Wikipedia:Peer review/Emmerson Boyce/archive1

Emmerson Boyce
This peer review discussion has been closed. My first real attempt at trying to significantly improve an article. I've spent a lot of time expanding and finding references for the article, and I thought I'd get a second opinion on how to improve it further. Ideally I'd love to expand it further so it can become a good article candidate, but I feel that I've exhausted most of the sources that I could find. J Mo 101 (talk) 16:52, 28 October 2010 (UTC)


 * Comments from Jappalang

Lede
 * "... but couldn't prevent the team from being relegated to the Championship."
 * Contractions should not be in an encyclopaedia. Furthermore, this clause is casting a hint of bias by making it seems that this one man has the ability to prevent a team from being relegated.  Case in point: football is more of a team game.
 * Done

Early life and career
 * "... where he still holds athletics records."
 * Five years from now would it hold? Ten?  Twenty?  Just the fact that he made records in the school will do.
 * Done


 * "From the age of twelve, Boyce attended the Luton School of Excellence, and eventually became an apprentice at Luton Town."
 * Unsourced
 * Fixed

Luton Town
 * Last sentences of first paragraph are unsourced.
 * Done - new source added


 * "Boyce was a key figure in the following season for Luton ..."
 * How was he a "key figure"?
 * It's sourced at the end of the sentence. If that's not sufficient then I'll remove it. J Mo 101 (talk) 17:01, 5 November 2010 (UTC)


 * "... after only managing a draw against Charlton Athletic."
 * Drop the inherent bias (with using "only" as an adjective) for a simpler neutral "... after drawing a match against Charlton Athletic."
 * Done

Crystal Palace
 * "He was a key player ..."
 * Again how was he a key player?
 * Done


 * "With only 12 months remaining ..."
 * Again "only" is redundant and problematic.
 * Fixed


 * "Not wanting to lose him for nothing the following summer, ..."
 * There are better and plainer ways to write this and link "free transfer"...
 * Done
 * The change to "Not wanting him to leave on a Bosman the following summer, ..." would be confusing to one who does not follow footie much... I suggest "Rather than letting Boyce leave for free at the end of his contract per the Bosman ruling, ..."  Jappalang (talk) 02:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that reads much better! J Mo 101 (talk) 18:45, 3 November 2010 (UTC)


 * "Palace eventually accepted ..."
 * "Eventually" is redundant.
 * Done

Wigan Athletic
 * "... for a initial fee ..."
 * "... for an initial fee ..."
 * Done


 * "... but was often utilised as a centre back."
 * "... but was often deployed as a centre back."
 * Done


 * All last sentences in this section are unsourced.
 * Done


 * "... three goals - the most ..."
 * Why is a hyphen used here?
 * Fixed - was meant to be a dash.

International career
 * "Boyce's Barbados-born parents made him eligible ..."
 * His parents pushed him to join Barbados national team, or is the origin of his parents the key factor in his eligibility for the national team?
 * Done

Style of play
 * "... often been described as ..."
 * "Often" would not be simply attributed to two newspaper reports.
 * Done added some more sources. Hopefully this is satisfactory now.

Outside football
 * What was the reason for a US organisation to choose him as an international ambassador? What were his thoughts about this role?
 * Done - expanded the section to give more details.

References
 * Please follow the MoS; all-capital letters are not compliant.
 * Fixed

Image
 * File:Emmerson Boyce - Wigan Athletic.jpg
 * Copy violation: John Dobson placed his image under a non-commercial license.
 * I didn't add the image, and I'm by no means an expert on this sort of thing, but doesn't the flickr source indicate that it can be used under the Creative Commons license? J Mo 101 (talk) 15:30, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
 * The Creative Commons license at Flickr carries a non-commercial clause, which is anathema to Wikipedia's aim to be an encyclopaedia of "free" content (the meaning of "free" is for any purpose, even commercial). Note that the initial license at Flickr might have been changed since the author of that photograph had a compatible license for File:CHELSEA (2) v (1) wigan.jpg in the past (the photograph at Flickr now carries the non-commercial clause).  Commons has a review process that validates the license; Wikipedia does not.  As such, there is no way we can be confident that the source of File:Emmerson Boyce - Wigan Athletic.jpg was ever released without a non-commercial clause.  Advice for those looking to upload appropriately licensed Flickr images, please upload to Commons.  Jappalang (talk) 02:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Yes, it does seem rather skimpy as a biography. Perhaps, a few years later that might be more sources to flesh out the man? Jappalang (talk) 03:14, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah hopefully more information will appear about him in due course. Thanks for your feedback! J Mo 101 (talk) 15:30, 2 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Issues with some of the sourcing used for the unsourced sections pointed out above. How is soccerbase.com supposed to vouch for his regular sitting on the substitute bench, and becoming a first team regular?  Jappalang (talk) 02:05, 3 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Put a more suitable reference next to the example you mentioned. I think everything else is sorted as well now unless I've missed something! J Mo 101 (talk) 17:10, 5 November 2010 (UTC)

It isn't easy to write a comprehensive article on a player like Boyce. He's had a reasonable career at the top level but isn't the type who grabs headlines or catches the eye. Despite having seen him play in the flesh a number of times, I'd be stretched to tell you more about his style of play other than being a right back who can play elsewhere in defence at a pinch.
 * Comments from Oldelpaso


 * Its worth mentioning the level he made his league debut and Palace debut at. For Palace this is in the lead, but all facts in the lead should appear in the body as well (WP:LEAD).
 * Sources appear to be mainly the BBC and Sky. Nothing wrong with using them of course, but it suggests there may well be more out there. If you haven't already, it may be worth looking for freely available material on Google News Archive Search, going through chronologically. For example, I quickly found a short piece about him filling in at left-back while at Palace.
 * Sections covering the latter half of his time at Luton and his time at Palace seem a little thin. User:Cliftonian is our resident Hatter, so it might be worth asking him if he has any suggestions.

Hope this helps. Oldelpaso (talk) 15:10, 16 November 2010 (UTC)