Wikipedia:Peer review/List of Texas hurricanes (1980–present)/archive1

List of Texas hurricanes (1980–present)
This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because I think it is almost getting to the status of either a good article or a Featured list, and I would like for suggestions to be made on how to make the article better and more refined before taking it to the next step. I've worked on all sections of the article at least a few times, but the focus sections in my opinion are likely to be 1987-1989, 2000-2004, and 2008-present. These are sections in my opinion that will need the most work, but please also provide comments for the rest of the article as well. Remember to provide constructive feedback.

Thanks, TheAustinMan (Talk 18:59, 5 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment - my biggest qualm is that the most damaging storms don't have the longest sections. Ike, Dolly (which caused over $1B in damage), Rita, Allison, Alicia, and Allen should all be longer and have detailed statistics, such as number of houses damaged or destroyed, people without power, crops destroyed, etc. --♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 16:58, 6 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I will look into that and provide more detail to notable storms. -- TheAustinMan (Talk 17:36, 6 July 2012 (UTC)
 * - finished the key storms you listed, and now have a noticeably larger share of the article than before. Cheers, TheAustinMan (Talk 02:24, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

Comments
 * Lede


 * Generally speaking, the first sentence of most articles and lists should explicitly define the subject (see List of Maryland hurricanes (1980–present) or List of North Carolina hurricanes (1980–1999). I'd recommend swapping the second paragraph in the introduction with the first, and then bold List of Texas hurricanes and if you want to, the year range.
 * Avoid statements like "According to the research conducted by...", because the research can't make explicit statements, but the researcher can. Thus, beginning the sentence with "According to David Roth of the National Weather Service,..." is perfectly fine.
 * One of your sources (http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/pdf/nws-nhc-6.pdf) defines how storms are rated the most "intense" (page 5), but I had no way of knowing that (learn something every day, I suppose.) If storms are rated by their intensity, you'll want to include how it is defined.
 * Wikipedia's article for wind speed is two words, and that seems to be the common usage. "Windspeeds" doesn't seem right, but I could be wrong.
 * Might want to wikilink "Category 4", especially since it's the first mention of the system in the article.


 * Timeline


 * There could possibly be something maybe wrong with the name of the section entitled "1990-1984". Happens to the best of us, man.
 * You wrote the first sentence of these timeline entries in present tense, which is fine, but for second sentence and beyond on many entries, it's an awkward transition each time you change from present to past tense. Some entries even begin with past tense. Whichever one you choose, be consistent. This is probably my major concern with the article as it is.
 * The spelling out of numbers seems inconsistent. Generally, one through nine are spelled out, but others are not. For a scientific article like this one, there will probably be plenty of exceptions, but things like "twenty-three tornadoes" should almost certainly be "23 tornadoes".
 * If cities are obviously located in Texas, or its been established that they're in the state (this will probably be the case most of the time in this article), including the ", Texas" in the wikilink seems redundant. Use a piped link, i.e. Tyler.
 * You might want to use Template:Inflation for some of these cost figures, but that's up to you.
 * You can remove a lot of phrases like "in total" and it won't change the meaning of the sentence.
 * There are many instances of wikilinking to articles that have already been linked to (i.e. South Padre Island, Corpus Christi, South Padre Island, United States Dollar), so you might want to go through and check for any redundant wikilinks.
 * There are a number of cool syntax things you can do with Template:Convert that might solve some of your problems here. For example:
 * Add adj=on to use the adjective form (50-mile stretch, 100 mile-per-hour winds, etc.)
 * To get "(1 inch (25 mm)-3 inches (76 mm)" you used 1 in-3 in, but it's probably better to go with 1 to(-) , which produces 1 to(-).
 * Any particular reason you used a

after four sections? I don't think anybody would mind if an image went into the next section a bit. I have a 24 in (zing!) monitor and don't see any issues with letting them carry over.
 * "in mid-June 1993" seems a bit redundant to me, since the date is at the beginning of the entry.
 * "communities" seems awkward in this context, since it can mean a lot of things. Buildings, towns, and settlements are more specific terms than "communities".
 * Louisiana/Texas border is probably better as Louisiana–Texas border, or even better, the border between Louisiana and Texas.


 * Positive notes

Runfellow (talk) 04:31, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Clearly you've done your research. There's a lot of information here. It's not always exciting, but at least it's clear.
 * Along those same lines, there's no jargon or junk writing here. Just the facts, ma'am always works for me.
 * I don't doubt that you can get this to Featured List status with a little work, but the main thing here is a consistent style. Get every section on the same page and you'll be in business.


 * - After some work with your comments, I have fixed what you've identified. I did a lot of work with your tense issue, but I think I may have left some past tense words in their, or my fixes from past to present may have left grammatical errors. I'll check back for that, but if you see any as well feel free to notify me here or on my talk page. -- TheAustinMan (Talk 13:31, 19 July 2012 (UTC)
 * There may be one or two tense issues left to iron out, but from the spot-check I did, it sounds much smoother. I'll leave any further comments for the article's talk page. Thanks for the brisket, clearly we Texans know each other well. Runfellow (talk) 14:21, 19 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Just one question relating to WP:MOSNUM... does 1 inch (25 mm) turn into one inch (25 mm)? -- TheAustinMan (Talk 15:57, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

The MOS doesn't address the issue specifically, but according to MOS:CONVERSIONS, "Converted values should use a level of precision similar to that of the source value, so the Moon is 380,000 kilometres (240,000 mi) from Earth, not (236,121 mi). However, small numbers may need to be converted to a greater level of precision where rounding would cause a significant distortion, so one mile (1.6 km), not one mile (2 km)." So even in the "proper" example they used, it is still "one" rather than "1". However, according to WP:ORDINAL: Of course, it also says that science-related articles should always use SI units primarily, but I'm not going to worry about that, especially considering the two other featured articles don't do that either.
 * "Comparable quantities should be all spelled out or all figures."
 * "Measurements, stock prices, and other quasi-continuous quantities are normally stated in figures, even when the value is a small positive integer"
 * "Do not use spelled-out numbers before symbols for units of measurement: write five minutes, 5 minutes, or 5 min, but not five min."

So that doesn't quite answer your question, I suppose. Basically, what I would do is come up with your own set of standards for the page (I would lean more towards using the numeral rather than spelling out), post them on the article's talk page, and use them consistently throughout the article. Runfellow (talk) 23:03, 19 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Hmm... I'm not finding a place where a measurement breaks the current page standard (numeral, unit). Is there any place that you're finding an inconsistency specifically? -- TheAustinMan (Talk 01:28, 20 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I think you should have a Dynamic list warning somewhere in there, or have "at least" instead of "approximately" in the first sentence, to reflect the inherent uncertainty.
 * "while November is the least active month with two total storms" - first, the numbering is inconsistent with earlier in the sentence, and surely December through May are less active.
 * You should mention Ike's damage/deaths in the lede.
 * Everywhere in the article needs better unit consistency. If the second unit is abbreviated, the first should be too. For example, it should be "75 mph (120 km/h)", same with ft (m) and in (mm).
 * "A peak of 20.20 inches (513 mm) of rain fell in Kingsville, and heavy rainfall is reported across South Texas." - the clauses should be switched. You should first indicate the heavy rainfall, followed by the peak.
 * How many tornadoes with Allen?
 * "one causes $250 million (1980 USD)" - the tornado caused the lottery?
 * You should indicate somewhere, via a note, that all damage totals are in their original year's USD (see here).
 * Is there any estimate for statewide damaged/destroyed houses for Allen?
 * "Rainfall peaks at 18.29 inches (465 mm) in Nederland, and other areas are inundated." - that implies Nederland was also flooded. Is that the case?
 * How did Danielle cause its deaths?
 * "Five died in the town of Shiner due to the flood" - you never mentioned flood before that point for that system.
 * "Heavy rain in downtown Hallettsville causes floods reaching a depth of 5 feet (1.5 m). " - is the rain overweight? Also, I think a comma is missing.
 * "Hurricane Norma produced up to 21 inches (530 mm) of rain near Dallas-Fort Worth which kills five after making landfall on the Pacific coast of Mexico" - what was the total? It just says "up to 21", but that could be anything from 0 to 21. Also, were the five deaths in Texas?
 * "Multiple tornadoes touched" - watch for tense consistency. The entire article should either be present or past tense.
 * "Damages from the remnant of Hurricane Norma totals up to 50 million (1983 USD)" - missing dollar sign? Or was that intentional?
 * "Tropical Storm Chris makes landfall near Sabine Pass. The storm causes wind damage to Port Arthur. There are no fatalities" - really bland writing. Try combining the three sentences. Perhaps you don't even need the last one, as you don't always mention when there are no fatalities.
 * "Hurricane Alicia makes landfall near Galveston as a category 3 hurricane causing $2.6 billion (1983 USD) in damage and 21 fatalities, along with an estimated 5,805 residential structures either heavily damaged or destroyed." - that could probably be split up, considering how significant the storm was. I recommend stopping the sentence after "cat. 3 hurricane".
 * "Rainfall totals of at least 7 inches (178 mm) are reported in Southeast Texas with a maximum of 9.5 inches (241 mm) of rain in Liberty." - why even include the "at least 7 inches"?
 * Alicia still seems pretty bland. Any power outages? Any notable buildings damaged? All of the meteorological stats just make the section seem like every other storm. The storm produced hurricane force winds in Houston, one of the largest cities in the country! Anything about oil refineries?
 * "The storm had an effect on the tourism industry as 4,000 people evacuated South Padre Island" - tense issues aside, most storms do have an affect on tourism, so perhaps mention the 4,000 evacuations in the previous sentence where you mention minimal damage (and nix the no deaths part).
 * "The remnants of Hurricane Tico from the Eastern Pacific cause rainfall over much of Texas with the heaviest amounts in North Texas where rainfall amounts of at least 7 inches (178 mm) are reported" - try rewriting, and get the exact rainfall total (and for other storms) from here.
 * page 20 - the remnants of Edouard contributed to heavy ranifall in Texas.

That's it for now, up to the end of 1984. ♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 14:18, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * - Well, at least for ▲that▲ part. Working on ▼that▼ part eventually. -- TheAustinMan (Talk 15:33, 21 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Anything for Juan? 10 inches of rain is a lot. Check the storm data, there might be more.
 * - Added some stuff.


 * "Bonnie kills three people in Texas and heavy rainfall causes street flooding. Texas receives 13 inches (330 mm) of rain and many areas picking up at least 10 inches (254 mm). Bonnie also causes four tornadoes in Texas" - poor writing. Just say the peak rainfall, deaths, and the four tornadoes in one sentence.
 * - Well, I made it into two sentences, but should be better now.


 * "An unnamed tropical depression" - aren't all TD's unnamed?
 * - correct.


 * You don't have to say when there is no damage, as with Newton.
 * - removed all other instances of no damage as well, except in some few special cases.


 * Damage from Paine? Check storm data. Ditto Roslyn.
 * - Did Roslyn... is there any specific "storm data" you're looking at? I haven't found any Paine-related damage.
 * Found the Storm Data, doesn't look like there was any Paine-related damage.


 * "Tropical Storm Beryl produces heavy rainfall over East Texas with some areas receiving 11.8 inches (299.7 mm) and causing some localized flash flooding" - you shouldn't use the "with... [gerund]" construction. "With" is not a conjunction.
 * - Made it two sentences.


 * More stuff needed for Gilbert. I'm beginning to wonder whether you used storm data at all. You should also mention its winds (Category 4), since you do so in the lede.
 * - Added stuff.


 * "Late-June 1989 – Tropical Storm Allison makes landfall in late June 1989 causing 11 deaths throughout the area" - you say late June 1989 twice, and you don't say what are you're talking about. Allison could also use more damage stats.
 * - Done with just the first part... will work on expansion later.
 * Finished with the expansion, added a tidbit.


 * "Hurricane Jerry affected the Galveston " - watch for tense consistency. Also, the three sentences in Jerry's section all start with "Jerry". Try switching it up.


 * "left small rainfall in Northern Texas" - try rewriting. I know it gets redundant with so many EPAC storms producing rainfall, but find a way to change it up without it being poorly-written.
 * - made it to "causes rainfall"


 * Check if Diana 90 affected Texas.
 * - Checked, and Diana did not.


 * "The remnants of Hurricane Lester which originated from the East Pacific cause rainfall in North Texas" - extra comma is needed.
 * - Well, I put two commas.


 * For Arlene, was there $55 million worth of beach erosion? That's what it sounds like.
 * - Fixed


 * "Tropical Storm Dean makes landfall early on July 31, 1995 " - you don't need the date since you already listed it.
 * - Fixed


 * "but the storm causes no injuries or deaths" - again, no need to say when things don't happen. Also, do you need to mention the 20 evacuated families? That's really minimal, and you don't go into that little detail for other storms.
 * - Removed the stuff


 * Josephine 96 affected Texas. So did Dolly, IIRC.
 * - Added them... check if they're all right.


 * "Serious inland flooding occurs in and around Val Verde Country and 13 people are killed" -poor sentence construction.
 * - Fixed


 * Frances needs more info, given $500 million is pretty high.
 * - Added more stuff


 * "In 1999, Hurricane Bret" - you don't need to say the year.
 * - Fixed


 * TD 7 99 tense consistency.
 * - Fixed


 * >"Tropical Depression Nine makes landfall near Sabine Pass, with maximum sustained winds of 30 mph (48 km/h)." - unit rounding (and is that even needed? you rarely mention other TD's landfall intensity)
 * - rounded the unit, left the intensity there in the meantime, may rm later.


 * Allison 01 tense consistency, "causes nearly constant flash flooding in the area" (what is that?), you should mention peak rainfall in that first sentence when you say "extreme amounts", dollar signs, and "Tropical Storm Allison causes 23 deaths in Texas alone." (why not just say "in the state"?)
 * - Fixed


 * Fix Fay 02 damage total, and add some more from the storm.
 * - Fixed, will expand later.


 * Grace 03 needs a source for the damage total.
 * Waiting for that NCDC at the moment.


 * Were rains from Marty 03 that heavy?
 * - Just made it so that it caused rainfall


 * Move the 2004 storms into 2000-2004
 * - Fixed


 * Rainfall was more than 1 inch from Javier. Again, use that HPC report to get rainfall totals for every storm listed.
 * - Javier is not listed.


 * "No severe impact from Ivan is reported in Texas." - either source it or get rid of it.
 * - Got rid of it.


 * "Tamaulipas state, Mexico" - you never say the "state" bit earlier in the article.
 * - Removed state as Tamulipas is fine on its own.


 * "bringing much-needed rainfall to parts of southern Texas which had been hit hard by drought conditions" - try rewriting, maybe "producing rainfall to drought-affected areas of southern Texas"
 * - Changed to your suggestion.


 * "In preparation of its landfall, a mass evacuation of portions of the Texas coast turned out to be the largest evacuation in United States history, with over 3 million evacuating inland" - try rewriting a bit so the emphasis is on the 3 million. It's a little clunky
 * - Revised it... tell me if its better.


 * "a million energy customers " - try "1 million"
 * - Fixed


 * "Rita causes as much as 10 inches (250 mm) of rain in East Texas" - again, get a total.
 * - Got it


 * How many deaths in Texas from Rita?
 * - 59


 * "11 deaths in Texas are attributed to the tropical storm" - don't start a sentence with a number... and any damage from Erin?
 * - Changed sentence, will fetch the damage total later as the NCDC site reporting it is down.


 * Edouard and Gustav 08 tense
 * - Fixed


 * Surely more info from Gustav
 * - Well, actually, there isn't much about Gustav in Texas... For the most part is was actually just more on beach erosion, which I added.


 * Find Ike damage total, and any estimates for number of houses damaged/destroyed? Power outages?
 * - Fixed Ike damage total, didn't find estimates for houses damaged, and already included number of energy customers losing power.


 * Did Lee or Arlene 11 affect Texas?
 * - And yes they did, added them. Check to see if they're all right.


 * The death table at the bottom needs to have that data included in each storm's section. Otherwise it's unsourced.
 * - Added all the stuff and revised some.

That's it for now. Lemme know when you're done with all of this. ♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 14:59, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Partially done... finished most of the minor errors, will get to expansion later. Not sure what you mean by "storm data"... are you looking at a specific data sheet or something? Also looking for other editions of that "STORM DATA" .pdf that you posted in the first part, I can't find any of them. TheAustinMan (Talk 16:38, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Nevermind about the storm data, JasonRees gave me the link. (Thanks JR!) -- TheAustinMan (Talk 18:57, 21 July 2012 (UTC)
 * - Done with all the comments you pointed out! Thanks for all the input. I'll analyze storm data for each storm as well.-- TheAustinMan (Talk 18:35, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

Further Comments

You've clearly done a lot of work here in the last few days, and the list is clearly improved. I thought I'd go over it one more time to see if anything else stood out.


 * Some tense issues


 * Tropical Depression Eight. I think since this covered a few days, it got awkward to write for you. You may want to list it under a date range rather than a specific day.
 * The first sentence of the Hurricane Norma section.
 * Hurricane Bret, "As it approached landfall" to "approaches".
 * "Five tornadoes were caused by Fay, one of which injured three people" to "Fay causes five tornadoes, one of which injures three people."


 * Compass points

According to the MOS on compass points, you can capitalize compass points if the regain has attained the status of a proper noun (i.e. North Texas), but but names like "Western Texas" and "Northern Texas" should either be "West Texas" or "western Texas" and "North Texas" or "northern texas". You'll want to go through the directional points and make sure you're talking about the correct area and using the correct terms. Some (but not all) examples include:
 * Since the proper noun North Texas generally extends from northeast Texas to Abilene, which wouldn't include Quanah, North Texas should be "northern Texas".
 * The same goes for Hurricane Raymond, "northern Texas".
 * High Island is in Southeast Texas, so capitalizing the region is fine.
 * It should be "middle Texas", since that region is not a proper noun (that I know of).


 * Possible subject-verb agreement issues


 * For Hurricane Norma, "damages" and "totals".
 * For Tropical Depression Eight, "paid losses" should be "total" since losses are plural.
 * For Hurricane Rosilyn, "remnants" produce, not "produces"
 * "damages from Bret totals to $15 million to "damages from Bret total $15 million,"
 * "Rainfalls associated with the remnants of Marty affects" to either "Rainfall associated with the remnants of Mary affects" or "Rainfalls associated with Marty affect"
 * For Emily, "Rainfall peaked at 5.20 in" to "Rainfall peaks at 5.2 in" Same for Javier


 * Other


 * I'm not sure, but uses of "totals to" doesn't seem right.
 * "Galveston lost power" to "Galveston loses power".
 * "causes tides up to 5 feet (1.5 m) above normal" to "causes tides to rise up to 5 feet (1.5 m) above normal"?
 * "29 tornadoes" would be "Twenty-nine tornadoes in this case, because the number begins the sentence.
 * "$400 million (1989)" to "$400 million" since you included the note at the top.
 * "Just four days after Hurricane Javier" to "Four days after Hurricane Javier"
 * Would it be necessary for you to change the article's class to "List-class", or would that be something someone else should do?

Bear with me; I know I'm being picky, but I'm certain that when you nominate it for FL, someone will point these out anyway, and it's better now then later. Great job so far. Runfellow (talk) 21:44, 22 July 2012 (UTC)


 * - Finished fixing all of the comments you provided. On your last comment, regarding whether it should be a list-class article, WikiProject Tropical Cyclones does not use list-class, since it doesn't really tell what the quality of the article really is. Instead list articles go through the same assessments as any other article, with the exception of featured list. TheAustinMan (Talk 22:40, 22 July 2012 (UTC)