Wikipedia:Peer review/Watcher in the Water/archive1

Watcher in the Water

 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for June 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for June 2008.

This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because…

The article cannot expand any further, I have exhausted all sources. I need more sources or rather someone to point me in the right direction. The article is short but that is about the most information I have come across. The article has failed pass GA three times and I am desperate for someone to tell me what to do about the article. Since Spoo has made it why doesn't this article, it's more factually based. I need a guide.

Please do not tell me get more sources I need somepone to point to some sources that have merit. If not then I am open to any suggesstions and general feedback on how to improve.

Thanks, LOTRrules (talk) 20:47, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Ruhrfisch comments: Hmmm. I read the article, read the talk page, and three failed GA reviews. I think the article can be improved and that perhaps it may be able to get it up to GA status. Here are my suggestions for improvement: Hope this helps. If my comments are useful, please consider peer reviewing an article, especially one at Peer review/backlog (which is how I found this article). Yours, Ruhrfisch &gt;&lt;&gt; &deg; &deg; 03:51, 10 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Spoo was made FA in a different era (August 2005) and has twice been through WP:FAR and has been up for deletion too. I strongly doubt it would make it through WP:FAC today. The bottom line, though, is that Spoo has absolutely nothing to do with this article. Whether or not it is FA or deleted, Spoo does not matter here. This article has to make GA on its own merits and nothing else. Complaining about Spoo just detracts from your work here and does no good. Let it go. See WP:Other stuff exists
 * I agree this article needs more sources. I do not agree that you have exhausted all sources. I did a very simple search on Google books and found a large number of potential sources here. Here are just two that look good (there are a lot more there):
 * J.R.R. Tolkien: Artist and Illustrator by Wayne G. Hammond, Christina Scull - Tolkien drew the Watcher and they talk about it.
 * Postmodern Medievalisms - Page 73 by Richard Utz, Jesse G. Swan, Paul Plisiewicz - this compares Tolkien's book, Jackson's film, and George Lucas scene with a water monster in Star Wars
 * Google scholar also has some things about this, although it might be harder to get some of those sources.
 * There are a fair number of books on Tolkien and his works, which I would think probably at least mention the Watcher. FOr example if you search for books on "Tolkien analysis" at Amazon there are many books that have the search inside feature - could look for Watcher and see what to try and find in a library and/or get through interlibrary loan.
 * I found this at Amazon - The Lord of the Rings: A Reader's Companion by Wayne G. Hammond, Christina Scull that way - it mentions the Watcher.
 * In short, get thee to a library! ;-)
 * I also agree with the comments at the three GA reviews - once you find more sources, get a copyedit from someone at WP:PRV or by asking one of the reviewers at WP:LOCE
 * As I noted at my review of Dol Goldur, Howe's illustration is used in the infobox, but is not otherwise discussed in the article. If Howe and Lee are good enough for See also, why not put them in the article?
 * Ref 1 appears to be to Wikipedia, which is not a reliable source. See WP:RS
 * While a lot of work has been put into the article so far, much much more needs to be done. Please remember that the GA criteria focus on what is in the article itself. I do not know if it can get to GA< my guess is that it can, but you may need a lot of work and assistance with copyedits.