Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2012 September 4

= September 4 =

Router
Routers without wireless functions do not seem easy to find these days. I know many wireless routers allow the wireless part to be "disabled" but I am very suspicious as to whether it still leaks radiation when supposedly disabled. Short of buying an EMF meter and scanning it, is there any way to know for sure if the signals have truly been disabled? I realize all electrical items emit low level electromagnetic radiation, but I would like to minimize excessive exposure where possible. Would wrapping it in tin-foil block the signals, acting like a Faraday cage? 92.233.64.26 (talk) 16:36, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Almost all devices using electricity leak some radiation, even the wiring in your house and we are all bombarded with radiation all the time. The contribution from a router with the wireless part turn off will be very small, no worse than any other electronic device on your home.  Most devices these days carry a FCC Declaration of Conformity notice somewhere on their casing or perhaps in with the manuals and so on.  The UK equivalent is the CE marking.  These declarations are to certify that the electromagnetic interference from the device is under limits approved by the relevant body.  Unless you routinely cover all your gadgets with tin-foil, I wouldn't bother picking out the router specifically.  Astronaut (talk) 16:51, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * As I said, realize all electrical items emit low level electromagnetic radiation. However, the router is being singled out because it emits additional and far stronger radiation when operating in wireless mode, and disabling wireless mode may not disable the radiation. For all I know it might just scramble the signal to prevent other wireless devices detecting and connecting to it, giving the illusion that it has been disabled, but still emitting the same strong radiation. 92.233.64.26 (talk) 17:34, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Do you have any evidence that the radiation from your router is even harmful? The Wireless electronic devices and health article says that the UK's HPA says there is “...no reason why schools and others should not use WiFi equipment.” and "Dr Michael Clark, of the HPA, says published research on mobile phones and masts does not add up to an indictment of WiFi."  Domestic routers have a signal range of up to 100 metres in my experience (by comparison, the radiation emitted by a mobile phone needs to travel a few km to the nearest cell mast).  You might also find Wi-Fi interesting to read.  It is also probably worth pointing out that, even if you shield your router, you are unlikely to be able to shield yourself from your neighbours' equipment - my PC can detect 54 other routers, presumably all the neighbours in my apartment complex.  However, I doubt you are going to be able to tell whether your wireless is really and truly off without using some sophisticated detection equipment - you could always ask the manufacturer.  On the other hand, if you are "very suspicious" that off is really off, would you actually believe them?  Astronaut (talk) 19:08, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you for refuting my irrational fears of electromagnetic radiation. They have been sufficiently placated and I now firmly believe that wireless radiation is entirely safe for all the family. However my two main questions remain unanswered;
 * Other than an EMF meter, are there any ways to detect whether a device is emitting strong electromagnetic radiation?
 * Will tin-foil act like a Faraday cage and block radiation from wireless equipment? 92.233.64.26 (talk) 19:42, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Astronaut answered your first question in the last sentence of his answer. The second is answered at Tin foil hat. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:00, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * "some sophisticated detection equipment" is a little vague though, and I was already aware of that fact; I know about EMF meters, as I specifically mentioned them in my post - what I was asking is if there are things other than EMF meters which can detect it? Even diy solutions like modifying an old radio or something 92.233.64.26 (talk) 20:22, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * If you are interested in a practical, professional solution where you get a router which does not emit more EM than is necessary, you should set out to buy a router that simply doesn't have such a feature. It isn't an uncommon for small routers in some business environments to not have 802.11. For example, businesses in some security conscious sectors like healthcare and finance may flatly forbit any wireless-capable equipment to be on the premises, and places where EM interference is an issue (such as medical imaging or explosives) forbid all things radio. Makers like Draytek (I'm not recommending them specifically, but they're pretty well regarded) feature wireless and no-wireless versions of the same router, for this reason. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 19:56, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Thank you for the link, and the information about environments where wireless equipment is universally considered unacceptable. That is very useful information and will hopefully help avoid the "it's safe/it isn't safe/you're a crackpot" debate in the future. Indeed I should have known better than to give background to my question here, as it is obvious in hindsight that was the direction it would go. 92.233.64.26 (talk) 20:22, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * You can easily find non-WiFi routers at e.g. Amazon. Or at Cisco ;-). But you need to specify if you want an ADSL or Cable modem with it, or a pure ethernet router (in which case you probably really want a switch), or something else. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 22:52, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I have an 8 port ethernet switch already but it doesn't have its own mac address as far as I know, so the problem would be that if I plugged the cable modem into the switch it would see several computers might lock onto the wrong ones mac address. And even if it locked onto the right one, the traffic for the other computers would have to go through the computer the modem locked onto and back out the same port into the switch again before reaching the other computers which would reduce the available bandwidth 92.233.64.26 (talk) 23:09, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

How to access a WPS wirelessly?
If you have the PIN of your WPS (it's enabled, and it's not push-buttom), how do you connect to the router? Do you need anything else? Is there an IP like http://192.168.1.1/ to change the settings? Comploose (talk) 19:23, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * it's absolutely impossible to connect through wireless with WPS only. You always need a cable. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.78.62.32 (talk) 19:28, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Not according to Wi-Fi Protected Setup it isn’t. ¦ Reisio (talk) 16:08, 6 September 2012 (UTC)

starting a new internet forum
So, I want to attempt to host an online forum, maybe with some other parts attached too when I get around to it, however I'm not sure how. I was reccomended webs.com, but my site might have a little 18+ material at times, and it seems that is against their terms of use, so I'd need somewhere else. I do have a website, but I have no idea what I'm doing there at all, I'm not even sure how to get into the part where I say what I want on the site. So, what do I do?

79.66.110.76 (talk) 19:35, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * You could create a new sub-reddit on Reddit (details). Or you could create a mailing list on Yahoo Groups. I think you could do this on Facebook too, but I don't understand their content and privacy policies well enough to know whether that would match your requirements. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:04, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * There are free forum hosts available. I am a member of a forum which is hosted at http://www.zetaboards.com/ although with free hosts, you will most likely be restricted as to what you can post. For example http://www.zetaboards.com/ have a no pornography policy.  Another option is to use your own webspace and host the forum yourself using PhpBB.  This way you can pretty well do what you want. --TrogWoolley (talk) 12:31, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Share internet connection with ad hoc network
Two computers: A with linux, B with windows 7. B has an internet connection, A does not. I would like to connect A to the internet via an ad-hoc network on B. This works fine if I set up an open (i.e. without password) ad-hoc network on B with "share internet connection" enabled and then connect to it from A. However if I try the same with a WEP or WAP protected ad-hoc network it does not work, i.e. I cannot connect to the internet. Is there anything extra I need to do in order to make it work? On linux I am running the following commands: "iwconfig wlan0 essid adhoc", "iwconfig wlan0 mode Ad-Hoc", "ifconfig wlan0 192.168.137.5 up", "iwconfig wlan0 key s:secret", "route add default gw 192.168.137.1". I read that connecting to a WAP ad-hoc network with linux is tricky, but I'd expect that at least the WEP would work. bamse (talk) 20:48, 4 September 2012 (UTC)
 * I figured it out. bamse (talk) 19:33, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Learning C# after Java / C++
I already routinely use C++ and Java, and I have a good OO foundation. However, an upcoming project will require me to use C#. What is the best way to go about learning C# programming, without stating from a "novice programming" level? I'm mainly concerned with "How is this different from what I already know?" I'd prefer on online (especially free) solution to buying a dead-tree book, if at all possible. Also, this project will be done using Mono (which I will also need to learn), not Visual Studio. Thanks! - SigmaEpsilon → Σ Ε 22:48, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Microsoft Developer Network (MSDN) is the best resource I know for C# documentation; especially if you're already familiar with fundamental concepts of programming. There are C# "Walkthroughs" that will familiarize you with the APIs and methodologies for common tasks; there are "Getting Started" guidebooks; and there are API references for the standard libraries in .NET.  I'm not specifically familiar with Mono; but the language is the same, and the system libraries are similar (they are intended, at least, to be compatible with Microsoft's .NET system); I'd start with the official Mono Start webpage.  They have links from there to the API references and several getting-started documents.  Nimur (talk) 02:31, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

Strange delimiters in HTTP?
When I go to cloudflare.com and go to view source. I can see that the start is and the end is but, when sending a raw HTTP request I can see there are some numbers at the beginning between the headers and the content, and: 1

0 at the end of the content.. Am I missing something? 190.158.212.204 (talk) 23:39, 4 September 2012 (UTC)


 * That's the chunked transfer encoding. -- BenRG (talk) 23:58, 4 September 2012 (UTC)