Wikipedia:Peer review/William Stones Ltd/archive1

William Stones Ltd
This peer review discussion has been closed. I've listed this article for peer review because I have overhauled it completely and would like a second perspective.

Thanks, Farrtj (talk) 18:52, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Comments from Cunard on the 23:23, 25 April 2011 (UTC) revision
 * "William Stones Ltd was a brewing company founded in 1865 by William Stones and was based at the Cannon Brewery in Sheffield, England. The brand is currently owned by Molson Coors..."
 * Perhaps the following would be better: "William Stones Ltd was a brewing company founded in 1865. Originally based at the Cannon Brewery in Sheffield, England, the brand is currently owned by Molson Coors..."


 * "...the brand is currently owned by Molson Coors who brew the pasteurised Stones Bitter (3.7% ABV) at their Burton upon Trent brewery and contract the production of the cask conditioned Stones Bitter (4.1% ABV) to Everards of Leicester."
 * To "...the brand is currently owned by Molson Coors. They brew the pasteurised Stones Bitter (3.7% ABV) at their Burton upon Trent brewery and contract the production of the cask conditioned Stones Bitter (4.1% ABV) to Everards of Leicester."


 * Wikilink ABV as a layperson probably wouldn't know to what it refers.
 * "It is available across the United Kingdom, and it is one of the country's top twenty ale brands."
 * To "Available across the United Kingdom, it is one of the country's top twenty ale brands."


 * Bitter to Bitter (beer)
 * "In the 1860s William Stones started brewing at premises in Acorn Street, off Shalesmoor, where the brewery took up all the western side of the street, except for the Shalesmoor corner where the Red Lion was situated."
 * This sentence is very long. Perhaps you can break it up into shorter sentences for easier reading?


 * "In 1865 he formed a partnership with a Mr. Watts" – omit "a Mr."
 * 1954 should be delinked per WP:OVERLINK.
 * "local rivals" – should it be "local rival"?
 * 1999 should also be delinked.
 * "The brand continues however, the keg beer being brewed by Molson Coors at their Burton upon Trent brewery, and the cask version is contract brewed by Everards."
 * To "...the cask version being contract brewed by Everards" to maintain parallel sentence structure


 * "In the early 1940s Stones first produced their famous, refreshing, golden/straw coloured beer called Stones Bitter."
 * This sentence appears to be editorializing the quality of the beer. Perhaps you could say Author X of Book Y praised the beer for being "refreshing".


 * "10 hours or so a day" to "about 10 hours"
 * "At 4.1%, it was strong for a draught beer at the time, and earned the moniker of 'Jungle Juice' in the Sheffield area."
 * To what does 4.1% refer? If it refers to ABV, maybe you can mention ABV here.
 * For Jungle Juice, I think double quotes, not single quotes, should be used.


 * "expanded production led to it also being produced" to "expanded production led to its also being produced"
 * The quotations in the article should be enclosed by double quotes, not single quotes.
 * "it won Silver" – I don't think silver needs to be capitalized
 * "The cask conditioned version taste" – should there be a hyphen between "cask" and "conditioned"?
 * http://www.yourround.co.uk/Brewer/Sheffield/Stones/S3.aspx (ref #16) doesn't appear to be a reliable source per Reliable sources.
 * http://www.drinksdirect.co.uk/acatalog/stones_bitter.html is not a reliable source.
 * http://onestopshop.molsoncoorsdirect.com/product_listing.aspx?typeClass=3 doesn't seem to be a reliable source.
 * "Since the Sheffield brewery closed the slogan has been 'Yorkshire Gold'."
 * "Yorkshire Gold" should be enclosed in double quotes. Several other quotes in this paragraph and the preceding one should also be enclosed in double quotes, not single quotes.


 * "Since 1997, the marketing budget seems to have been slashed to almost nothing." – do you have a source for this. It appears to be original research.
 * "In the media" – this appears to be a trivia section, which is discouraged by Manual of Style (trivia sections).
 * As movie titles, When Saturday Comes and The Full Monty should be italicized.
 * The link to film is overlinking.
 * See also the dablinks on the sidebar of this peer review. Four links to disambiguation pages need to be fixed.
 * File:Stones.jpg – when was this logo first published? It might fall under the public domain.
 * Most of the references are bare urls. An easy way to fix them would be to use Template:Cite news and Template:Cite book, though you could also manually format them.

Thank you for your hard work on this article. This was an instructive, enjoyable read. Cunard (talk) 23:27, 25 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for that Cunard, I've taken your advice on board Farrtj (talk) 00:14, 26 April 2011 (UTC)


 * You're welcome. I've also run WP:REFLINKS on the article to remove the bare urls. Cunard (talk) 04:10, 26 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Can you grade the article? I'm worried I may be biased. Farrtj (talk) 20:29, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I have rated the article as C class. The references are not fully formatted (i.e. with the authors, publishers, and dates) and contains some problems. For example, the sentence "Since 1997, the marketing budget would appear to have been slashed to almost nothing" is unsourced and appears to be original research. Cunard (talk) 01:23, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I have removed what was indeed a piece of original research. Can I rephrase it along the lines of 'marketing support has not been readily evident since 1997'...? Farrtj (talk) 17:26, 1 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, I think that would be fine. Cunard (talk) 21:08, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

Comments from Nthep on the 16:13, 15 May 2011 revision
 * Lead paragraph I'm confused reading this - are you talking about the company or the brand or both? There is one sentence on the company then the rest of the paragraph is about the brand(s).  I don't think there is a problem in dealing with both but perhaps it needs to be separated out more?
 * What happened to the company? The first sentence says 'Wm Stones Ltd was (my emphasis) a brewing company ...' but then there is no mention of what happened to the company.  I understand the brands were bought by Coors (directly or did they go through other hands first and end up with Coors as a result of other takeovers?) but what happened to the company?  If 'was' is correct then the company no longer exists and the date it vanished needs to be identified.


 * History Perhaps a map of Sheffield showing where the premises were would help?  Acorn Street and the famed Cannon brewery are unlikely to mean much to most readers unless they are very familiar with Sheffield.  If a map isn't appropriate then use of coord might help.
 * There is a big gap in the history between foundation, Stone dying and then a jump to the 1950s - did nothing of note really happen for 50 years?


 * Stone's bitter You're right it's the company's most famous product but if it wasn't introduced until the 1940s what was the brewery producing beforehand?  And after 1940 was bitter the only product.  Certainly the bitter merits a separate section for the comprehensive reasons you've given but perhaps another section on Beers produced at various times would be helpful - even if it's only a bullet point list.
 * There are some additonal citations needed for this section as well e.g. the origin of the name "Jungle Juice" and why it is no surprise that it features heavily in WSC and The Full Monty.

This is an interesting article that leaves me with more knowledge than I had before but it also left me asking a lot of questions which sadly it doesn't (yet) answer. I'd agree with Cunard's C rating for the time being. If you need any help or want me to explain things more please leave a not on my talk page. NtheP (talk) 17:18, 15 May 2011 (UTC)