Wikipedia:Peer review/Thomas S. Monson/archive1

===Thomas S. Monson===


 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for July 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for July 2008.

This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because I am the main contributor to the article and would like a critical, rigorous PR to help prep for FAC.

Thanks, Eustress (talk) 22:20, 26 July 2008 (UTC) :Note: Because of its length, this peer review is not transcluded. It is still open and located at Peer review/Thomas S. Monson/archive1. Comments from I looked at the article with an eye towards a making it good enough for a FAC. So here are my comments organized based on the FA criteria:
 * 1a - Well written
 * "Appointed by Ronald Reagan to the President's Task Force for Private Sector Initiatives, Monson is also a recipient of the Boy Scouts of America's Silver Buffalo and the World Organization of the Scout Movement's Bronze Wolf—both awards the highest given in each organization." This is a rather long list-y sentence. Try and reword it so it does not feel like you have to take a breath half-way through the sentence.
 * Monson was born on August 21, 1927 in Salt Lake City, Utah to G. Spencer Monson and Gladys Condie. - Need a comma after dates.
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 18:37, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * After discussing things with church apostle Harold B. Lee (his former stake president), - Parentheses aren't needed. Simply put a comma after Lee.
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The Navy granted his discharge in the last group processed before the Korean War. - Oddly worded sentence. Is the sentence saying, "The Navy granted his discharge after the last group before the Korean War was processed"? Even then the sentence isn't making much sense to me.
 * Lee set him apart six months later as a bishop—mentioning in the the blessing that he likely would not have been called if he had accepted the commission. - Oddly worded sentence. It should probably be split in two. Also, I'm not sure how often the phrase "set apart" is used outside of the church. The same can be said of "would not have been called". More common phrases should be used if you wish to keep you reader from being confused.
 * Monson taught for a time at the University of Utah, then began a career in publishing. ... publishing what? and for whom? I think this clause ought to be merged with the next sentence to form something like, "Monson taught for a time at the University of Utah. He then began a career in publishing at Deseret News where he became an advertising executive."
 * He moved with the rest of the advertising operations to the Newspaper Agency Corporation when it was formed in 1952. - Oddly worded. How about, "He joined the advertising operations of the Newspaper Agency Corporation when it was formed in 1952"?
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Monson later transferred to the Deseret News Press, beginning as sales manager and eventually becoming general manager. - Comma isn't needed.
 * Disagree. --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * The are a lot of one to two sentence paragraphs. This makes the prose rather choppy. Try and merge these into other paragraphs, or expand them.
 * Under "Young adult and local church leadership" why alienate readers by using the abbreviation for the Young Men Organization? It seems spelling out the name of the organization would be clearer. That is, use Young Men Organization rather than the mouthful of "Young Men’s Mutual Improvement Association".
 * Why link to the KSL ambig page and not directly to the KSL Radio Station article? Also, it would be nice to clarify the statement changing the link title from simply "KSL" to "KSL Radio" for those to lazy to click through.
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * At age 58, Monson became the youngest member of a First Presidency since 44-year-old Rudger Clawson in 1901. - Kind of ambiguous. Sounds like this sentence is saying, "In 1901 Monson became the youngest member of the First Presidency at the age of 58." Try rewording.
 * As the second in seniority among the apostles behind Hinckley, Monson simultaneously served as President of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles (Boyd K. Packer served as Acting President). - I have a feeling that to a non-member this sentence would be extremely confusing. Try rewording/explaining better.
 * As church president (and as of May 2008), Monson has announced three new temples. "As church president" is redundant since this sentence is under the section titled "Church President". The sentence can easily be rewritten as, "As of May 2008, Monson has announced three new temples."
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Try to avoid redundancies. For example, a good number of the paragraphs start with "Monson". Also, both paragraphs in "Temple dedications" start with "As...". Such redundancies make the prose read poorly.
 * 1b - Comprehensive
 * There were many immigrants in the ward who had recently moved from Germany and had very few material possessions, making the church welfare load of the ward high. - Why is this relevant? What does it have to do with Thomas S. Monson at the time?
 * Good point...removed. --Eustress (talk) 02:43, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I couldn't find anywhere in the article information about President Monson's mission. Did he not go on one? If he did, where? If not, why? Etc.
 * You're right...I did think he did...I'll see if I can find out why before posting. --Eustress (talk) 18:37, 6 August 2008 (UTC)
 * There seems to be a lot of content lacking in the article. For example, in the First Presidency section it merely talks about who he was a counselor for. Is there no information about what he did as second counselor to President Benson and President Hunter or as first counselor to President Hinckley? The same criticism applies to the section dealing with his current presidency. Also, in the See also section, there is a link to the Council on the Disposition of the Tithes. Why is this not mentioned anywhere else in the article?
 * Under Awards, is there any more that can be said about President Monson's service performed for "Scouting and the community"? That is, what exactly did he do that merited the awards? Same goes for the Bronze Wolf.
 * When talking about the three temples he has announced, why not mention them? Why make the reader look at the references to find this information. This paragraph could use fleshing out anyway.
 * He and his counselors in the First Presidency also met with President George W. Bush on May 29, 2008 during his visit to Salt Lake City. .... Regarding what? Again, flesh things out.
 * 1c - Factually Accurate
 * The paragraph just before the "Young adulthood and local church leadership" section could use more sources to back up its information, same with the first paragraph under "Apostleship".
 * This needs a source: "When Monson was born, there were fewer than 650,000 members of the church in the world, with most of them being based in the western United States."
 * 2b - Organization
 * "Young adulthood and local church leadership" - This might just be me being picky, but this title seems a bit lengthy. Any way to pare it down?
 * "Legacy" seems an odd name for a section heading as this would imply (to me in any case) that he is dead.
 * Not sure what else to call it. --Eustress (talk) 02:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * "Volunteerism" sounds awkward. How about renaming it to "Volunteer work"
 * Done. --Eustress (talk) 02:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It seems to me that the article could be structured a little better. For example, have three main headings rather than the current two of "Biography" and "Legacy". Possible new organization: "Early life", "Church career", and "Work outside the church". Under Early life would go the first section of the Biography. The rest of the biography in addition to the "Temple dedications" would go under Church career. The rest conveniently fits under Work outside the church. (this is of course excluding "Works", "See also", "References", and "External links".)
 * Is there a reason this article is not using the same infoboxes as the other church presidents? If it's a matter of including education information, this is easily found under the Biography section.
 * Infobox Person has more fields, and I think he's more of a person than just a church leader (if that makes sense). I just like the separation and coincidental functionalities. --Eustress (talk) 02:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Also, just a comment about the image. Is there possibly a better free image we can use of President Monson? The one currently in use is not terribly flattering. OK, I think that's all I have for now.
 * Thank you for your PR...this is great feedback! --Eustress (talk) 02:28, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Comments from
 * You said you wanted to know what to work on before taking to FAC, so I looked at the sourcing and referencing with that in mind. I reviewed the article's sources as I would at FAC.
 * What makes the following reliable sources?
 * http://www.historyofmormonism.com/
 * http://www.ldschurchtemples.com/
 * http://gapages.com/menu.htm?
 * http://www.mormontimes.com/
 * http://www.americanchronicle.com/
 * I notice that a large number of the references are to the LDS church or site affliated with them. It would be helpful if there were more third-party sources.
 * Hope this helps. Please note that I don't watchlist Peer Reviews I've done. If you have a question about something, you'll have to drop a note on my talk page to get my attention. (My watchlist is already WAY too long, adding peer reviews would make things much worse.) 16:02, 2 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Good eye...I'll look into this more. Thank you! --Eustress (talk) 16:17, 2 August 2008 (UTC)