Wikipedia:Peer review/Gilberto Silva/archive1

Gilberto Silva
The main area I imagine this article needs work on is the general prose of the career sections. If there's a paragraph link or a sentence which doesn't flow very well, please let me know which one. I've worked on and re-read the article so many times, it has lost virtually all meaning to me. I think that some fresh eyes could really improve it. If there's anything else which a biography/football article normally has, and this one is missing, please let me know what that is.

In general, I'd love as much criticism as possible on this article; I am willing to spend however long it takes to make it an absolute top-notch article. So please be ruthless, this is a chance to be as critical as you possibly can without worrying about offending the article's author in the slightest. I want to improve anything which would stop this article reaching FA status. Thanks, GilbertoSilvaFan 13:41, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Some comments:
 * Rather than saying 'he played over 160 games and scored over 10 goals' why not just say the exact number of games and goals.
 * I'd replace 'make ends meet' with something less colloquial and generally rewrite this sentence, maybe merging it with the previous one.
 * 'Water carrier' needs linking or explaining also the 'cement' sentence reads oddly - could you use 'establish' or something else instead.
 * If the information is available it would be good to know why having thought that he would never play football again he managed to make such a quick (and presumably full) recovery.
 * The 1st reference that I checked [28] does not support the sentence that you have put it against - 'whereas critics of Gilberto usually prefer attacking midfielders to defensive midfielders'. All this reference shows is that one person who doesn't like Gilberto does like Juninho more. The earlier part of the sentence needs a reference too.
 * 'While the case was never going to have negative repurcussions for Gilberto' - why not? implications of dodginess in transfer dealings could potentially have negative repercussions on a player.
 * 'As Arsenal and Brazil are both notoriously attack minded' - citation for this? Arsenal at the moment are probably most notorious for passing well and trying to walk the ball into the net, not for a particularly gung-ho attacking mentality.
 * 'Gilberto is considered a useful tool in the defending of long-ball oppositions.' - this is not good english and could do with a citation (unless 42 applies to this too)


 * Overall it is a good article but I'd be very tempted to check all the references really support the things they are next to, change the style so it is less less personal, more encyclopedic i.e. all the 'this was good, this was a disaster' stuff and try to get some references that are books not just websites. JMiall 18:59, 6 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Hi JMiall, thanks for all your comments. It's going to take me some time to address all your suggestions - so I'll get started straight away. The only thing I'm uncertain of now is this: how many book references do you think are needed in an article of this size? At the moment there are only two, but I'm pretty sure this isn't enough (especially as there are over forty web references). Guidelines which I've read have only ever said "include print references" - but never how many. What do you think?


 * Anyway - just that question for now. I'm sure that once I've implemented your suggestions, the article will be much better; so thank you!


 * All the best, GilbertoSilvaFan 21:21, 6 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't know how many you should put in, if you look at a lot of the other featured articles & candidates for youngish people then a lot of them actually have very few print references. In general though I'd suggest that most sport books are probably better researched than the average newspaper/website sports article which often seem to have a lot of speculation.
 * For someone who plays for Arsenal I'd suggest that there should be quite a lot of books around that you could look at. Arsene Wenger must have a biography or 2, Ashley Cole has one out at the moment, probably some more of the current or recent Arsenal players will have them too. There must also be yearbooks about recent Arsenal seasons. Any of these could be good sources for Gilberto Silva info. Try your local library! JMiall 23:55, 6 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Just a quick note to the peer reviewers: I've completed most of JMiall's suggestions - all that's left to do from his comments now is to make the article less 'sensationalist'. It's a difficult balance to try and write like I know Gilberto and yet try not to sound like I'm his fan. Also, I'm going to find some more book references by looking through a few Arsenal books for info. -GilbertoSilvaFan 11:20, 7 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Fix citation 48. For some reason, it is empty.--Yannismarou 20:08, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks Yannismarou; I've fixed it now. Good spot. -GilbertoSilvaFan 22:02, 15 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Please see automated peer review suggestions here. Thanks, Ruhrfisch 20:52, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your reply Ruhrfisch. I've gone through the suggestions the bot made, and ticked all the points which were flagged. If anyone wishes to see the ticked list, it's here. Some suggestions still come up when the article is automatically reviewed, but that's just the bot being crazy. Anyway; thanks! -GilbertoSilvaFan 23:07, 17 October 2006 (UTC) PS. good job with all those automated peer reviews, it gives a lot of good suggestions.


 * You are welcome and thanks for the kind words - I found it very helpful when I went through peer review and since AndyZ is on wikibreak, thought I would try to help out. Take care, Ruhrfisch 00:29, 18 October 2006 (UTC)