Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2015 March 26

March 26
This is a list of redirects that have been proposed for deletion or other action on March 26, 2015.

Channel 53 virtual TV stations in Mexico
Relisted, see Redirects for discussion/Log/2015 April 2%23Channel 53 virtual TV stations in Mexico

Outspan



 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was retarget to Outspan Hotel. A hatnote would probably be appropriate, but I hesitate to add one while the brand isn't mentioned at Fyffes. I won't stop anyone else from doing so in the meantime. --BDD (talk) 13:17, 2 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Outspan → Fyffes (links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Outspan&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure: [ keep]/[ delete] ]

I found this redirect with a PROD tag on it. Since redirects can't be deleted by PROD, I removed that, but it does seem to me like the redirect should be deleted. The prod rationale was that the redirect is from a brand to a competing brand, and I agree that it doesn't make sense to have a redirect in that case. The target article doesn't mention the redirect name at all. Also, it looks like the redirect was created by someone who has been indefinitely blocked as a vandalism-only account, so it might have been created as vandalism. Calathan (talk) 15:43, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Outspan Hotel because we have no other articles which use the name. Some indication from Google that an outspan is an area on a farm used for animal husbandry or possibly as a sort of parking lot and rest stop for wagons (see usage in Carolina, Mpumalanga) but I don't see this actually defined anywhere on Wikipedia. Outspan the brand seems to be more closely associated with oranges than bananas, but redirecting to a competing brand seems nonsensical, and I don't think we normally redirect brands to the products they sell. Ivanvector (talk) 15:50, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep . It used to be a very well advertised brand of orange in the United Kingdom. Presumably owned by Fyffes, who are more famous for bananas. Si Trew (talk) 17:01, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * According to this, the Outspan brand is owned by Capespan of South Africa (about whom we do not have an article). I cannot determine the relationship to Fyffes, if there is one. Ivanvector (talk) 17:15, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I imagine one of those huge global brand name changes. Si Trew (talk) 22:18, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Chucking "Outspan Orange advert" into youtube proved, er, fruitful. (Ducks the cabbages thrown for the pun). Si Trew (talk) 22:21, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Got it, here in the UK Daily Telegraph stocks and share section:
 * , listed on Epicor (NASDAQ) code "FFY". Si Trew (talk) 08:25, 27 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment. Hmmm, so now what do we do with it? It is a brand name of Fyffes but not mentioned there... Of course I could add the reference but that would be kinda something I would do after this discussion closed. Si Trew (talk) 08:32, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The association is not mentioned at Fyffes, and I'm not sure exactly how we would work it in. If they're a subsidiary then the redirect is probably fine, but I think the hotel is a much more likely primary target. I'm not sure what a hatnote would look like either (For the British fruit brand?) Ivanvector (talk) 15:12, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I would have thought that was simple. "This article refers to a hotel. For the British fruit brand, see Fyffes" and, in reverse, "This article is about a British fruit brand. For the hotel, see Outspan Hotel". Si Trew (talk) 16:38, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

National Party (Bohemia)



 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was delete. --BDD (talk) 13:14, 2 April 2015 (UTC)


 * National Party (Bohemia) → National Party (Czech Republic) (links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=National_Party_(Bohemia)&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure: [ keep]/[ delete] ]

Please delete. The National Party of Bohemia (cs:Národní strana (1848)), also known as the "Old Czech Party" existed in the second half of the 19th century (founded in 1848). It is not related to the far-right National Party of the Czech Republic that existed from 2002 to 2011. RJFF (talk) 14:51, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:RFD #2 (misleading/confusing) and per WP:REDLINK. No indication that the more modern party was referred to as Bohemian particularly. We could probably write an article about the 19th century party in this space as well. Ivanvector (talk) 15:03, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete. Bohemia is not, nor ever was, part of the Czech Republic. Si Trew (talk) 22:27, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Bohemia says "It is located in the contemporary Czech Republic", but you're correct if you're defining it as a legal entity. --BDD (talk) 13:14, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Theresienbad



 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was converted to article based on de:Theresienbad, with a request for translation help. (non-admin closure) Ivanvector (talk) 14:42, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Theresienbad → Terezín (links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Theresienbad&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure: [ keep]/[ delete] ]

Please delete. Theresienbad is a spa place in Vienna, while Terezín (Theresienstadt) is a former military fortress and a Nazi concentration camp in Northern Bohemia. Feťour (talk) 14:38, 13 February 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete Mostly because not mentioned in target. The German name is Theresienstadt, which is quite far from Theresienbad.  野狼院ひさし  u/t/c 15:52, 13 February 2015 (UTC)

*Retarget to Meidling, which mentions the spa by name. Ivanvector (talk) 16:04, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete as WP:RFD, "The redirect makes no sense, such as redirecting apples to oranges"., although that target mentions it, it first introduces it without comment on where or what it is, and the other two mentions are links (so we'd end up with circular references). So I am not sure it's really a very satisfactory target. Si Trew (talk) 03:35, 15 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Definitely it shouldn't target to where it is, but D5 can be fixed by retargeting. There is a very brief bit on what the spa is, but that's what we've got. The circular references can be unlinked. Ivanvector (talk) 17:08, 17 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Ivanvector, I was about to close this as retarget, because you definitely have the strongest argument, inasmuch as we should avoid deletion if practical. But Theresienbad's mentions at Meidling are really without context. This may have been a consequence of edit wars or just general changes, but the very first mention of Theresienbad (which isn't linked in that instance) seems to assume the idea has already been introduced. WP:REDLINK deletion could still be an option, or Meidling could be tweaked so that a reader could learn something about Theresienbad from it. --BDD (talk) 16:34, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, BDD (talk) 21:29, 20 February 2015 (UTC) Speedy retarget as above. Si Trew (talk) 22:25, 20 February 2015 (UTC) Now I am on BDD's line. An Englishman cannot draw a line in the sand without blurring it. Churchill I think, but might be Orwell. Si Trew (talk) 22:28, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * tut, tut. Ivanvector may have the stronger argument, but can't have the strongest since there were only two of us: at least until you pitched in. By the way thanks for the good luck about my new job, it's going well, but unfortunately less time to work on WP. I have a nice article to do for a Hungarian/British engineer a bit of a pioneer in telly in the 30s, that a lot of info has been released by the British, all very James Bond stuff with the secrecy malarkey before WWII, so I am going to scrub that into a stub article I hope. Made a start but will be hard work. Si Trew (talk) 23:19, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I think you're right. I'll see if I can find anything. Ivanvector (talk) 13:26, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
 * There is an extensive article in German: de:Theresienbad. It would be hopeless for me to try to translate it but it seems like we should be able to write something about it here. Ivanvector (talk) 13:34, 21 February 2015 (UTC)


 * My German is definitely not good enough to translate the whole thing, but with Google's help, I'll take a stab at this this weekend. By all means, if anyone else wants to try, go for it. I'd appreciate notification if so, however, so we don't end up duplicating effort. --BDD (talk) 18:22, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Keep. Note that the Nazi camp at Theresienstadt was also called Theresienbad. See e.g.: etc. (Sorry, I just came across this discussion.) — The Great Redirector 06:13, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * : "the Nazis had elevated deceit to an art form. Even the various names they gave to the camp reflected this. At different times it was known as Theresienbad (Spa Terezin), Reichsaltersheim (State Home for the Aged), Judische Selbtsuerwaltung (Jewish Self-Administration) and even Paradeisghetto"
 * : "The first name that the Nazis gave to the garrison town, which had been renamed Terezin by the Czechs, was Theresienbad, which means Spa Theresien, implying that it was a spa town where people could take mineral baths."
 * : "Various names were used by the Nazis for the ghetto here. At an early stage it was known both as Theresienbad"
 * At best, that is an indicator for a hatnote at what should be the article about the Viennese spa, which seems to have fallen off our radars. "For the Nazi concentration camp sometimes called Theresienbad or Theresienstadt, see Terezín." In the meantime, I think you're right given the source, but I would prefer the translated German article to live in this space, if we're up to it. Ivanvector (talk) 14:30, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ivanvector (talk) 14:36, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep per, with no prejudice against creating an article about the Viennese spa (see de:Theresienbad) in this space. did you ever start on a translation? Ivanvector (talk) 14:36, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * No, I'm afraid not, and I probably won't get to it for a bit longer, if anyone else wants to have a go at it. --BDD (talk) 15:13, 26 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Ok, I've drafted a stub in place below the redirect. I removed some of the tags because the clutter was distracting. If this looks alright, I'll request a translation from German (via WP:TRANSLATE) and we can wrap up this thread that's been open over six weeks now. Good? Ivanvector (talk) 15:43, 26 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Looks good, with the hatnote. Thank you. — The Great Redirector 06:51, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Looks good to me too, requesting the translation is a good idea, my German is far too basic to even attempt it. I'm striking my delete above. Si Trew (talk) 07:09, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Does the stub-and-translate result work for you? I think you're the only others who have commented on this. Ivanvector (talk) 15:28, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Support (and strike above) after glancing over the German original under Google Translate. However please do note that the German original has not used inline citation, but that can be for another day and a tag.  野狼院ひさし  u/t/c 15:40, 27 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Yep, works for me. --BDD (talk) 13:39, 31 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Yes, Ivanvector, this looks much better now. Thanks to all for your efforts.--Feťour (talk) 10:15, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Great, then I will close this and proceed, since everyone seems to be in agreement. Feel free to reopen if I have interpreted that incorrectly. Ivanvector (talk) 14:42, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.