Wikipedia:Peer review/Evanescence (Evanescence album)/archive1

Evanescence (Evanescence album)
I've listed this article for peer review because…well, I think that it seems a little weird that they've got 6 songs certified GA, two failed album GA noms, and a delisted main page. I want to balance this out by starting with this album, which I hope I can get GA. I've looked over it before, and I thought it was in pretty good condition. Fixed what problems I could personally see myself, but I need to know what's next. Of their three albums, I think this one in the best condition and then The Open Door. Fallen is gonna be hard, but ah well. Anyway, I just don't want another crash and burn in GA nomination like my last one. :/

Thanks, DannyMusicEditor (talk) 22:36, 15 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I'll take a look at this article. I'm not as familiar with Evanescence as I am with other bands, but I have heard most of their big songs (I love "My Heart Is Broken"), so I think I'll be fine with this one. I'll try and get comments out by tomorrow. Famous Hobo (talk) 06:00, 17 November 2015 (UTC)

From a glance
That's it for now, I'm kind of on an off between classes and work, but I'll actually post a full review tonight. So fix some of that stuff for now, in the meantime. I'm looking forward to actually reading this article in-depth.
 * First thing's first, several dead links should be fixed if possible. Either find the new page they were moved to, or archive them. Also, refs 118, 119, and 120 are broken.
 * There seems to be a heavy reliance of quotes. It's not a bad thing per say, but too much might be infringing on copyright stuff. I check closer later. Also, maybe cut down on "in an interview with x", I've already seen it like three or four times.
 * Overall, the article seems well structured and includes all the necessities. That's good!
 * The charts section looks fine, but may I introduce you to the wonderful would of Albumchart and Singlechart?

''Note: I'll be skipping the lead for now, as its supposed to be just a summary of the article as a whole. When peer reviewing, I like to read all the sections of an article before reading the lead to make sure it properly summarizes the article. Another thing, I'll be posting comments for each section individually. Not sure why I do this, but it works for me. As always, this is just a peer review, so any comment I make that you disagree with, you can simply not fix it.''


 * I'll add the templates, but can you give me a good example of an article that has those templates so I have something to work with?  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 18:31, 22 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Y'know, nevermind. The charts are fine, and in the future I will use those, but I believe the current format is fine.

Background and writing

 * Amy Lee wrote that the band was in the process of writing new material for a new album proposed for release in 2010 Remove the "new" in front of material, redundant as it's already for a new album.
 * Lee further described the music on Evanescence as epic, dark, big, beautiful and desperate Isn't that something that should go in the composition section?
 * Lee called the record fun which according to her was a totally new thing for the band I think there are some quotation marks missing around fun and totally new.
 * There's an alarming amount of "Lee stated, mentioned, called, described" throughout the first section. It's understandable as the first section is basically all about Lee and her identity crisis, but a lot of those instances need to be rewritten. I'm unsure myself on how to fix those sentence openings, but just doing a Control-F search brought up 97 instances of "Lee" (granted, some were from bleeds, and others can't be avoided at all).
 * Just as a thought, the second paragraph may want to go first, because it discusses the tour back in 2006, and her crisis, which in my opinion, leads nicely into the writing process. However, that would require a decent sized copy edit, so think of that how you will.
 * she started spending a lot of time painting and appreciating other people's work, going to concerts and museums and listening to folk and indie music Maybe instead "she began painting and appreciating other people's works (which by the way, should be explained in more detail if possible), going to concerts and museums, and listening to folk and indie music (both need to be wikilinked)".
 * The writing process for the album started in 2009 when Lee wrote a song for the album Remove for the album, as it's already stated in the sentence that it's from said album. BTW, I'm assuming "the album" is Evanescence.
 * The last two quotes about the group combining to write songs is nice, but long and not needed. Just write something like "Unlike previous album's were the writing was primarily done by Lee, every band member helped to write the songs". Obviously not the most well written, but you get the idea. The reason I say get rid of the last two quotes is because they're redundant. The first restates what the beginning of the sentence stated, and the second just goes into slightly more detail about what's already been stated.


 * Agh, I knew that fourth one would be a problem here. I am also unsure of how to fix this and was aware that it may become an issue. I am unsure of what further details exist that would be pertinent to the article for suggestion number six, but I have modified it as requested.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 18:25, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

Recording and development

 * worked with the band on their second album The Open Door Remove "their second album", because it's redundant.
 * the band was on an experimental trip, trying different things and seeing what was right but when they tried to record the songs I think a comma is missing before the but.
 * The final part of the section, before the quote, is once again nice, but not necessary. From "During the recording, producer Nick Raskulinecz" onward, can be condensed into "Lee was appreciative of Raskulinecz's work, as he was able to answer her questions and determine the final release date".
 * ✅. I have modified the last sentence as you requested, but a little differently than what is written here. If you really think that yours is better, then by all means do so.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 17:52, 22 November 2015 (UTC)

Title and concept

 * Once again, the amount of quotes kind of goes overboard, and a lot of the time, the quotes are redundant. After the first sentence, the next few sentences can be condensed into "Lee explained the reasoning behind the title was that it was a collaborative effort, and her love for the band itself."
 * Should the mention of the 16 songs go here? This section is about the title and cover, so why is there mention of songs?

✅. I know I didn't condense it a much as you said, but I believe I covered it well, and if you would like further changes just give me a holler.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 19:25, 22 November 2015 (UTC)


 * Thank you very much for this! I will get to it when I can, but right, now, school is hammering me pretty hard along with all the other things I'm involved with, so it may take a couple of days before I can get to fixing this.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 23:03, 18 November 2015 (UTC)
 * No worries, take all the time you need. I'll continue to put in more comments.
 * So I'm going to be out of town until Monday, so I won't be able to continue this review until then (at least I gave you some comments to think about). Now, here comes the part where I plug my peer review request for List of number-one Billboard Rock Songs. Don't worry, it's nothing big, just a rather simple list with a lot of references. If you feel up to it, you might want to check it out. It'd be much appreciated.

Composition

 * Lee talked about the theme of the album saying that she was inspired by nature, "The ocean's been a theme. Brokenness has become a little bit of theme, without necessarily offering a solution." It might just be me, but that quote doesn't necessarily mean it's inspired by nature. That might be Original Research.
 * The theme about brokenness in the second paragraph was already mentioned in the previous paragraph.
 * Lee said that she wrote some songs on harp, including the ballads "Secret Door" and "My Heart Is Broken" Harps were already mentioned in the first paragraph, so find a way to combine the two.
 * The quote about MGMT in the third paragraph repeats what was already said in the previous sentence.
 * In Songs and lyrics, "My Heart Is Broken", is a ballad that was originally written with a harp in stead of a piano before the final recording includes repetition of the harps part.
 * Once again, this goes for the article as a whole, but the amount of quotes and "Lee said" parts is pretty alarming, and needs to be cut down big time before nominating it for GA. I'd give more advice about shortening quotes, but since there's so many, it's kind of hard to do so for each and every quote. Try this: First off, look to see if the quote repeats what's already been said. Second, try to condense the quote with ellipsis. Finally, if possible, just give a summary of what the quote said, instead of giving the entire quote.

✅ to the best of my ability.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 01:46, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Release and promotion

 * The first couple of sentences contain repeated information about the release date from the recording and development section.
 * In the second paragraph, it's nice to see that Evanescence was all over the place to promote the album, but a lot of it can be condensed into "Evanescence performed a number of the album's songs on various late night talk shows." Also, saying each song that was previewed can be a chore to read through, and isn't necessary.
 * Tour section is fine, moving on.
 * The song, which was written by Amy Lee, Terry Balsamo and Tim McCord, talks about freedom which is a constant theme on the whole album. The song was well received by fans, and by music critics who praised Amy Lee‍ '​s vocals. The writers aren't necessary, the songs theme seems to contradict what was said in the lyrics section, and how the song was received should be kept to reception section, if you want to keep it at all (none of the other singles have a reception sentence, so I wouldn't keep it). Same goes for the music video reception, this should be kept to the song article if possible.
 * Evanescence premiered the song live on MTV on August 8 during a special show called "MTV First: Evanescence", which was also the first performance of the song Isn't this a restatement of what was said in the first paragraph of the promotion section?

✅.  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 01:47, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Critical reception

 * The IGN review needs a ref
 * This one was just missing from the review box for some reason :P


 * The second Artistdirect review isn't actually a review, but an interview with praise thrown in. Might want to remove it, since it's already obvious the Artistdirect reviewer liked the album.
 * Never understood why it is, but PopMatters needs to be italicized in accordance with the PopMatters article.
 * If there was any part of the article that exemplifies the overuse of quotes, it would be this section. Granted, this can't really be avoided, but something that you should keep in the back of your mind when working on the other Evanescence articles.

Everything else

 * Alright, everything else looks good. And yes, the album chart section can be left like that, but by using Albumchart, it's less time consuming and requires less bytes of data to load in. Use Endgame as a reference for the future if you want.
 * In regards to the lead, it looks good, though if possible, replace the quote with a summary of why he wasn't a good fit.
 * Not required, but a song sample from the album wouldn't hurt.

Alright, that's all I could see. I'm still very worried about the quotes and "Lee said" moments, but even if half of those instances are either reworded or removed, and all other issues are fixed, then this article is ready to go. Famous Hobo (talk) 07:10, 27 November 2015 (UTC)


 * BEAUTIFUL! PR complete (pretty much)! Now I just need to find out how to close this thing...  danny music editor  ~talk to me!~ 01:59, 28 November 2015 (UTC)