Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2007 January 10

= January 10 =

Buying a laptop without Windows
I need a new laptop and I haven't used Microsoft Windows in years, so I'm looking hard for any company that will let me buy a laptop without making me pay for a Windows license. I sent some emails, including one to HP, and they all replied "no, all our laptops come with Windows preinstalled and you have to pay for it", but then I stumbled across this page and did a double-take. The first option says you can save $100 by choosing FreeDOS instead of Windows XP Pro, which is honestly more than I expected to save. After some more searching I found that Dell offers something similar. Do any other companies offer laptops without Windows?

On a related note, do any current Apple laptops have Linux-friendly wireless chips (i.e. not Broadcom)? —Keenan Pepper 04:20, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Hypersonic offers notebooks without an OS for a savings of $90 from XP. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the other gaming computer vendors do the same. kmccoy (talk) 04:25, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * You may be able to get a refund for windows after you buy it - but it takes some work. Dell is quite good for this - you can get about £50 or so. Google for "windows refund". --h2g2bob 09:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Hopefully you are still going to check this...
 * System76 sells sells a range of systems preinstalled with Ubuntu. All hardware is guaranteed? to work with at least ubuntu. http://system76.com/ --Sish 07:16, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Type 07
I have an external 200GB hard drive that was partitioned with NTFS. My friend connected it to his Linux box, which said it could not mount it. After this, I connected it to my Windows XP PC, which showed the volume as not partitioned. When i looked at the drive in Partitiononmagic, it showed the drive as having a "Type 07" file system. How do i get my files back? --Shanedidona 05:10, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * "Type 07" just means NTFS, for what it's worth --⁪froth T C  06:28, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Testdisk is the most powerful free utility I have found that can help you to recover lost partitions. Please use at your own risk. Sandman30s 09:47, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Is the disk's MBR broken or overwritten or something? --Shanedidona 14:55, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The disk won't have a boot sector if it's not bootable. Was your external hard drive bootable? --⁪froth T C  19:22, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

It wasn't bootable. --Shanedidona 21:33, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Have you tried testdisk? Run the analyze and if it picks up your lost volume, that means it's quite safe to "Save" i.e. write the corrected partition info to disk. This program saved my life when Partition "Magic" crashed in the middle of resizing and nothing else could fix the broken partition. Sandman30s 21:36, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah, when I tried installing Ubuntu 6.06, I resized a NTFS partition. Everything was lost on that partition (I thought). I used testdisk, and everything was restored! --wj32 talk 01:30, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

I got testdisk. Is there a place in the program I go to to repair the disk? I don't know where to go in the program. --Shanedidona 14:48, 11 January 2007 (UTC)


 * You can use arrow keys and Enter key to select. Select your physical disk, then Intel partition, then Analyze, which analyzes for lost partitions. If it finds partitions it can restore it will display a list in green. Select the one you want to restore then Save. Good luck! Sandman30s 21:56, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

You might want to try two 100 GB partitions instead of a single 200 MB partition. Some Windows systems have trouble addressing a partition over around 137 MB, and perhaps some versions of Linux have the same restriction. StuRat 01:00, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

programming language
what r the psudo codes of algo? if there is no use of algo for a programmer than y v must write algo of a program? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.170.71.58 (talk) 07:42, 10 January 2007 (UTC).


 * ALGO is a programming language, not a pseudo code. If V is being required to program in ALGO, I feel sorry for him.  If that doesn't answer your question, please try repeating it with proper grammar. --Kainaw (talk) 08:09, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm guessing the question refers to an algorithm rather than ALGO. I cannot parse the question about "pseudo codes of algo" in a meaningful way, however. As for the second question, I'm guessing "v" stands for "we", a notable improvement to internet writing, since it's clearly much easier to type one letter than two. The question would then state, "if there is no use for algorithms to a programmer, then why are the programmers required (presumably, by the teachers) to write their programs as an algorithm first, as opposed to starting writing code from scratch?". The answer is in the false supposition; algorithms are indeed very useful, and in the context assumed here provide for abstraction, an extremely important software engineering concept. IgorSF 09:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps the d00d is asking what is the pseudocode for writing algorithms. The answer is that there is no one specific pseudocode. As pseudocode is intended to be read only by humans, not by computers, there is much more freedom in defining your own pseudocode. J I P  | Talk 10:46, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * God, who knows or cares what he is asking about? If he can't be bothered to at least try and be coherent then I don't think anybody should be bothered to guess at what he is asking about. --24.147.86.187 15:31, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * WP:BITE --⁪froth T C  20:55, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * It'd be BITEing if it were making fun of their inability to use the Wiki or search or something like that. But I think we're allowed to say that someone is just being rude when they don't put any effort into making a coherent sentence. --24.147.86.187 16:45, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * There are various reasons for users not being able to write in sentences with perfect grammar. What if a user's first language is not English?  Or they are not familiar with a keyboard?  It's always good to assume good faith.   x42bn6  Talk 21:32, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Even basic stuff like "Put kettle on stove. Turn on heat.  Wait for water to boil.  Turn off heat.  Pour water." is pseudocode - it doesn't have to take any sort of real structure.  See pseudocode (surprised none of you linked to this yet!).   x42bn6  Talk 22:57, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

System file backup...?
Is there a way to backup or copy the system file in the config folder in the system32 subdirectory of the system root directory (windows), i.e., c:\windows\system32\config\system ? -- 71.100.10.48 08:22, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Perform the file copy outside of Windows, when the file is not locked. Splintercellguy 09:47, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * How do you get outside of XP? If you boot from a floppy you can not access the harddrive. If you boot from aCd XP will only allow you to access the harddrive under recovery console which keeps the file locked. 71.100.10.48 10:33, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * The file appears to be in use by Windows; I'd guess it's being used by the kernel, and as such, may remain in use so long as Windows is run. But you don't have to copy it under Windows! There are several ways to use your computer without Windows running; the easiest will likely involve creating a system boot disk if you don't already have one and booting your machine from that disk; or else using a bootable CD (the CD from which you installed Windows XP is a bootable CD by itself). You may need to modify BIOS setting to allow the machine to start from a floppy/CD; take care while doing that. IgorSF 09:49, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * As stated above. 71.100.10.48 10:33, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Normally, you should be able to access the hard drive while booting from floppy. If your hard drive is formatted using NTFS rather than FAT32, there may be problems, although I'm not sure that they will arise. An additional possibility is restarting your machine in Safe mode with Command Prompt, though I can't be certain that this file won't remain locked. IgorSF 10:53, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * The file is still in use under safe mode and a floppy created under NTFS is formatted as FAT with no files for even accessing a CD much less being able to access an NRFS drive. -- 71.100.10.48 11:07, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * If you boot to the XP recovery console, the SYSTEM file won't be locked I think. Splintercellguy 13:14, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * You need a LiveDistro, something like Knoppix is a great solution, but would require a little bit of learning. ;)Vespine 21:58, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think you understand. Even if you can boot from a floppy or CD NTFS will not allow you to have access to the harddrive. 71.100.10.48 00:55, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * And why is that? Knoppix is not Windows (if you didn't know), so why would it not have access, even though it has NTFS support? --wj32 talk 01:21, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * As stated, bootable cd's such as Knoppix, BartPE, etc.. allow you to view NTFS partitions and copy files off, most even support USB drives so you could just copy to a pen drive or an external hard drive. Another option is to physically unplug the drive and plug it into another computer. Booting to the recovery console WILL allow you to copy the system file off, it isn't locked in the recovery console as you stated before.  However, I'm curious as to why you are trying to copy the SYSTEM file off, do you have another computer thats getting a "config/system file is missing or corrupt" error on booting? Copying the system file off another computer will not fix this error, the best way to fix this is to boot off a windows xp cd; on the first screen that says "hit R to repair, or hit enter to install" hit ENTER, not repair, the next screen is the license agreement, hit F8 to accept that, now the next screen should say "theres already a windows here, do you want to repair it? hit R to repair" on this SECOND repair screen you want to hit R, this will copy windows over the top of itself and repair it, fixing the error, and keeping all your existing programs. You will have to reinstall all updates after the repair. If the second repair screen doesn't show up, and you are instead looking at a partition screen, just turn off the computer. It doesn't always let you repair the windows depending on what caused the error. The other option is to do this.--PiTHON 03:12, 11 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Just for backup, why all these complications? Surely the simplest would be to use Windows' own backup program. It works in ordinary run mode: System tools > backup > advanced > select the files to backup and specify destination. An alternative is create a restore point, if you want a copy of the setting before changing them. -- —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Seejyb (talk • contribs) 09:31, 11 January 2007 (UTC). Oops --Seejyb 09:32, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * iirc the built in backup does not use VSS and wont backup files in use without a registry hack. however, i did just try your suggestion and the only backup location i can select is the a: drive, which isn't much use for a 5mb file. i believe its meant for old tape drives, i have seen this program used (with scripts) to backup to external HD's, however i don't know how and have no time to research it currently :p--PiTHON 16:56, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Avi Mashup
Any freeware programs that can take two .avi files and stitch them together into one, consecutive video? Thx. --Russoc4 14:48, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I gather VirtualDub is pretty popular. Has an "Append AVI segment..." function. Weregerbil 14:53, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Yeah, VirtualDub is what you are looking for. Though not free, Quicktime Pro can do this also, I think—it is not very expensive and I find it easier to use than VirtualDub, personally. --24.147.86.187 15:30, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Well, I have AutoGK. I'll see what I can do with the VirtualDub that it comes with. Thanks. --Russoc4 16:05, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Deleted file
i used to use MS word 2007 Beta 2 (not Tech Refresh) on my old Vista (build 53..) partition. it seems that some files which i need have been deleted (prob. by me, when I though I had them) - would there be any way to reliably recover them? They still appear in the Word recent docs list, but I get an error that the file doesn't exist when I try to open it. I've tried a few deleted file restoration programs, but non work (and I really need a free-ware one anyway). Does anyone have any ideas/an answer to my conundrum? 81.155.240.68 16:26, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Reliably, probably not. It sounds like you are on the right track with the undelete programs, I was trying to undelete some photos on a flash card and it wasn't until the third or fourth program that I was successful. Of course, if you want to pay an arm and a leg, you could seek professional help. Vespine 21:53, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The best one I found thusfar is Handy Recovery - unfortunately it's not free. The evaluation version should allow you to undelete a few files per day. Sandman30s 22:01, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Printing
I am trying to set up my windows XP laptop to print over the network. The only catch is, the network is primarily Mac. How can I do this?

Omnipotence407 16:40, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * How is your printer connected to the netowrk - though a Mac or directly? A print server may be your best bet for this kind of thing - unless there's some Mac software out there... 81.155.240.68 16:43, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * A network is a network, does the printer have an IP address? If it does, you should just be able to connect to it using that. Vespine 21:44, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * If the computer is connected directly to a MAC computer, this site looks like it has the info you need. If the printer has its own network card in it, or has a print server, then you'll need to get the software for the print server usually.--PiTHON 03:28, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

The printers are connected directly to the network. How would I find their IP addresses? When i use the connect to a printer on the network, nothing shows up.

Thanks Omnipotence407 22:28, 12 January 2007 (UTC)\
 * I've seen high end printers with built in network cards, you can use the printer display/setup to go to network settings and manually enter an ip address (or even use DHCP), then you should be able to view/add it from the network. If you have a printer with just a parallel or usb port, then a print server plugged into that with a network port on it, then you have to get the software for the print server. Telling us the make/model of the printer and/or print server would help the most.--PiTHON 02:32, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

I will get that info as soon as I can, long weekend. 74.37.228.44 04:50, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

Class Methods
If you are calling a class method, when is using the class identifier optional? 216.253.128.27 16:52, 10 January 2007 (UTC)nicholassayshi216.253.128.27 16:52, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Is this a homework question? Well, it depends on the language. I would like the answer to be "never", but unfortunately, that's not correct. J I P  | Talk 17:51, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * This is not a homework question. I was programing on Java and came across this problem.216.253.128.27 22:02, 10 January 2007 (UTC)nicholassayshi
 * How about creating a reference to that method? --wj32 talk 01:24, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
 * When calling it from a method of the same class or a subclass, I believe. N (t/c) 21:49, 11 January 2007 (UTC)


 * True for Java, yes. However, that's not necessarily true in all OOP languages. For example, in python, if we have a module called foo with a method bar, this is valid code..

from foo import bar bar —The preceding unsigned comment was added by TK-925 (talk • contribs) 02:22, 12 January 2007 (UTC).


 * That's not a class method, because a module isn't a class. I suppose it might be considered a static-style method (sometimes called a "class method") of the module as if the module were a class, but then I don't know if the questioner meant to be discussing methods with or without an implied object parameter.  --Tardis 15:43, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

How much would you pay for this Desktop PC?
How much do you think this computer is worth?

This is a computer purchased from ABS computers (ABSpc.com, owned by newegg) a couple years ago. These are the specs directly from my order history:

ANTEC LED LIGHT TUBES GREEN RET

CASE ANTEC|PLUSVIEW 1000AMG LE RET

ACCES FAN|8CMX25 TLF-82 LED CLR RT

MB i865PE|5P1A4D GA-8IPE1000Pro ATX

VGA EVGA|FX5900 128M DVI/TV 8X AGP

POWER SUPPLY 450W ALLIED ATX450P4 R

CPU P4/2.8CGHz 800M 478P/512K HT RT

DDRAM 512MB PC-3200 GL5123200B-G % (2 of these = 1GB)

MULTI-SLOT FLASH 3.5" USB2.0 BLK%

FD 1.44MB|MITSUMI #D359M3D BLACK %

HD 120GB|WD 72R WD1200JB 8MB-CACHE%

MODEM AOPEN PCI V.92 FM56-PLX OEM

CDRW LITEON|52X32X52X LTR-52327S BK

DVD|LITE ON 16X XJ-HD166/165H BK%

SB BLASTER AUDIGY|SB0092 (W/1394)%

S/W MS|WORKS 7.0 OEM BUNDLEVERSION%

S/W MS|WIN XP HOME SP1a BUNDLE ONLY

2NET 1YR ONSITE SV 888 983 9988

Awesome 4500B

So basically it's a P4 2.8GHz, with 1GB DDR ram, Geforce FX5900 128mb video card, 120gb Hard drive, very solid motherboard, very well built case (look up reviews on antec plusviews if you want, the case has a glass window on the left side so you can see all the components, which are illuminated by some blue LED's. Also has an extra fan inside.

It also includes 52x32x52 CD RW and 16X DVD player, sound blaster audigy sound card, floppy drive, 6 in 1 card reader on the front (memory stick, smartmedia, Compactflash, microdrive, SD, and multimediacard), 56k modem, ethernet card. I also added a firewire card (powered) about a year ago which I believe has 2 ports. On the front there is also a firewire port and usb port, and I believe the Soundblaster card has yet another firewire port. There are a bunch of USB ports (6 in total).

Comes with XP install disc, have not tried linux on it but it would definitely work. Have had absolutely no problems with it since I bought it. I also have the original instruction binder with manuals, CDs, etc.

I also may have a keyboard, mouse, and LCD display for extra if you're interested. It will be available starting Friday the 12th. Selling because I'm getting a laptop for college. It will come with a reformatted HD.

thanks 71.192.64.118 18:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)Steve


 * Slightly outdated gaming machine- I'd pay maybe 400 dollars for it max --⁪froth T C  19:20, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

why the %28 %29 for secondary disambiguations?
For example, searching "Master Chief" leads me to the officer ranking page; if I click the disambiguation page at the top to lead me to the fictional Halo Star, I am sent to: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master_Chief_%28Halo%29 I simply do not understand where/why it is in this format...why not just, say, wiki/Master_Chief_Halo or something? My overarching question is, such a method of disambiguation links seems arbitrary, any explanation? Thanks! 140.180.21.169 22:01, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * %28 and %29 are HTML address code for left bracket '(' and right bracket ')'. HTML address code is NOT the correct term for it, I'm not sure what the proper name is, someone will no doubt find a link. Vespine 23:09, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * It's called percent-encoding or URL encoding, and it allows special characters on URLs. &mdash; Kieff 23:13, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * The naming conventions just try to make things easy and standardised. See Disambiguation.   x42bn6  Talk 22:53, 11 January 2007 (UTC)