Wikipedia:Peer review/Joan Robinson Hill/archive1

Joan Robinson Hill
This peer review discussion has been closed. This article tells the story of the life and death of Houston socialite Joan Robinson Hill, a noted horsewoman whose death in 1969 remains unexplained to the present day. I've listed it for peer review because it covers the topic quite broadly and I think has potential to become a GA, but I'd like to know what else it might need to get it there. Thanks, This is Paul (talk) 12:53, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Comment from esprit15d
 * I've made some changes that aren't controversial just to help the cause along.
 * Note: This article was probably difficult to write since there are multiple people with the same last names. To help with this, Wikipedia policy is that people should be referred to by their last names.  When there are more than one person in an article with the same last name, use the first name in any paragraph where the last name alone would be ambiguous. (Reference WP:SAMESURNAME. For an example see the article White Stripes).  Since Joan's "last name" appears to be Robinson Hill, I would refer to her as that, except when talking about events prior to her marriage, where she should be referred to as Robinson or Joan.
 * As it stood, the first paragraph in the lede was confusing, since it seems like Joan got killed twice. Once I kind of figured out this referred to her husband, I began to wonder what his name actually was it hadn't been mentioned yet. Also, it's not immediately clear who the surgeon mentioned the lede is either. Characters are being mentioned without establishing who they are.
 * The pictures are awesome.
 * The history of Ash Robinson's education and how he met his wife in the "Equestrianism and marriage" section, while interesting, seems totally unrelated to the topic of the article. I would delete it, and start with "After finally settling in Houston..." You could possibly mention that he was an oilman, since its relevant to Joan's childhood.
 * The sentence that begins, "She was also married..." kind of came abruptly. You think it could be incorporated into the material more chronologically? Or, one could start a new paragraph there, that kind of addresses her marriage history.
 * In regards to the sentence that begins "Robinson Hill died on March 19, 1969, at..." "abrupt" isn't even the word. This is the defining event for the entire article, and it dropped in casually into the back half of a paragraph with no lead-in.  Perhaps her illness can be mentioned first, and any relevant events, and then the paragraph end with her death on March 19, 1969.

Unfortunately, I have to go, and cannot complete this peer review, but hopefully this was helpful up this point.--Esprit15d • talk • contribs 02:47, 26 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I quickly perused the article before leaving, and realized that much of the information in "Equestrianism and marriage" is expounded on again in later sections. The article should be reformatted to only cover main events briefly in the lede, and the in detail ONCE in the body. There is no need for multiple summaries, and multiple treatments of the same events.--Esprit15d • talk • contribs 02:51, 26 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the tweaks and the review. Some useful comments here, and I'll make a start on updating it. I'll also put it through the copyedit process in case I miss anything. This is Paul (talk) 20:35, 26 October 2014 (UTC)
 * After I left this article, I kept thinking about it, and something occurred to me. Joan personal notability comes from the fact that she was a renowned equestrian apparently.  However, you cannot be notable for things that happened TO YOU after you died.  Those events are notable in and of themselves.  So, for Wikipedia purposed, that means her articles should be set up like any other BIO article, and the events surrounding the subsequent murder trial should be broken off into a separate article.  I would recommend the following course of action:
 * Create a stub called "The death of Joan Robinson Hill" (or probably some other title.  I would check precedent on Wikipedia for naming ideas, or take the matter to an RfC).  Tag it.
 * Copy and paste all subheadings that don't deal with her actual life to that new article (pretty much everything from "John Hill" down.)
 * Tighten up the "Joan Hill Robinson" article. It is currently not maximized thematically or chronologically, and contains a little too much about her ancestry (or grandparents and parents). You can reintroduce a lot of the information from the other article back into "Joan Hill Robinson" but in a way that pertains more to her.  I would set the article up, and arrange everything into the following headings:
 * Early life (covering her parents, childhood, education, and everything up to I think her first two marriages)
 * Career (covering her training, ascent, awards, and major accomplishments)
 * Personal life (her marriage to John Hill: how they met, their wedding, major events that happened during their marriage, the nature of their marriage)
 * Death: This subheading should have the .  This section should thoroughly cover the verifiable information leading to her death, and then BRIEFLY cover the fallout and new legislation.  The new article should go into detail about all the grisly details of the resultant murders, trials, and conspiracies resulting from her death.
 * References
 * External links
 * Start setting up the new article.
 * I am willing to help with all of this as well. Let me know, and I would be happy to help.--Esprit15d • talk • contribs 12:40, 27 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks again, it would be great if you could help with this, as there seems to be a lot of work to do. I think splitting the article into two separate pieces is sensible, although a Death of Joan Robinson Hill article may still require some detail of her life. Maybe just who she was–i.e., a horsewoman and socialite with marital problems, as these were all factors in later parts of the case. Before making any major changes though, I'll drop a note at We hope's talk page, as the other editor who's made a significant contribution to this. Thanks again, and I look forward to working with you. This is Paul (talk) 16:41, 27 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Again, I wouldn't mind helping with this effort at all, I really cherish that cooperative spirit in fellow Wikipedians.--Esprit15d • talk • contribs 17:32, 27 October 2014 (UTC)