Wikipedia:Peer review/Roekiah/archive1

Roekiah
This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because I would like to bring this to FAC and would like feedback regarding accessibility (obscure enough topic) and grammar.

Thanks, — Crisco 1492 (talk) 14:07, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Lead uses "recognised"; early life: "recognized" -> be consistent.  Taylor Trescott  - my talk + my edits 03:06, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Done, thanks. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 03:23, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

Cassianto

 * " to a Mohammad Ali and Ningsih" -- Why the singular?
 * Because I'm a d'ohlt? Removed. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Though she learned acting mainly from her parents," -- Mother or daughter?
 * Daughter. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "The trio went from group to group, constantly travelling" -- Do we need both when one will do? Group to group sounds repetitive IMO.
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Though the family did not want Roekiah to enter acting, Roekiah insisted." -- Why do we repeat her name?
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Roekiah refused to eat, and ultimately her parents relented." -- In protest right? Also, I think you could get away with a pronoun here.
 * How's this? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Looking good. --  Cassianto Talk   17:19, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * (traditional music with Portuguese influences.[8]) -- Should cite be on the outside of the closing parenthesis?
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "but also for her voice and on-stage talents." -- Singing was her on-stage talent wasn't it? Or was there more?
 * Right. Trimmed. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "...troupe; they married when she was seventeen. After their marriage, the couple took a month hiatus then joined the Faroka troupe in Singapore, ultimately leaving the troupe in 1936." -- Overburdened with the word "troupe" here.
 * Reworked. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 15:41, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Film career
 * "In 1937 Roekiah made her first film appearance as the leading lady in Albert Balink's Terang Boelan (Full Moon), starring alongside Rd Mochtar as two lovers who elope after one is almost forced to marry an opium smuggler..." -- Phew, that's one big sentence. I think this could benefit from a split after the film is given.  I suspect this would also cure the awkward noun plus-ing we currently have with "starring".  Also, It would be good to have an introduction to the film in terms of its genre; was it a comedy? drama? romance? etc. Based on the brief synopsis we have, I would hazard a guess at romance. Suggest: In 1937 Roekiah made her first film appearance as the leading lady in Albert Balink's Terang Boelan (Full Moon). She and her co-star Rd Mochtar played two lovers who elope after one is almost forced to marry an opium smuggler. Or something like that?
 * Definitely. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
 * "...echoed by the Indonesian film historian Misbach Yusa Biran credits Roekiah as the "dynamite" which led to this success." -- echoed by the Indonesian film historian Misbach Yusa Biran who credits Roekiah as the "dynamite" which led to this success?
 * Derp, done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I am always cautious of starting a new paragraph with "however", and see this as more of a "brace yourself for a twist in the story" conjunction than anything else.
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "kept silent, constantly musing as if she were mentally disturbed." -- this is in quotes, who said this?
 * W. Imong, author of the piece, though likely based on an interview with Kartolo. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "...which traveled to Singapore to popular acclaim" -- The trip recieved popular acclaim? Why would someone receive acclaim as a result of a journey?
 * Tour. Changed. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "After the tour was completed, much of the cast to switch to Tan's Film" -- will need looking at. I'm guessing at: "After the tour was completed, much of the cast switched to Tan's Film"?
 * D'oh. Got that. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "With Tan's, the Terang Boelan cast were utilised for the 1938 hit Fatima, starring Roekiah and Rd Mochtar. The film, in which Roekiah portrayed a young woman named Fatima..." Repetetive of "Fatima", suggest: " The film, in which Roekiah played the title role..."
 * Sure. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * When we give the critics responses, we use "wrote that" twice in quick succession. Could you think of an alternative for the second one?
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Following the film's success..." We have just spoken of this, can we take this as a given?
 * "The success of Roekiah–Rd Mochtar was soon followed by other attempts..." -- Successful attempts? If success follows, then whatever comes after it is also a success? It may be just a case of moving "success" to before attempts.
 * Not successful attempts. Reworked. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "In order to keep their new star..." -- New para, new name for Roekiah (and the company strictly speaking).
 * Have given Tan's the full name, but I don't think having Roekiah would work as we have "Roekiah and Kartolo" immediately afterwards.


 * "Kartolo would often have small, comedic, roles, and Roekiah would sing songs he had written...." I'm sure this is my fault, but just confirm that "he" is Kartolo and not a typo of "she"?
 * He is Kartolo. Roekiah doesn't seem to have written any songs. Changed to her husband — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Roekiah's last film with Rd Mochtar, Siti Akbari, was released later that year." -- We mention the year in the previous paragraph and I would prefer that it is also given here as it is a new para. What works for a name should work for a year as well.
 * K, done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "...but ultimately unable to return similar profits as Terang Boelan or Fatima." -- "...but was unable to return similar profits as Terang Boelan or Fatima."
 * Thought it was implied, but done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Japanese occupation and death[edit]
 * Repetition of "occupation" in the opening line. Also, I'm not sure the semi-colon is justified here when "which" could be used as an alternative conjunction: "Film production in the Indies declined after the Japanese occupation began in early 1942 which forced all but one studio to close."
 * "Japanese occupation..." We have a third "occupation" here, made less obvious with the deletion of the middle one.
 * Tried to rework
 * "without his wife" -- As this is a new section entirely, I would prefer her name is given here, with pronouns etc given after it.
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "After several years on hiatus..." -- "After a hiatus of several years..."
 * Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "...the Japanese insisted" -- Japanese who? Government, people, film industry?
 * Occupation government, military command... don't seem to have been many Japanese civilians in the Indies in 1942–45
 * "After several months of treatment, she died in Jakarta sometime..." -- We don't need to give "Jakarta" again so soon. City? Capital?
 * Removed altogether. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
 * "then-Minister of Education Ki Hajar Dewantara -- "the then-Minister of Education Ki Hajar Dewantara."
 * Done


 * Family
 * "Of her husband..." Good for a following sentence, but I'm not sure we can get away with having this as the start of a new paragraph, let alone a new section.
 * Alright, done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "...stating that the marriage brought them "great fortune".[i] During their marriage..." -- Two marriages so close together are not right, (ones bad enough! ;-)
 * Tell me about it. Always nice to just annul one. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
 * "After the Dutch..." Too informal, suggest: "After Denmark..."
 * Dutch military. Have tried linking to Indonesian National Revolution, though it may seem a little forced. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Legacy
 * Should "onscreen" have a hyphen?
 * Yes. Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

All done, very nice indeed. Not too detailed, yet just enough to understand the subject fully.  Cassianto Talk   17:45, 29 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Sadly that's all I could get (and more detail than everything I found so far!) No biographies have been written on her, and what's online now is mostly under 600 words. Thanks for the review! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 00:49, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

SchroCat
A few suggestions below: feel free to adopt or ignore as you see fit. I've made some additional ces while I went along: feel free to rv anything you don't like or agree with.

Lead
 * "Owing to these films" feels wrong: perhaps "Through these films"?
 * Good word. Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:42, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Early life
 * "studied the trade": is acting a trade? "Craft", maybe?
 * Agree. Done. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:42, 30 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "furtively" Not sure this is needed (or that it's encyclopaedic)
 * Trimmed to be safe (though I intended this to prepare readers for Roekiah's father's reaction). — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:42, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Partnership with Rd Mochtar
 * "The success of Roekiah–Rd Mochtar was soon followed by other at romantic pairing from other studios.": Not sure what this is saying...
 * D'oh, I mangled it. Fixed? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:42, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

A nice read, and I love the fact that we appear to have the most complete online resource about the lady - and that includes the Indonesian Wiki too! I'll have a second read through in a day or so too. - SchroCat (talk) 07:42, 30 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks! It's very rare to find detailed information on non-political figures from that period, so I'm quite glad we got this much. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 08:51, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Just one more from me (and a couple of minor copy edits done)...

Family
 * "dabbled in music": is this encyclopaedic enough?
 * Went with a more standard phrasing. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:59, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

Cheers – SchroCat (talk) 09:57, 2 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks a lot! — Crisco 1492 (talk) 09:59, 2 January 2014 (UTC)