johnson felt safe to use rhetorical techniques to ensure his victory." in the prose. Usually, when any candidate has high polling numbers, their campaign doesn't spent much on advertising. It was clear that Johnson would have won, even if he hadn't used such a controversial advertisement. Still, he felt safe to use it amid his high polling numbers. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Johnson's accomplishments in the office – it may be different in AmE, but in BrE the definite article would be omitted.
 * Although Johnson had high polling numbers throughout the campaign, he felt safe to use rhetorical techniques to ensure his victory – as above. And though there is no rule that says you can't repeat bits of the lead word-for-word in the main text of an FA I think it is quite unusual, and certainly not very stylish, to do so. Who wants to read exactly the same words twice?
 * I agree, and I removed it from the lead. Would take care in other articles too.... Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The DDB team consisted of Art Director Sid Myers, Producer Aaron Ehrlich, Senior Copywriter Stan Lee and Junior Copywriter Gene Case. – no doubt these luminaries had their job titles capitalised in the company's organisation charts, but there is no need to capitalise them in Wikipedia.
 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * With the only actor in the advertisement being a young girl, the Johnson campaign targeted a much older population. – I don't follow this. Do you mean the target audience was older than the girl? Hardly worth saying, if so, as she was years too young to vote.
 * I agree, and I removed. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * young children would be asleep, leaving their older parents watching the film – well, parents do tend to be older than any of their children
 * Well, yeah! Removed. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Fears of nuclear radiation were related by a young girl eating ice cream to the audience – not sure how one eats ice-cream to an audience: this sentence would be better rejigged as "Fears of nuclear radiation were related to the audience by a young girl eating ice cream"
 * Rephrased as suggested. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * notable instances of this ads usages include… – even if the missing possessive apostrophe is added this is rather convoluted. Something in plain English such as "notable uses of the ad include…" would be preferable, I think.
 * Rephrased as suggested. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Ref 28 looks a bit odd with its double-double quotation marks.
 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:15, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @ Thanks for your comments, which were really helpful. I have tried to address all of them. Any other grammatical error would most probably be resolved in the copy-edit. Thanks!  Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 10:19, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Comments from Szmenderowiecki

 * I haven't made FA/A-class reviews myself, and I'm not familiar with the topic to the point of making specific content recommendations, but I can pinpoint to some copyedit issues, and some other phrasings.
 * Lead:
 * Infobox: I suggest to give a more precise date of 7 September 1964
 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * by the incumbent president Lyndon B. Johnson's presidential campaign -> by the presidential campaign of Lyndon B. Johnson, the incumbent. (reason: no need to repeat "president" twice; making the sentence slightly less awkward)
 * Rephrased as "by the presidential campaign Lyndon B. Johnson". Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * it appeared on the nightly news and conversation programs various times and was replayed and analyzed by network news broadcasting agencies. -> several times, when (where?) it was replayed and analyzed by news broadcasting agencies.
 * Done (maybe) Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Even amid the criticism -> Despite the criticism
 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The "Daisy" commercial has been adopted and used by various other campaigns since. -> since then or ever since.
 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Background:
 * by Nikita Khrushchev, the Soviet premier -> by Nikita Khrushchev, the Soviet leader at the time (reason: PM of USSR was formally a high-ranking position but what mattered in the Soviet Union was who ruled the party, which coincidentially was also Khrushchov at the time. You can of course say "First Secretary of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union", but "Soviet leader" would be more concise and reflective of the position as #1 in USSR at the time).
 * Re-written as "by Nikita Khrushchev, the Soviet leader in 1964, who proclaimed ....". Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The principal work of Johnson's campaign was based on emphasizing Goldwater's extremism and the dangers of trusting him with the powers of the presidency. -> not sure if this sentence indirectly implies Goldwater was an extremist - a label we normally tend to avoid.
 * [[File:Confessions of a Republican (LBJ 1964 Presidential campaign commercial) VTR 4568-26.webm|thumb|right|"Confession of a Republican" advertisement]] I'd say that this sentence is not written as a factual statement, but it just reflects what the Johnson campaign actually did. Most of the Johnson ads were based on emphasizing Goldwater extremism. For instance, see "The Confession of a Republican" ad, which too was highly effective. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Johnson press secretary, stating "President [is] in a wonderful strategic position... - that usage of brackets is problematic. If you use them to integrate the quote, you must accord tenses, but apparently so would you need with the rest of the quote, or so I think. Some rewrite might be needed to get rid of the problem, probably integrating the first para of the letter.
 * I would appreciate if you could help me with this point, possibly suggesting the change in X to Y format.... Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Later, President Johnson provided financial resources to aid the electronic media campaign. He gave $3 million... From that sentence it would appear that Johnson had a large personal fortune (I'm not aware of it), as giving out $5M ($40M) today from your pocket is no small deal. The original says "Johnson agreed to devote considerable financial resources to an electronic media campaign—$3 million for local spots and another $1.7 million for network programs." -> use "agreed to devote", "authorized" or something to that tune, as it was probably party's/campaign's money.
 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The credit for the visual elements of the ad is disputed, as both Schwartz and the DDB team claim the credit. -> Both Schwartz and the DDB team claim the credit for the visual elements of the ad, though the true authorship is unclear.


 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Synopsis
 * The advertisement begins with a little girl (three-year-old Monique Corzilius) standing in a meadow (inNew York City's Highbridge Park), with chirping birds, picking the petals of a daisy while counting "one, two, three, four, five, seven, six, six, eight, nine". -> The advertisement begins with a little girl, who is standing in a meadow, picking petals of a daisy and counting (blah-blah-blah) while birds chirp in the background. (incorrect usage of participle that implies that birds were picking the petals)


 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * She skips some number and counts some twice. After various takes, it was decided that a miscount might be more appealing to the voters. -> Either mention how she counts in a quote or delete this sentence. I'd prefer to remove the quote and say "While counting, she skips a number and repeats "six" twice. It was decided that a miscount might be more appleaing to the voters.


 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * After she reaches "nine", she pauses - as if trying to remember the next number. -> use a comma instead of a dash.


 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Broadcast and impact
 * "Jesus Christ, what in the world happened?". -> no dot if we have the question mark


 * Corrected the typo. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Jack Valentia - special assistant to Johnson suggested -> Jack Valentia, special assistant to Johnson, suggested...


 * Done. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Thruston B. Morton, a Republican senator from Kentucky told the Senate on September 16 that the Democratic National Committee was putting "panic inspired falsehoods" on the television; -> wikilink Democratic National Committee; use dash in "panic-inspired"


 * Done, Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Ice-cream -> use plain small dash, not template one.
 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Political usage and aftermath
 * being shown, and was an important turning point in political and advertising history. -> no comma, the sentence has the same subject
 * Done Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * That's it from me. Szmenderowiecki (talk) 10:48, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @ I have tried to resolve most of your concerns, otherwise replied above. Thanks a lot for your review, which I really appreciate. This would be my first try at FAC...  Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 11:43, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * As for that sentence with the quote (Johnson press secretary, stating "President [is] in a wonderful strategic position...), I'd propose the following wording:
 * From:
 * In mid-June, John P. Roohe—the president of Americans for Democratic Action (ADA) wrote a letter to Bill Moyers—Johnson's press secretary, stating "President [is] in a wonderful strategic position. He can play the campaign with lofty statesmanship, ignoring the fact that Goldwater exists. At the next level, we can really run a savage assault: a billboard, e.g., can be devised reading 'Goldwater in 64—Hotwater in 65?' with a mushroom cloud in the background."
 * To:
 * In mid-June, John P. Roohe, president of Americans for Democratic Action (ADA), a progressive advocacy group, wrote a letter to Bill Moyers, Johnson's press secretary, which said that Johnson was in a "wonderful strategic position", suggesting that the President could "play the campaign with lofty statesmanship, ignoring the fact that Goldwater exists" and that "[at] the next level, [they could] really run a savage assault: a billboard, e.g., [could] be devised reading 'Goldwater in 64—Hotwater in 65?' with a mushroom cloud in the background." Szmenderowiecki (talk) 13:14, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @ Done. Thanks a lot for clarification. I hope that addressed all your concerns. Thanks!  Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 13:24, 28 August 2021 (UTC)

Comments from ExcellentWheatFarmer

 * So as the original GA Reviewer, I'll do my best to put down anything that I can suggest. I'm still a novice to copy-editing so please bear with.
 * Lede;
 * "Immediately after its broadcast, the ad was pulled off, but it appeared on the nightly news and conversation programs several times and it was replayed and analyzed by news broadcasting agencies." -> "Immediately after its initial broadcast, the ad was pulled from air. However, it continued to be replayed and analyzed several times by media such the nightly news, talk shows, and news broadcasting agencies." Alternatively, cut out mention of either news broadcasting agencies or the nightly altogether, given how similar both they both are.
 * Background of creation;
 * "A survey of public opinions in August showed that Johnson's accomplishments in the office would yield him only limited support in the campaign." -> "A survey of public opinion in August showed that Johnson's accomplishments in office would likely yield him only limited support in the campaign."
 * Broadcast and impact;
 * "Unlike previous popular political advertisements and various Goldwater ads, "Daisy" is entirely based upon striking imagery and sudden changes in visuals. With no musical theme included, the sense of realism is increased." -> "Unlike previous popular political advertisements and various Goldwater ads, "Daisy" is entirely based upon striking imagery and sudden changes in visuals, with the lack of music enhancing the sense of realism."
 * "Johnson's press secretary Bill Moyers remembers that the White House switchboard "lit up with calls protesting it [advertisement]"; President Johnson called him and asked, "Jesus Christ, what in the world happened?"" -> "According to Press Secretary Moyers, the White House switchboard "lit up with calls protesting it [the advertisement]"; President Johnson called him and asked, "Jesus Christ, what in the world happened?""
 * "The Johnson campaign was widely criticized for using the prospect of nuclear war, as well as for the implication that Goldwater would start one, to frighten the voters." -> "The Johnson campaign was widely criticized for trying to frighten the voters by implying that Goldwater would start a nuclear war."
 * "A few days later, the Johnson campaign released another advertisement, famously named "Ice-cream ad"." -> "A few days later, the Johnson campaign released another advertisement, famously named the "Ice-cream ad"."
 * That's it from me for now! ExcellentWheatFarmer (talk) 18:31, 28 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Thanks a lot for your suggestions. I have addressed all. Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 04:45, 29 August 2021 (UTC)

Comments from BuySomeApples
Thanks for inviting me to join this peer review!
 * Infobox;
 * John Schwartz is listed under "Media". Looking at the infobox template, the type of media should be "television". Schwartz should be listed as writer or producer (or he should share the agency credit with DDB.
 * Broadcast and impact;
 * "As the David and Bathsheba film was based on a biblical story, it was considered as a family film, and thus was believed to be appropriate for the advertisement and audience the Johnson campaign wanted to target." -> "As the David and Bathsheba film was based on a biblical story, it was considered as a family film, and thus was believed to be appropriate for the advertisement as its audience would be one the Johnson campaign wanted to target."
 * I'll take another look in a little while, but that's all I saw on a first sweep! BuySomeApples (talk) 18:53, 29 August 2021 (UTC)
 * @ Thanks a lot for these comments, I addressed both of them.  Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 04:14, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

Closing note

 * @ Thanks a lot for your suggestions. I have now nominated this article for FAC. Fell free to suggest there.  Kavyansh.Singh (talk) 02:18, 17 September 2021 (UTC)