Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2011 December 21

= December 21 =

How do I download a YouTube song ?
That is, a song on a YouTube video. Specifically, this one:. BTW, is this song (Christmas is a-Comin') old enough to be public domain ? Any other means of obtaining the song would also be useful info, particularly if it's free. Other renditions with those lyrics are also good. I believe the Jack Halloran Singers did a version that has the same first 3 verses from Lorne Greene's version. That would work, but not the Bing Crosby version, which has different, less funny, verses, or the Harry Belafonte or Muppets versions, which are rounds of the first verse only. There's also a completely different country song, with the same name, sung by Dolly Parton and others, and I don't want that. I suppose I can always hold a tape recorder up to the computer's speakers, but I'm hoping I can do better than that. StuRat (talk) 00:12, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * http://www.youtube-mp3.org/ 82.45.62.107 (talk) 00:24, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks, that works great ! StuRat (talk) 03:07, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/video-downloadhelper/ Copyright of music lyrics (and melodies, etc.) and copyright of performances are separate. ¦ Reisio (talk) 01:10, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Right. It's not a question of whether the lyrics are old enough to be in the public domain, it's a question of whether the performances are (which is unlikely). --Mr.98 (talk) 03:19, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

DVD player sound issue
My mother has a portable DVD player. Earlier today, the speakers ceased to work and headphones do not receive sound. The DVD player can still display movies from a DVD but there is no sound. What should I do? --Blue387 (talk) 00:48, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * 1) Return it as defective, if within the warranty period and you have the receipt.


 * 2) If you can't return it, attempt to diagnose it yourself, which involves taking it apart and looking for broken or loose wires or burnt spots on circuit boards. The wires can be soldered back together, but a damaged circuit board is likely a lost cause (would cost more to fix than a new unit).  Be sure it is unplugged before you take it apart.


 * 3) If all else fails, buy a new one (I recommend another brand). StuRat (talk) 01:01, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'd also recommend a different medium. DVDs are physically considerably larger than widespread portable viewing screens (mobile phones and the like); the video format they use, being massively out of date, is quite an inefficient use of space; and they are an enormous pain to author, burn, back up, or duplicate. ¦ Reisio (talk) 01:18, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Why recommend another brand? This one may have lasted for 10 years and is only now crapping out.  The OP gave no indication that the player is shoddy in any other way.  Dismas |(talk) 01:14, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm sure the OP can figure that part out on his own, if that is the case. ¦ Reisio (talk) 01:18, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I didn't say the OP couldn't. My question was directed at Stu.  Dismas |(talk) 01:21, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I did assume it crapped out prematurely, as a DVD player which was worn out by extended usage over many years is less likely to get a post here asking what to do when it fails. StuRat (talk) 03:12, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I actually had a simple solution. I plugged in the one year old DVD player into a spare TV my mother had. It works fine. --Blue387 (talk) 07:51, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * To clarify, is this the portable DVD player you plugged into the TV, or another DVD player ? StuRat (talk) 03:14, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * This is the portable unit mentioned earlier. It is one year old. --Blue387 (talk) 07:30, 24 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Is Reisio really suggesting that the OP's mother should download more efficiently compressed movies to watch on her mobile phone? If the OP's mother is anything like mine, she quite possibly thinks DVDs are the latest technology and has a 10 year old mobile phone that doesn't even have a colour screen.  Astronaut (talk) 15:11, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * What makes you think his mother is involved at all. ¦ Reisio (talk)


 * The second word of the OP's post?  ZX81    talk  00:07, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * The one suggesting his mother paid for what he is playing with? :p ¦ Reisio (talk) 02:07, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * The way I read it was that his mother had a DVD player, it stopped working and she gave it to her son to try and fix (and he wrote this post asking for help). My parents do that all the time...  ZX81    talk  03:14, 22 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I read it the same way. It's his mothers, it broke, she asked him to fix it.  I don't see any suggestion that he is "playing" with it or that he broke it.  Dismas |(talk) 03:57, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Exactly, his mother is not involved. ¦ Reisio (talk) 16:48, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * How on earth is she not involved? It's her DVD player... after it's fixed it's obviously going back to her (which is further enforced by the solution that the OP connected it to a spare TV *she* had). Your solution was basically "don't use DVDs any more" hence Astronaut's post querying this.  ZX81    talk  17:49, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * She's not involved in the implementation or maintenance of either the hardware or the media. She watches stuff with it, presumably, and that is all.  For the same reason the OP might get another DVD player on behalf of his mother upon StuRat's suggestion, I suggested he should also replace the target media as well. ¦ Reisio (talk) 18:58, 22 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Replacing a DVD player is easy and might cost a hundred dollars or so. Replacing a library of DVDs could take a great deal of time and cost thousands of dollars. StuRat (talk) 18:45, 23 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Sure, but it'll save money in the long run. ¦ Reisio (talk) 04:24, 24 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Not necessarily. I have a large DVD collection but don't buy them anymore (I watch them online now).  If his mother is in the same boat, then it's just wasted money, especially if she never wants to author, burn, back up, or duplicate movies (and most people don't). StuRat (talk) 15:39, 26 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Ah, but you'd save money not paying for the online service. :) And obviously she wouldn't do that, she's not involved. ¦ Reisio (talk) 16:32, 26 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Many movies are free, with adds, like thru Hulu. I do have Netflix streaming, too, but that's only $8 a month, a lot less than even one DVD. StuRat (talk) 17:11, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

Dell
Help. I need to become vastly more knowledgeable about Dell computers for an employment exam I have coming up soon. Although I'm not entirely sure, I believe the tests will revolve around Foundation 2010 Desktops and Foundation 2010 Portables. I am very knowledgeable with computers in general but I'm worried I lack specific knowledge and will not pass the test and thus not get the job. What can I do to study up as quickly as possible? 71.58.69.237 (talk) 01:25, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Can you be a little more specific about what type of knowledge you mean? Do you mean how to service them, how to sell them, what their standard parts are, what their commercial history was, or what? --Mr.98 (talk) 01:34, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

How to service them - mostly warranty work. For example, in addition to the two above items, one test I will need to pass is recognizing if a customer is at fault for the damage. 71.58.69.237 (talk) 02:08, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Have you ever serviced computers before? It's not really something you can learn without practical experience. In general, computers are fairly generic, once you've taken apart a few, you can take apart any. I've found "tear down manuals" for specific laptops using google before, if you want to try that, sometimes there are specific "tricks" which are handy to know, but if they're propriety, like I suspect the Dells would be, they may not be "officially" available and you have to rely on it having been "leaked". As for user liability, again that's probably something you need some practical experience with. There are Impact indicators and Water damage indicators (both redlinks? That's a surprise) specific to certain devices, but you'd need to see their tech manuals to know if and where they are. Vespine (talk) 03:56, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I thought it was a general rule that customers are _always_ at fault, according to computer sales establishments :-) --Phil Holmes (talk) 09:36, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * A quick Google search reveals this is about certification as a Dell engineer and offers up lots of sites/blogs with hints and advice and sample questions. Astronaut (talk) 15:01, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Perhaps you could try reading some of their service manuals to learn how to assemble, dissemble, and specific parts? TheGrimme (talk) 17:17, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Best programming language to write a class-based text based adventure game
Hi, I have never coded in my life (unless you count MultiMedia Fusion which I used extensively as a child) but I have lots of drive and would like to learn a language.

I want to make a text-based game involving character classes, hit points, initiative, and a couple other factors. I know it won't be completely simple, but the simpest language would obviously be preferable. I would also like to use a free program.

What would be the best program for me to use? 68.111.165.176 (talk) 07:30, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I used to run a MUD which was basically what you describe. It was all coded in C.  Dismas |(talk) 08:45, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * You can download e.g. the LPMud engine (which is indeed in C), and customize it beyond recognition. The actual game is programmed in LPC, an interpreted, object-oriented dialect of C. MUDs are typically text-based adventures similar to early Infocom offerings (with the added multi-user aspect). If you are more into something like Rogue or NetHack, then basically any language will do. Python is friendly and powerful. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 10:00, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * (e/c) Since performance wouldn't be an issue (no fancy graphics or complex computations), I agree that Python would be a good choice: easy to learn, simple and logical, but with lots of libraries so it can be extended easily. You can get it for free.  C is a bit more limited (e.g. it's not good for working with text) and more prone to nasty mistakes that have unpredictable consequences and are harder to fix.  However, you could probably do this in most modern languages, e.g. C++, Java, or Perl, all of which have free implementations. --Colapeninsula (talk) 10:09, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I made a text-based adventure of this kind a long time ago. The language? Well, according to John McCarthy, all these languages that focus primarily on storing values instead of describing how the values relate to one another is a poor way to do things. The user will give you a list of words. You compare that to a list of commands. You have a list of characters controlled by the player. The characters have a list of attributes. There is a list of locations. Each location has a list of attributes. I'm sure there will be a list of monsters. It is obvious you need a list processor - or Lisp. I used clisp and wrote the text-based adventure just to try and become semi-proficient at using Lisp for more than writing a trivial homework solution. While it should be the obvious choice, I would never actually suggest that anyone try to use Lisp for anything. It is very difficult to stop being functional and think relational. -- k a i n a w &trade; 13:35, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Won't use Lisp for anything? Do you really mean that Lisp is never the best choice? (for absolute anything). I also don't understand how people won't be able to learn to think in functional terms and than to be relational or object oriented or whatever. What you know cannot interfere negatively with what you learn, unless you don't question your basic assumptions. 88.8.69.150 (talk) 15:26, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I do not believe Lisp is the best choice for an entire project. It is limited to use as a pattern-matching or interpreter sub-program. I know that Lisp can do a hell of a lot more, but I cannot get programmers to make the jump away from the comforts of the C-style programming environment. Ruby programmers are the only ones I've found that are willing to think about it - but they tend to stick with Ruby for everything - even when they know it is slow and inefficient. -- k a i n a w &trade; 15:33, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I think I agree with Kainaw. Lisp can be fantastically powerful as a workhorse engine for a relational programming paradigm.  Lisp can be used to drive very powerful algorithms.  From the computer science purists' point of view, Lisp is an excellent programming language.  It clearly has found its place in the toolkit of many serious math or computer science researchers.  Lisp is also an excellent toy or hobby language, because it allows programmers to explore weird ideas in ways that are difficult to implement in, say, C.  For more Lisp propagada, read the official CLISP propaganda page.
 * At the same time, Lisp is a terrible language for most programming-projects. Lisp is severely limited by deficiencies in respect to software engineering (which is not the same as computer science).  First, tools for Lisp as not as well developed as those for C or C++ or Java.  Secondly, programmers rarely know and understand Lisp (this is a fact of demographics - there are fewer Lisp experts than C experts- especially in the professional arena.  For a quick giggle, have a look at the Monster.com job postings for Lisp programmers).  This means that it will be difficult to develop an entire project from scratch in Lisp; and it also means it will be harder to find collaborators and maintain a code-base.  Nimur (talk) 18:23, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The demographic issues can work for or against you. Finding people who can write code in a Lisp (or any other functional language) can be harder (but not impossible: ITA software, which is the brains behind all of those find-the-cheapest-flight websites, is a Lisp shop. ), but Paul Graham (whose theories I don't endorse wholesale) points out that anyone who wants to program in an obscure but powerful language is probably a good programmer.
 * If you're working on a project by yourself, I wouldn't be concerned with being able to find other people to join you. People can accomplish great things on their own. More importantly, even a project that no one else ever uses is educational. I have many failed projects, but they've failed in different ways, so I think that they've all been valuable experiences. Learning to program in a new language is easy, but learning to program is hard, so I should really shut up and point to Peter Norvig's excellent advice on learning to program. Paul (Stansifer) 05:51, 22 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Inform is an interesting option, although much dabbling with it has led me to the conclusion that "interesting" is the correct adjective, not "good". Card Zero  (talk) 17:12, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Freezing Internet Explorer in Vista
<<>>

Hi Guys

Last Couple of days I've noticed that every two or three searches I've done on a country, which I need to do several times an hour for work (eg "Brazil"), have frozen my internet completely. Only solution is to restart using Task Manager. I'm running Internet Explorer on Vista. I think that the problem might have started a few days ago when a certain Anti Virus free edition package turned up on my desktop and started scanning my harddrive unrequsted. I could be wrong about this though. The timing just seemed to co-incide. I've deleted the programme as I didn't want it - I'm running other anti virus freeware. Any suggestions what could be causing this freezing and how to fix it? - Thanks, MB — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.140.164.222 (talk) 13:57, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * The phrase "freezing my internet" does not make sense. Do you mean "freezes Internet Explorer" or do you mean "all programs that access the Internet (ie: web and email) cannot access the Internet anymore"? -- k a i n a w &trade; 14:09, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Any program that just shows up uninvited, scans your harddrive unrequested, and claims to be a virus scanner is very likely to be malware. It is likely to add more viruses then find anything you already have.  Simply deleting the visible part of the program probably hasn't got rid of it.  The reason for your internet service now going so slow, is probably due to this malware; your PC might even be part of a botnet now.  I would download and run something called Malwarebytes' Anti-Malware which usually does a good job of hunting down this kind of thing.  Astronaut (talk) 14:33, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Guys - was just freezing Explorer... Am going to pursue Malwarebytes and hope that does the trick, MB. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.140.164.222 (talk) 15:01, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Itunes and legality
I would like to know does Itunes check wethere the song in my computer are legal? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.125.22.128 (talk) 18:44, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I have no sources, but no, iTunes doesn't really have a way to determine if a song was purchased or not. They can determine if you purchased it on iTunes, but that is it.  Buying an mp3 on Amazon and importing it into iTunes is a common scenario.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by TheGrimme (talk • contribs) 20:49, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * In fact, using the iTunes match service to theoretically 'legalise' dodgy content was much discussed around the time of its launch   Nil Einne (talk) 23:24, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Not really possible, other than with the stuff you've actually bought off iTunes itself. For example, how could iTunes possibly ever know if that CD you're copying is legally owned by you, or whether you're ripping it illegally? --jjron (talk) 14:40, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Using GNOME 3 without the GNOME Shell
I just recently finally upgraded my Fedora system from version 12 to version 14, whose ISO image had been sitting on my hard drive for several months. I thought of going straight to the current version, 16, but then decided that for now, I couldn't be bothered to spend hours downloading it, so I used the one that I had already downloaded. But eventually I'm going to want to upgrade to version 16. The problem is, it seems to use GNOME 3 instead of GNOME 2, and after reading Controversy over GNOME 3, I agree with Linus Torvalds's criticism. I prefer the traditional desktop metaphor instead of this new-fangled "GNOME Shell" stuff. And I don't think my computer will even be able to run it, because it lacks hardware 3D effect support. So is it possible to run GNOME 3 with the standard desktop only, forgetting that this "GNOME Shell" ever existed? J I P &#124; Talk 19:36, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, when you say "standard desktop" that amounts to GNOME 2, KDE4, LXDE, or may be IceWM. Right now the GNOME3 shell is GNOME Shell. Linux Mint features MATÉ, a fork of GNOME 2 which it aims to improve. Unless your machine is particularly old, you probably can run GNOME 3 okay (see GNOME3 Myths); it works fine for me on a 5 year old PC with Intel integrated graphics. All it really does with the graphics adapter is blitting, buffering, and blending, which isn't really very challenging. There are various plugins for GNOME shell which add back stuff you're familiar with (e.g. places, gnome panel) but I can't recommend any specifically. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:22, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * I'd just like to be able to run GNOME 3 on Fedora 16 with the user interface working like it still was GNOME 2. My computer being able to run the GNOME Shell isn't the issue here - I don't want to run the GNOME Shell, because I've spent decades using the desktop metaphor on Windows, on Linux, and on the Amiga Workbench, and I don't want to suddenly change to a whole different metaphor. On the other hand, I don't want to suddenly switch to a whole new distribution, as that would probably mean a complete reinstall of my system partition as opposed to an upgrade. (Luckily I keep all my personal files on a separate partition, but I still don't know how it would work if I were to suddenly switch to a whole new distribution.) Is it possible to run this MATÉ thing on Fedora 16 instead of GNOME 3? Or is it possible to make GNOME 3 work like it still was GNOME 2? J I P  &#124; Talk 20:32, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * If you install the compiz-gnome package, that is the old version of Gnome. It is still available on Fedora 16. In the login screen, it comes up as Gnome Classic if I remember correctly (I already removed it as I don't use Gnome at all). -- k a i n a w &trade; 20:40, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * But doesn't compiz require hardware 3D effects support, which my computer doesn't have? J I P  &#124; Talk 20:41, 21 December 2011 (UTC)


 * What video adapter do you have? -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:50, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I didn't remember, so I ran . It printed out that I apparently have an nVidia GeForce 8600 GT and an nVidia GeForce 6150SE nForce 430. I don't know anything about these products. What I do know is that I have two graphics cards, one integrated into my motherboard, the other an external graphics card. I asked the vendor at Verkkokauppa.com for the cheapest adequate external graphics card they have currently available.  J I P  &#124; Talk 21:08, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Compiz allows for all kinds of weird 3D effects. You don't have to implement any of them. I don't and I do have a card that can support all kinds of nonsense like jelly windows, transparent menus, and virtual snowfall. -- k a i n a w &trade; 20:54, 21 December 2011 (UTC)