Wikipedia:Peer review/X Club/archive1

===X Club===


 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for June 2008.
 * A script has been used to generate a semi-automated review of the article for issues relating to grammar and house style; it can be found on the automated peer review page for June 2008.

This peer review discussion has been closed. This article was expanded as part of an assignment given by teaching assistant in the "History of Modern Science in Society" class at Yale University in the fall semester of 2006. I was quite intrigued by the subject, so I planned to bring the article up to Featured Article status. I've made some edits in the past few months and I think that it can be ready for an FAC in the near future. Since I don't have any experience writing or working on science articles (although, I do have experience with history-related articles), I was wondering if some editors, whether they be members of a science WikiProject is no matter to me, would kindly review this article. Thanks, Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 18:04, 19 June 2008 (UTC) :Note: Because of its length, this peer review is not transcluded. It is still open and located at Peer review/X Club/archive1.

Comments from
 * You said you wanted to know what to work on before taking to FAC, so I looked at the sourcing and referencing with that in mind. I reviewed the article's sources as I would at FAC.
 * Most of your references have the publisher and place of publication in 's. One doesn't, is there a reason?
 * Are you referring to Desmond? I didn't know the location for that publisher. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 12:32, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Hm.. you say "London, W. W. Norton" for it? (Yes, I was referring to Desmond.) Ealdgyth - Talk 12:45, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
 * That one was a book, while the others are journals. Citation has a unique reference style for each. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 12:50, 20 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The current note 6, the website, can we link to the site itself? Also, what makes it a reliable source?
 * I'm planning on removing this ref shortly. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 12:32, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Hope this helps. Please note that I don't watchlist Peer Reviews I've done. If you have a question about something, you'll have to drop a note on my talk page to get my attention. (My watchlist is already WAY too long, adding peer reviews would make things much worse.) 21:29, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Brianboulton comments: I can't really comment on the science content, but I can do a general prose review. Here are some initial thoughts on the lead; more on the rest of the article will follow. Brianboulton (talk) 11:51, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

I'll be back Brianboulton (talk) 11:51, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Lead
 * "late 19th century Victorian era England" is awkward and over-complex. "Late 19th century England" would do, with a pipe to Victorian era if you want it.
 * Fixed. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I suggest that "during its existence" in second sentence is redundant
 * Removed. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * As all nine members are listed by name, the word "Among" is unnecessary
 * Fixed. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comma after 1860s in second para
 * Done. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Final phrasing in lead reads oddly: "…after old age and death made meeting regularly impossible". Suggest: "…after depletion by death, and as old age made regular meetings of the surviving members impossible."
 * Reworded, but do you think "depletion" is an appropriate word choice here? I've never seen that word used in reference to humans. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * It reads fine to me, but perhaps in the US it relates oil reserves or something similar? By all means, change it to "reduction" if you're unhappy with it. Brianboulton (talk) 15:50, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Great, thanks for the comments. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 15:04, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Here's the rest of the review.


 * Social connections
 * The insert relating to Spottiswoode would be better after the words: "…known as the X club", to improve the sentence flow.
 * Done. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * This single-sentence paragraph should be merged with the following paragraph, perhaps losing the unnecessary words "Before the emergence of the X “social network” in the 1850s…"
 * Done. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Word insertion: "has worked as surgeons and HAD become professional naturalists".
 * Done. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * "They shared a middle class background…" But it is earlier said that some were artisans.
 * middle-aged is normally hyphenated
 * Done. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Perhaps "academic liberalism", being an invented term, should be in quotes.
 * Well, I didn't invent it. It's an actual term used in academia, however limited its use may be. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Scientific climate
 * The sentence beginning "The publication in 1859…" is too long and convoluted. Suggest a full stop after "development", then : "Since the start of the century they had seen evolutionism as an assault on…" etc etc
 * That works. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Word insertion: “…liberal theologians and BY professional scientists….”
 * Added. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comma after "supported Darwin"
 * Added. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Why "challenge" in quotes?
 * Don't know why it was in quotes. Removed. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Suggest paras 2 and 3 of this subsection are merged
 * Merged. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Suggest "the evangelicals", not just  "evangelicals"
 * No problem with this. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Comma after "In his analysis" not required
 * Added. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
 * "jealousies of theological sects within societies…" What societies? Does this mean learned/scientific societies? It might be as well to say so.
 * Yes, learned societies. Nishkid64 (Make articles, not wikidrama) 23:20, 24 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Dining clubs
 * In first sentence, suggest replace the words "because they were characterized by" with a simple "as", and delete the words "among friends" at the sentence’s end.
 * Comma after "most were too large", then: "and therefore unsuitable…"
 * I don’t follow the logic of the sentence beginning: "In addition, due to the outbreak of debates…"
 * "sought" looks odd at the end of its sentence. Better might be: "...professionalism, sought by serious scientists, including members of the X club such as Hooker and Huxley".
 * Formation
 * The link on unorthodox is pretty useless
 * Too much trivial detail included as to precise times and places of meetings
 * Redundant words "and in addition". Suggest semi-colon after "…meeting;" then straight on to "Spottiswoode attended…"
 * Lose comma after: "After some discussion…"
 * The sentence beginning "As the members of the club had no Slavonic friends…" sounds like an editor’s own comment, in which case it shouldn’t be here. If someone else made the joke, the sentence should be cited.
 * Officers, not offices, in penult. sentence


 * Influence
 * First sentence overlong and has repetition of "much". Suggest full stop after "community", then: "Its influence over scientific thought was similar to that of the Scientific…"
 * Second sentence: lose the commas after 1878 and 1885
 * What is the "Society" that Spottiswoode was treasurer of?
 * I’m completely bewildered by the last sentence; "Foreign Secretary" is a senior position in the British Government, roughly equivalent to US Secretary of State. I don’t believe that Hirst held this position, so perhaps some clarification is called for.
 * Justice of the Peace, i.e. part-time unpaid local magistrate, is not a high enough honour to be listed with these others. In fact, it isn’t an honour at all.


 * Decline
 * First sentence: The fact that the club’s members held prominent positions has been well established, and doesn’t need stating again. Also, is there a more elegant alternative to "falling apart" as a metaphor for the club’s decline in the 1880s?
 * You might mention in this section that Busk died in 1886.


 * Do we need another listing of the nine names? One listing in the article should be enough.

In general the article is put together well. Most of my criticisms are of a fairly minor nature and can be attended to quite easily. I hope my suggested re-phrasings were helpful.

Brianboulton (talk) 15:50, 24 June 2008 (UTC)