Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2008 October 26

= October 26 =

Work and privacy
While at work, I keep my GMail and GChat open. Occasionally I need to gripe about the knuckleheads I work with. Sometimes this griping to a friend on GChat involves very explicit and inappropriate language about these knuckleheads I work for. Can my job track/save/watch me while I'm on my Gchat and saying these awful things? --72.78.20.45 (talk) 01:21, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * If your company controls the software on the machine you're using, of course they can. Many companies use spyware to keep track of what employees do on company time. See spyware RayAYang (talk) 03:59, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * If you use https when surfing GMail (you can configure this in the settings), it's less likely that they're listening to you. Then your conversation is encrypted when it goes over the wires. Depending on your how evil your employer is, they could still be monitoring you using keyloggers and by taking screen-captures. But it's a lot less likely, I think. If you're going to do this, at least make sure you're using https. Belisarius (talk) 08:31, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * If you are on windows, fire up task manager. Under processes, you will probably find some form of VNC. If it is there, consider yourself lucky. Your management is being 'upfront' that your screen can be watched remotely. Kushal (talk) 11:28, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * If you have VNC on your work computer, it is more likely that it's there to provide remote access for your help desk than for monitoring/spying-on your activity. Typically VNC also appears as an icon on the system tray (aka notification area) and, if I recall correctly, will clearly indicate when someone has connected.  -- Tcncv (talk) 14:27, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

I don't care if they know I'm Gmail, but can they actually read my conversations and incoming/outgoing mail?--72.78.20.45 (talk) 14:54, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * If they wanted to, probably. There are many ways they could do so. If you are working on their computer and on their network they could have set it up in a variety of ways to look at what you do. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:56, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * In the settings menu of gmail, you can choose "always use https". It's not on by default, but if you activate it, the chances that they can read what you are writing would be slim, wouldn't they? (unless they are using some sort of keylogging mechanism) --NorwegianBluetalk 22:14, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Whatever the technical specifics of your situation, you're smarter doing the griping at home. I've had my fair share of colleagues who thought they were being clever doing things on the internet that they weren't allowed to do at work, only to find the management was monitoring them in some way they hadn't thought of. And nobody wants to be the guy who lost his job over porn. ;-) Really, if you value your paycheck, don't gripe at work, especially not over the internet, it's just dumb. Gripe when you get home, if you have to. You do not have very much privacy at work, especially when it comes to outgoing communications, which are often routinely screened. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:56, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Firefox Favorites
One of my computers just crashed and I can't boot off of the hard drive but I can connect the hard drive to another computer and access the data. My question is, is there anywhere (a folder or a file) where firefox saves the favorites? I never specifically exported the favorites list from firefox and there were quite a few favorite links. I looked through different places but couldn't find a list of favorites so that I can restore the list. Does anyone know, where foes firefox save them and what is the file called? I mean, there must a place otherwise how does firefox remember your favorites. Thanks!--69.110.132.97 (talk) 05:45, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * It depends on your version of Firefox and operating system. This page will help you find your profile folder, the location of which is OS-dependent. In Firefox 2.x and below bookmarks will be in a "bookmarks.html" HTML file; whereas for Firefox 3.0 and above it will be in "places.sqlite" database(?) file. This page will tell you more about bookmarks. In either case, you can simply copy the relevant file(s) over to another Firefox (same version) profile folder on another computer. --71.106.183.17 (talk) 07:39, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Or if that doesn't work for some reason you can copy over your entire profile folder and use that in your new installation. --wj32 t/c 09:35, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Computer mouse
heading added by Belisarius (talk) 08:32, 26 October 2008 (UTC) Does mouse really stand for "Manually Operated User's Selection Equipment"? 122.162.173.213 (talk) 07:12, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * No. A mouse is called a mouse because it looks like a teeny-tiny cute little mouse! Belisarius (talk) 08:32, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * ..which you could have learned by just typing in mouse into the search bar at left. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:50, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * It's definitely because it looks like a mouse. Some of the early models more so than modern ones because for a while the cable came out of the opposite end to the end with the buttons - and the buttons kinda looked like ears with the wire looking like a tail.  But there is definitely no truth to the story that it's some kind of acronym. SteveBaker (talk) 12:54, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * It can be called a backronym, though our article doesn't include it (but it does seem to include a lot of mnemonics that are not backronyms at all). AndrewWTaylor (talk) 08:10, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

Laptop LCD Problem
I have an Acer TravelMate 3260 which is ~1 year old. Today I was cleaning the LCD screen using the solution I always use - it is some non-streaking cleaning solution from Gulf Oil. In the past it has never caused any damage to the laptop. Today, however, after cleaning the bottom left part of my screen is discolored and has weird patterns. Everything is properly displayed, only that ugly discoloration/pattern is there.

http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image000yb5.jpg http://img505.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image001mz3.jpg

The above images were taken using my digital camera. They are not really clear, but the damage is visible.

I would request someone to advise me whether it is a permanent damage, or a temporary one? Will the discoloration go away by itself in a few days, or do I need to take the laptop to a service center? Will I need to get the complete screen replaced? Can I do anything at all to remedy the situation at home? Thanks! --RohanDhruva (talk) 09:35, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * To me, it looks a little like you've wiped away part of the screen's coating. In that case, it's fairly permanent. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Washii (talk • contribs) 03:00, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Does the screen have anti-reflective coating? You really have to be careful in cleaning that type of screen; usually water and a microfibre cloth is best. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 04:58, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks a lot, it looks permanent to me too. I guess a trip to the service center is essential. In the future, only water + microfibre cloth for cleaning it. --RohanDhruva (talk) 14:00, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Bridging routers with a cable
I have a Netgear wireless hub (not sure about the model number, sorry) and a long ethernet cable, and a guy staying down the hall in my student residence has agreed I can use his connection (via his own router). I can run my cable to near my room, but not quite into it, and I'm out of wireless range. So my question is, can I connect my hub by cable to the router and use it to extend the wireless network?

I need to know exactly what changes to the other router are needed, cause I only have access to it as a favour. Really can't spend much time mucking about with it, or try stuff I don't understand to see what happens. Let me know if you need model numbers to answer this and I'll check them. Thanks. — FIRE!  in a crowded theatre...  13:06, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The other issue is that another housemate wants to connect too, but there's only one spare ethernet port on the router. So getting a longer cable wouldn't solve the problem. — FIRE!  in a crowded theatre...  13:09, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The name of the model might help, but I'd say there's a good chance it'll work fine, at least for basic web surfing, if you just plug it in. To your neighbor's router, your hub will just look like another computer (or possibly several, if it doesn't NAT), while your hub won't really care what it's plugged into as long as it can get an outbound route.  There are a bunch of things that might go wrong, and several ways in which the setup could be improved, but there's a good chance it'll more or less work out of the box.  (You do still want to configure your hub, if only to change the default admin password, but that's a given anyway.)  —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 15:50, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

iPod without iTunes
I quite like the idea of getting myself an iPod, but I really want nothing to do with iTunes. Is it possible to use an iPod, connect it to my Windows PC, copy MP3s to the iPod over the USB cable, etc, without ever running or even installing iTunes? Astronaut (talk) 13:19, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * You can't just copy them over but there are alternative programs you can use. There are, of course, other mp3 players other than iPod. --98.217.8.46 (talk) 14:49, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Is this true? damn! I find it kinda hard to believe since Apple sends the message of "out of the box" products... I now like it even less... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.241.122.236 (talk) 16:45, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I fail to see how the linked article or the response changes the "out of the box" nature of the iPod. It still works right out of the box.  Dismas |(talk) 17:45, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the suggestions. Trouble is though, all the Windows compatible programs require you to have installed iTunes and run it at least once to change a setting in the iPod.  I don't even want to install iTunes at all.  Ideally, I would want an iPod to work just like an external USB drive without any additional software - I'm quite happy managing my own synchronization by manually copying my MP3s to the iPod.  Astronaut (talk) 15:55, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Then why not ignore the marketing and buy one of the many other digital audio players on the market? Many allow you to directly add and remove music files simply by placing them into the right folder, and support many more formats than iPods. If you were feeling adventurous, you could even try something that supports the Rockbox alternative firmware. - IMSoP (talk) 17:08, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, if you really loathe iTunes that much, go with another player. But, I should point out, iTunes is a fantastic piece of software. It's the best music organizer/database program out there, and it's the best I've seen at synching music to your iPod (and I'm one of those open-source Apple-hating freaks that only use windows when I have to, and would much rather run Ubuntu 100% of the time). Unless you have a very old computer (iTunes is heavy, but not absurdly so) or have deep philosophical objections to Apple (in which case you shouldn't buy an iPod at all), I recommend you try it. It's one of those cases where it really is as good as everyone says. Belisarius (talk) 17:41, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Except, of course, the people who say it is a horrible piece of software. Try a Zune ;) FreeMorpheme (talk) 18:12, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * (simultaneous edit)
 * Except that "everyone" doesn't say so; I've spoken to plenty of people who've used it and found it didn't suit them, though others (like you) swear by it.
 * And surely "it's the best I've seen at synching music to your iPod" is a bit of a feeble claim, since it's the only official way of doing so? Or did you mean you prefer it over the software available for other players, and over manipulating files directly on players that support that? - IMSoP (talk) 18:16, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I know I can buy other players, but I really like intuitive nature of the iPod user interface. However, I really don't like what I've heard about iTunes, it's too tight integration with iTunes Store, it's synchronization mechanism where music can get deleted, and I don't really need (or want) a "music organizer/database program".  Astronaut (talk) 18:41, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The claim that iTunes is "the best music organizer/database program out there" is nothing more than a personal opinion. For me, it is one of the absolute worst.  I use Amarok.  It plays music.  It organizes it - even moving the files around and renaming them so I can find them on my drive easily.  It links to the artist, album, and song articles on Wikpedia while playing the songs.  It links to the lyrics using a variety of online lyrics databases.  It automatically updates my profile on lastfm and offers suggestions and downloads from lastfm.  It has a built-in normalizer so I don't have to keep adjusting the volume with every song.  But, most important, it runs on my computer.  I run Linux and iTunes on Linux is terrible.  You have to run it through Wine, losing most of the features of iTunes. --  k a i n a w &trade; 18:50, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

(outdent) Instead of discussing the pros and cons of iTunes, what Astronaut asked was, "Is it possibly to copy MP3s to the iPod over the USB cable, etc, without ever running or even installing iTunes?" 98.217 answered "no", which I find hard to believe. Doesn't an iPod appear as an external drive in Windows Explorer when you connect it with a usb cable, in the same way as just about any mp3 player or mobile phone these days, allowing you to drag-and-drop music files? --NorwegianBluetalk 21:59, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I believe the "database" has to be rebuilt before the iPod will see the new / changed files; it won't just scan the directory itself. So you have to use some kind of tool to build the "library" file after you've done dragging and dropping. (I may be wrong though.) - IMSoP (talk) 22:56, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Correct. You can copy an mp3 to an iPod without iTunes.  The result will be an mp3 file sitting on the iPod drive that iPod ignores.  I don't have an iPod, but I do have one of those Shuffle things.  I use a Linux script to copy mp3s to the Shuffle in the proper directories and set the Shuffle database appropriately.  I do not know if such a script exists for Windows. --  k a i n a w &trade; 01:44, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * ml_iPod, the plugin for Winamp, states on their website and forums that it's possible to manage and copy music to/from an iPod with their program without the need to ever use itunes. However, I believe the only way to update the firmware for the device is via the native itunes support. Nanonic (talk) 02:29, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Depending on which iPod you have, you might be able to Rockbox it. Kushal (talk) 14:48, 29 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, from personal experience, it's hard, but probably possible. I am assuming that you know about the "Ipod Control" hidden folder and that mess. Well, If you just manually add mp3's / other file types to a folder (even if it is one of the right ones), ur iPod can't play it. Don't ask me why, I just work here. flaminglawyerc 04:57, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Evil WMP 11 and monitored folders
My Media player 11 has taken it upon itself to monitor my desktop for files, as well as my Recycle Bin, which as you can probably imagine, is extremely annoying. The only folders it is supposed to monitor are the ones I can't make it stop monitoring, ie my Music and Rip Folders. I am running XP Pro, and rolling MP back to 10 and reinstalling did nothing.

Anyone have any ideas how I can hobble this vile bit of software? FreeMorpheme (talk) 18:11, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Have you tried setting the options within WMP itself? I don't know what your situation is but I would go ahead and forget that WMP exists in my system at all and go use some other media player. Kushal (talk) 19:10, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Firstly what makes you think it is monitoring those folders? Secondly, Media Player doesn't "monitor" anything when not running, so clearly you've been running it, and it's somewhat silly to complain about the configuration of the software if you haven't attempted the relatively simple process of editing the list of folders it watched for media. I didn't put any details in about changing this, because anyone who calls software vile because of there own short comings isn't likely to care about actually fixing any problems (I dont actually see a problem, as it doesnt affect the system, especially when you don't run it) when they could just use harsh words to try and put down a program that is fairly good at doing the job it is intended for. Seriously though, you really know what you're talking about, I bet you put some great arguments forward for why Microsoft is "evil" and don't know anything about how the free market works. - Jimmi Hugh (talk) 21:54, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Did you even bother to read my original post, you boobjockey? Obviously I do use MP11, everyone knows it monitors folders for files, and I already said that I have edited which folders I want it to monitor to no avail, it still goes its merry way to monitor what it wants and adds files to my Library that I don't want. If anyone with an attention span of more than one sentence has any ideas why it is doing this, please help me out. Alternatively, the only reason I am using 11 is because it's the only way I know of streaming to my PS3, if there is something else that does this then I'll use that. FreeMorpheme (talk) 09:34, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Hehe, boobjockey. No it doesn't monitor any folders not on the Library monitor list. If you only use it for streaming, turn off monitoring all together, that will stop it, but I wouldn't be suprised if you're actually using a toaster. - Jimmi Hugh (talk) 10:15, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Cool it, you two! Although I am using WMP11 on Vista, this should be applicable: right-click the 'Library' tab button, then hit 'More Options'. In the 'Library' tab of the window that appears, hit 'Monitor Folders', then 'Advanced Options'. Remove your desktop, recycle bin and whatever else from the list, then hit OK/Apply. CaptainVindaloo t c e 10:23, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Well I appreciate your help, but the only folders in there are My Music and the Rip folder, as I mentioned. This is why I got stuck, and why MP11 is hacking me off so much. The Rip folder is in another folder on the desktop, but I don't see why that should throw it so badly. FreeMorpheme (talk) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.60.20.81 (talk) 11:44, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

XP - Programs crash on startup
Hi, on my friends computer lots of programs crash when they are loaded (with, for example "Internet Explorer has encountered a problem and needs to close"). Does anyone know why this might be? Thanks 77.99.21.181 (talk) 18:31, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Could be a faulty Windows installation, and that's just a guess. For a start, you could try System File Checker. However, it could be anything, based on what I know. Kushal (talk) 19:07, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * One of the many possibilities is faulty RAM, although that often leads to BSODs as well. If you google diagnose faulty ram or something similar, you'll get a bunch of suggestions and links to various tools. I once had a PC with related problems, it was dual boot Windows Xp and Debian linux. The symptoms were: linux programs which involved heavy numerical computations were crash-prone, without taking down the entire OS. Windows was reasonably stable, except for the occasional (about once a month) BSOD. After a lot of frustration, I burned a memtest86 bootable CD, which immediately found the cause. Here's a howto. --NorwegianBluetalk 21:07, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I agree that it could easily be a RAM fault. Memory chips are susceptible to "pattern faults" where they only fail when certain patterns of 1's and 0's are written into them.  In the extreme, this can result in all sorts of peculiar failures - like programs crashing only when you load certain files into them - or browsers failing only for certain websites.  More commonly though, you just find the system is generally unreliable without any really specific sets of symptoms...and that's what seems to be happening here.  When your PC boots, it probably does a really simple RAM check - but because time is limited, it's a very cursory check.  A stand-alone RAM checker can't run under Windows or Linux - it's a very special program that you boot from CD-ROM or a memory stick.  A really good RAM checker may take hours to find the particular pattern that kills your machine - so be prepared to let it run overnight if necessary.  RAM is pretty cheap right now - so if it's faulty, you can carefully remove the 'sticks' of memory - take them to your local computer store and ask them to supply you with an equivalent part to replace it with.  You need to be careful of static electricity when you work inside the PC.  I suggest doing it in the kitchen (with the PC unplugged!) and discharging any static by holding on to the frame of the computer and the kitchen faucet at the same time for a few seconds after you've opened the case - but before you touch any of the electronics.  The RAM stick(s) are about 4" long by about an inch tall and stick up at right angles to the motherboard - and you probably have either one or two of them.  There should be little plastic levers at either end of each stick of RAM - push those outwards and downwards and the RAM should just pop out.  When you put the new RAM in, push it firmly into the socket and push the levers back up to lock it in place.  If you have more than one RAM stick, probably only one of them needs to be replaced - you can try swapping them out one at a time for a new part and re-running the memory checker to see which one fixes it.   Either way, you should do one last check with the memory checker to be sure your new memory is functioning properly before you try to boot up into Windows again.


 * Another possibility is that your friend's computer is so laden with viruses and malware that it's just become too unstable to run at all. So if the memory check doesn't turn up anything - it's time to consider re-installing everything - or at least giving the machine a careful malware checkup.


 * SteveBaker (talk) 12:49, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * You left out the link to memtest86. Download it, burn it, leave it running for a few hours while you go to work or watch TV or whatever.  That'll tell you if it's faulty RAM or something else.  —Ilmari Karonen (talk) 15:19, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

cd stuck in macbook
Hello,

I am back again. My friend has a macbook (Intel, 10.4.11, white, base configuration). As the title says, a cd got stuck in it. We tried pretty much every trick we knew about including tilting, pressing the trackpad while booting (it makes a sound indicating it is trying to get the cd out but is unable to), flashing PRAM, using a credit card to keep the metallic slot open ... nothing seems to work. However, I wanted to ask you guys about it before I send it off to Apple to fix it (as I am pretty sure we don't have AppleCare anymore.) Any ideas? (I am also starting to feel that the CD slot was not such a great idea after all.) Kushal (talk) 19:17, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Is there a tiny little hole somewhere on or near the CD drive? If so, that might be the manual eject button. Shove a bent paperclip or something in there (needless to say, with the power off). If it is, it should force the disc out. I've never had a slot optical drive though, so I don't know if this'll work. CaptainVindaloo t c e 19:39, 26 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Don't know about the OP's MacBook but if it's the same as mine then there isn't a hole like the one you describe. If you Google "macbook cd stuck", you'll get a number of suggestions.  Dismas |(talk) 19:49, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * No holes for manual eject. I have already tried google but nothing works in my case. What makes it worse is that OS X does not start anymore! Just at the same time as the cd gets stuck is when mac needs to crash. Any ideas on making the computer operable again? Kushal (talk) 20:12, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I had a similar problem and had to send it in to Apple for disassembly. Note that they got it out of the drive but did NOT send me the CD back. (I later e-mailed and asked if they still had it, and they told me they'd be happy to send it or a replacement—it was a basic OS X install disk—but they never did. They were, of course, not obligated to do so, having stated so many times when you send it in that they can't guarantee sending it back.)
 * Do you have any clue what is keeping it in the slot? One of my problems with the slot was a CD that had a library sticker on top of it, which kept it from ejecting. I ended up doing something really goofy with like an index card and a piece of double-sided tape that somehow eventually let me work it out of the drive. Not easy, though. Probably bad for the drive, too.
 * Incidentally, I don't like slot loading drives either anymore... when they work, they are only marginally more cool looking than other type of drive, but when they don't work... you're pretty screwed.
 * Keep in mind that even if you don't have Applecare you can still purchase it if the purchasing would be cheaper than the operation on it. You can purchase Applecare up to 3 years after purchasing your product, and Macbooks started selling in 2006, so it should be fine... --98.217.8.46 (talk) 23:49, 26 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Incidentally - I would NEVER put a CD with any kind of sticker on it into my CD drive. If the sticker is not 100% perfectly symmetrically placed (and they never are), the weight of the sticker unbalances the drive and causes the bearings to wear out amazingly fast.  As you've also noticed, the extra thickness of the sticker can cause the disk to foul the mechanism - either when it's spinning or during loading and unloading.  Also the adhesive under the sticker can ooze out under the heat of the laser or even leach chemicals into the plastic of the disk and produce all sorts of ikky problems.  CD's are NOT designed to work with stickers...ditto DVD's, BluRay's, etc, etc. SteveBaker (talk) 12:32, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * It's for similar reasons I don't think slot drives on laptops are a good idea. Sounds far too easy for dirt and debris - something laptops are inevitably exposed to - to get inside and jam the gubbins. That might be what has happened here. I hope Apple have axed them from more recent models. CaptainVindaloo t c e 12:55, 27 October 2008 (UTC)
 * (outdent) - This extract is taken from a thread on the Whirlpool computer forums based in Australia - it describes your problem perfectly, and answers it pretty much as well: - **If it doesn't eject when booting with the mouse button or eject key down, and it's just the rollers slipping, you have a faulty drive, and unless you've done something stupid like put a disc covered in stickers on it, then take it in and get it fixed. It's not your fault that Apple didn't put a force eject on it, and it's a warranty issue. No point taking it up with customer relations unless you've had lots of problems and you want a replacement (though, if your CD is stuck in it, you need to get it back, so you'll need to take it in for repair first anyway). The maintenance manual is very clear about this: If the drive doesn't eject a CD when you hold down the trackpad on a restart, and a reseat of the cable doesn't fix it, then the drive needs replacing.** Thor Malmjursson (talk) 14:39, 28 October 2008 (UTC)


 * What is ""reseat if the cable"? How can I do that? Kushal (talk) 06:59, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

This is so ... so not nice. I failed to mention earlier but the exact incident happened before, when it was under AppleCare. We got it to Apple after he got back from school at the end of the fall semester. Apple said they fixed the issue in his MacBook. Less than a year later, when we are out of AppleCare, it happened again!

So I guess they just got the CD out and never fixed the drive? I feel Apple cheated us. Kushal (talk) 14:43, 29 October 2008 (UTC)