Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2017 June 5

June 5
This is a list of redirects that have been proposed for deletion or other action on June 5, 2017.

MMS pair
 Closed discussion, see full discussion. Result was:
 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was keep  .  (non-admin closure)   Anarchyte  ( work  &#124;  talk )  23:22, 14 June 2017 (UTC)


 * MMS pair → Maris–McGwire–Sosa pair (talk · links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=MMS_pair&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure:  ]

No sign of this acronym ever being used; the target isn't notable, but survived an AfD in 2007, making it ineligible for PROD. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Power~enwiki (talk • contribs) 22:35, 5 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Delete or weak redirect to M&M's characters as there are two M&M characters that usually appear in those commercials. AngusWOOF ( bark  •  sniff ) 03:59, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Keep Did you even bother to read the article? It's used there. -- Tavix ( talk ) 04:05, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Speedy keep. The acronym is used three times in the short target article, so the nomination in incorrect. Thryduulf (talk) 08:38, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Beh. I got fooled. Striking vote. This is now highlighted in the lead sentence. AngusWOOF ( bark  •  sniff ) 13:28, 6 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Comment yes, the article uses the term for brevity, but it is not used in a single Google search or Google scholar result that I could find, making it not a useful term. Power~enwiki (talk) 18:23, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The article uses it for brevity, so people who've read the article - and anyone else who abbreviates it for brevity - will look for it at this title. There are no competing uses and it got 17 hits which is above noise level, so there is no reason to delete. Thryduulf (talk) 19:33, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I found some uses of "MMS pair" in medicinal chemistry so I added a hatnote to this. AngusWOOF  ( bark  •  sniff ) 23:09, 6 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Keep seems like an entirely valid shorthand and plausible way to shorten the name, even if not used in technical writing. Anything else this can refer to can be dealt with by hatnotes as AngusWOOF as done with one case, or if necessary creating a DAB. Patar knight - chat/contributions 04:20, 7 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Messhof
 Closed discussion, see full discussion. Result was:
 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was keep  .  (non-admin closure)   Anarchyte  ( work  &#124;  talk )  12:30, 14 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Messhof → Nidhogg (video game) (talk · links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Messhof&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure:  ]

Delete: Messhof also developed Flywrench, so WP:XY applies. Lordtobi ( &#9993; ) 23:52, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Is Messhof or Messhof Games notable enough to create an entry now that the company has created two games with Wikipedia articles and is planning a Nidhogg 2? AngusWOOF  ( bark  •  sniff ) 00:14, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Retain. Messhof is the online moniker of an individual (one-man) indie game developer, known for making many small games but certainly best known (as already shown in sourcing) for the revised Nidhogg, hence the redirect. The coverage for Nidhogg eclipses the coverage of the revised Flywrench, as any cursory search would have indicated. This redirect from the developer to his most covered game is clearly useful and unambiguous. I see no way in which XY applies and I don't think due diligence was done here. Sources refer to Messhof as an individual, as it is Mark Essen's online moniker, and only recently used "Messhof" to refer to the two-person team that produces his recent bigger releases. Readers searching for Messhof are clearly looking for him, if not specifically his involvement with Nidhogg. And in the off-case they were looking for Messhof as a studio entity, the redirect would still be correct. As for the comment on independent notability, no, I don't think there is enough sourcing on the dev himself (nevertheless as a company), notwithstanding the point that RfD should not be used to force the creation of articles. I don't know where my previous draft went, so here's a source dump: User:Czar/drafts/Messhof. Eye close font awesome.svg czar  04:38, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Tavix ( talk ) 15:20, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Keep per Czar. Patar knight - chat/contributions 04:20, 7 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Mark Essen
 Closed discussion, see full discussion. Result was:
 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was no consensus  .  -- Tavix  ( talk ) 14:03, 14 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Mark Essen → Nidhogg (video game) (talk · links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Mark_Essen&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure:  ]

Delete: Mark Essen also created Flywrench, so WP:XY applies. Lordtobi ( &#9993; ) 23:51, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Retarget to whatever Messhof goes to as he is a key person of that company. He has no notability independent of his company. AngusWOOF ( bark  •  sniff ) 00:17, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete - Messhof should just be a disambig of the guy's games. Redirecting developer pages to one of their multiple works is not helpful, but I understand the redirect was created before Flywrench's release. As per my comment at Articles for deletion/Dejobaan Games, developers should have a degree of inherited notability such as WP:BAND, if only to aid in navigation. - hahnch e n 13:48, 28 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Retain per #Messhof. These three nominations overlap and should have been nominated as a group. Eye close font awesome.svg czar  04:40, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Tavix ( talk ) 15:20, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Mark "Messhof" Essen
 Closed discussion, see full discussion. Result was:
 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was no consensus  .  -- Tavix  ( talk ) 14:03, 14 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Mark "Messhof" Essen → Nidhogg (video game) (talk · links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Mark_%22Messhof%22_Essen&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure:  ]

Delete: Messhof is a company consisting of two people, registered under the laws of California as Messhof LLC. It is not a pseudonym of Mark Essen, and even if it was, the company also developed Flywrench, so WP:XY applies. Lordtobi ( &#9993; ) 23:51, 25 May 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Retarget to whatever Mark Essen points to. Name is mentioned in multiple news articles from video gaming magazines and the Telegraph paper uses this nickname too.      AngusWOOF  ( bark  •  sniff ) 00:16, 26 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Retain per #Messhof. These three nominations overlap and should have been nominated as a group. Eye close font awesome.svg czar  04:40, 31 May 2017 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, -- Tavix ( talk ) 15:20, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.

Template:Art
 Closed discussion, see full discussion. Result was:
 * The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more redirects. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the redirect's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.


 * The result of the discussion was delete  .  -- Tavix  ( talk ) 13:28, 14 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Template:Art → Template:Non-free 2D art (talk · links · [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Art&action=history history] · stats)     [ Closure:  ]

Too generic a name to warrant a redirect. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 01:18, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete as too generic and misleading. Legacypac (talk) 04:06, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete - I'm really surprised that there isn't a Template:Art in its own right. There is a Template:Infobox artwork, by the way. - Richard Cavell (talk) 09:35, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * In my view, that's because it's too generic to warrant being its own template either. Zeke, the Mad Horrorist  (Speak quickly) (Follow my trail) 12:35, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete per Legacypac. -- Amaryllis Gardener  talk 22:29, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete - too generic. Even amongst license tags there's many possible choices (2D art, 3D art, PD-art) – Train2104 (t • c) 22:31, 5 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete - Vagueness. CoffeeWithMarkets (talk) 13:04, 6 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete as vague -- Lenticel ( talk ) 01:05, 8 June 2017 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.