Wikipedia:Peer review/Sum 41/archive1

===Sum 41===


 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for October 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for October 2008.

This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because i've braught the article from a c class to a Good article, and want to know how well the article is.

Thanks, - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 00:43, 12 October 2008 (UTC) :Note: Because of its length, this peer review is not transcluded. It is still open and located at Peer review/Sum 41/archive1.

Comments from
 * Manual of Style-related concerns
 * "They were nominated for "Best Group" in the Juno Awards of 2002, but again lost to Nickelback." Remove the comma before but.
 * ✅- -The Spooky One (talk to me) 21:12, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "Also in 2002, The album 'All Killer No Filler' was nominated for 'Best Album', however, it lost to The Look of Love by Diana Krall." Italicize All Killer No Filler and change the comma before however to a semi-colon.
 * ✅- -The Spooky One (talk to me) 21:12, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "In 2005, the album 'Chuck' won 'Rock Album of the Year', they were also nominated for 'Group of The Year', but lost to Billy Talent." Italicize Chuck and change the comma after Rock Album of the Year to a semi-colon.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me)


 * "3" in the third paragraph of the lead should be written out. ("3 different Canadian Independent Music Awards...")
 * You use a semi-colon to separate an independent clause and a dependent clause; semi-colons should only separate independent clauses. ("The album was fueled by the single "Fat Lip", Sum 41's most successful single to date; reaching #1 on the Billboard Modern Rock chart.") Perhaps re-write as "The album was fueled by the single 'Fat Lip', which reached the top position on the Billboard Modern Rock chart, making it the band's most successful single."
 * In the section "Dave's departure", you should probably use a semi-colon instead of a comma. ("The album was nominated for a Juno Award, for "Rock Album of the Year", however, it lost to Finger Eleven's Them vs. You vs. Me." should be "The album was nominated for a Juno Award, for "Rock Album of the Year"; however, it lost to Finger Eleven's Them vs. You vs. Me.")
 * The use of "#1" for charting positions. It should be written out: "number-one".
 * Shouldn't "41" in the first paragraph ("or 41 days into the summer") be written out?
 * "Music videos" in the fourth paragraph shouldn't be capitalized.
 * In the "Awards" section, "7" should be written out ("Sum 41 has been nominated for 7 Juno Awards...") unless the awards are called "7 Juno Awards".
 * In the "Other projects" section, "9" ("9 projects...") should be written out.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 01:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


 * There should be a hyphen between "anti" and "punk" in the "Other projects section".


 * Citations and footnotes (newest concerns on top)
 * Per Wiki's rules concerning quotations, the "Chuck and the Congo" section needs a citation for the direct quotations, as do all direct quotations in the article.
 * ✅ added. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 03:57, 24 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "Deryck confirmed Dave's departure and announced that the band would only be replacing Dave with a touring guitarist, who would not be in videos, photo shoots, albums, or have any decision-making power in the band." This sentence does not have a citation, but if citation 22 applies to this sentence, you can just move it from after "..addressing Dave's departure" to after that sentence.
 * ✅ Fixed. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 03:57, 24 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "The band's early musical style is often compared to Blink-182 and Green Day, owing to the catchy melodies and humor present in the work of both bands." The citation doesn't explicitly state that, nor does it compare the band to Blink-182 or Green Day.
 * ✅Removed. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 03:16, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The line "a simplistic video of the band playing in a classic garage band theme" needs a citation, at least for the adjectives.
 * ✅Reworded to better explain. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The second and third paragraphs in the "Side projects and collaborations" could use some citations.
 * ✅ Added a bunch of references to that entire section. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 06:29, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Among your citations is ; you should probably link to the specific articles.
 * ✅ That is the summary page, which lists the "influences" at the bottom, which is what the source is used for. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * There are no citations/footnotes in the second paragraph of the "Beginnings and Half Hour of Power" section.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 01:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


 * What makes the following reliable sources?
 * 
 * ✅Removed


 * 
 * (It's not released by an official source or anything like that.)
 * ✅ Removed


 * In the section "Music style and influences", a paragraph says "In the song "Fat Lip", the quote "Maiden and Priest were the gods that we praised" refers to Iron Maiden and Judas Priest.[33]" The citation links to a lyrics site which doesn't explicitly say that Iron Maiden and Judas Priest are the subject of the song. Sure, it's very likely that Sum 41 was referring to those artists; however, if not explicitly stated in the source, such a statement would likely constitute original research.
 * ✅Removed. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 04:02, 24 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Other (newest concerns on top)
 * "Controversy arose over some of the videos, due to the violent nature of them." -> "Controversy arose over some of the videos' violent content."
 * "They also did a series of cartoons..." "Did" is kind of informal, maybe replace with "created"?
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 04:02, 24 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "The band carried a video camera with them to film their antics including robbing a pizza place with water guns and performing a dance to 'Makes No Difference' in front of a theater, both of which can be seen on both the Introduction to Destruction DVD and on the DVD Cross The T's and Gouge Your I's from Does This Look Infected?." -> "The Introduction to Destruction and Cross the T's and Gouge Your I's DVDs both contained self-recorded footage of the band's antics, among which were robbing a pizza place with water guns and performing a dance to 'Makes No Difference' in front of a theater." Also, this paragraph feels kinda isolated. Perhaps move/merge it to the section about Does This Look Infected? or something like that?
 * ✅ Reworded and expanded upon slightly. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 15:58, 22 October 2008 (UTC)


 * " Sum 41 has been nominated for seven Juno Awards (the Canadian equivalent of a Grammy), winning twice. In 2001, they were nominated for "Best New Group" at the Juno awards, where they lost to Nickelback." -> "Sum 41 has been nominated for seven Juno Awards (the Canadian equivalent of a Grammy); they won twice. In 2001, they were nominated for "Best New Group" at the Juno awards but lost to Nickelback."
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 21:12, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "In 2008, they were nominated for another Juno Award, this time it was Underclass Hero for "Rock Album of the Year", however, they lost to Finger Eleven's Them vs. You vs. Me." -> "In 2008, their album Underclass Hero was nominated for the Juno Award 'Rock Album of the Year'; however, the album lost to Finger Eleven's Them vs. You vs. Me."
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 21:12, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "The band is known for its often political-social music found in songs like 'Fat Lip', 'Over My Head (Better Off Dead)', 'Still Waiting', 'No Reason', 'We're All To Blame', and 'March of the Dogs'." Since the source doesn't say that the songs "often" contain political-social comment, probably reword this way: "Some of the band's songs contain political-social commentary: 'The Jester' was an 'anti-Bush screed' and 'Dear Father' was about absentee fathers." You could include other examples (of course if sourced.)
 * ✅Reworded. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 03:16, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * What is Introduction to Destruction? The article only mentions it.
 * ✅ expanded slightly upon - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * In the section "Chuck and the Congo", a sentence reads "The band waited for the firing to die down, but it never did." Although that would be fine in colloquial English, WP is a little more nit-picky: unless the firing never really "died down" (which means the firing is still going on at this minute), the wording should be changed to "the firing did not die down within x amount of time" or whatever, depending on how the events occurred. Also, is "hot zone" slang? If it is, it should be changed.
 * ✅ Reworded. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * "in Europe and the USA, where it reached the sixteenth position on the Billboard Modern Rock charts." In Europe or in the U.S.? The sentence is kind of ambiguous.
 * ✅Reworded. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:45, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I would refer to people by their last names (after they have already been introduced in the article); I'm not sure if this is demanded by the MoS, but every featured article does it that way.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The quote by Whibley in the second paragraph of the "All Killer[...]" section seems out of place. Perhaps it could be expounded upon?
 * ✅Reworded. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Though the article says that the reason Baksh left was that he wanted to play something with a more "classic metal" sound, the source cited doesn't explicitly state that. It says that the split was due to "creative differences" and it says that Baksh's new group had a more "classic metal" sound, but it doesn't explicitly connect the two statements.
 * ✅Reworded and changed. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * W hose tour is Strength in Numbers? Finger Eleven's or Sum 41's? The article isn't clear there. Also, when it says "recommenced" the Underclass Hero tour, does it mean that the tour was postponed? From my reading, it seems like the Strength in Numbers tour was postponed, not the Underclass Hero tour.
 * ✅ Reworded and expanded slightly. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)


 * In the second paragraph of the lead, "to date" seems redundant to me.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 01:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Also in the second paragraph of the lead, "gone 3x platinum" seems too casual for an encyclopedia. Perhaps "certified 3x platinum"?
 * "Crazy antics" ("Beginnings" section). Aren't antics by definition "crazy"?
 * In the section "All Killer No Filler and Does This Look Infected?", you mention "legal age". Perhaps you should specify the age, as readers could interpret it as either the legal age in Canada or the legal age in the U.S.
 * ✅ - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 01:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)

A bit rushed for now, but I'll continue reviewing later.


 * Okay, i've gone through and fixed the majority of what's there. Also, what makes [theresnosolution.com this] a reliable source is it is the biggest Sum 41 fansite out there, and it's run by a community of Sum 41 fans.. it's very reliable, the news posts they post are mainly conecrning news that Sum 41 has posted on there official myspace blog. Last time i checked, wikipedia discourages blogs as sources. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 21:29, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * worked more on some of them. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 01:44, 17 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Fixed some more. By the way, thank you for taking the time to review this article. - -The Spooky One (talk to me) 05:39, 19 October 2008 (UTC)
 * So is this peer review over? - -' The Spook (TALK) (Share the Love with Barnstars) 00:33, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Right now, the only major issue I have is with the use of theresnosolution.com as a source; as I am unfamiliar with it, however, it might be best to get other opinions via the talk page. I still check the article every day, however, and if the review closes before new issues come up, I'll continue on the talk page (or fix them myself). Ink Runner (talk) 04:26, 6 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Do you think you could create an article assesment page here to review on weather the article is an "A-class" article the assesment rubric is here. - -' The Spook (TALK) (Share the Love with Barnstars) 00:13, 11 November 2008 (UTC)