Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2013 December 27

= December 27 =

Gfortran download with a disastrous result
Hi there. I hope I am somewhat recognizable now. StuRat has been teaching me some basics here. :-) Anyhow yesterday I took a precautionary measure: took an image of all my OS and tonight decided to download Gfortran. Through a number of steps I got here: binaries. BTW, there seems to be two options there: source code and binaries. I chose binaries. Then I chose Windows, then Mingw-w64. What got me suspicious was that after a few additional steps I got to "DOWNLOAD" button, clicked on it, there was another download button, then another, then I think one more with every page promising that the download will start in a moment. Eventually I got panicky and tried to abort the process. It turned out impossible and I finally realized that I downloaded malicious software. What it did, it changed my home page in IE. I went to Internet options, tried to change the home page manually it turned out impossible to do. I mean the system completely ignored my homemade page: www.msn.com and kept giving me an almost empty page with a search window (narrow) and periodic ads: buy this or buy that. I had to search for half an hour where that crappy stuff got into and found that it had two locations: one was conduit, the other search project. Finally I uninstalled both.

I would appreciate if StuRat or someone else with experience would post the exact links I should go to. Maybe that will prevent big trouble. Thanks--AboutFace 22 (talk) 01:30, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Barring browser flaws, downloading malicious software should not matter. It's only when you run the malicious software that you start to have problems. Nil Einne (talk) 04:18, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * It's hard to know what happened, but you may have clicked on an ad containing a fake download button (see, ). If so, I think you should install an ad blocker or learn to distinguish those ads from real download buttons, since always asking people for direct links probably isn't sustainable, and on many sites it's impossible to provide a working direct link anyway. I looked through the available mingw files, but I'm not sure which one you want, so I can't help with the direct link in this case. -- BenRG (talk) 04:22, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, it sounds like this is exactly what happened. Unfortunately, when they sell advertising space on their web site, they have no idea what the advertisers will put there.  Therefore, you have to be very careful when you click on a download button.  I'd encourage you to give it another try, but this time avoid clicking the ad you must have hit last time.  Sorry for all the trouble it caused, and you were very smart to set a restore point first. StuRat (talk) 11:54, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

I suggest to look at http://www.google.com/#q=conduit%20malware%20removal results. --CiaPan (talk) 13:49, 27 December 2013 (UTC)

Thank you. All comments are useful. Tonight I will try it again but much more carefully.--AboutFace 22 (talk) 19:54, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Best of luck ! StuRat (talk) 14:36, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Well, the drama continues. Too tired last night to do anything computer-wise I turned my machine on this morning and lo and behold saw a message: "You Windows is unable to restart. We can try to restart it from a system restoration disk." (not a verbatim quote). StuRat misunderstood me in the paragraph above. I did not use the restoration points to get rid of malware. Instead I located and deleted executables. Thus now I am not sure I did a thorough job. Although I "uninstalled programs" perhaps some other suckers remained (registers or whatnot). Sure, this morning after I saw that disheartening message I inserted my system restoration disk made a couple of days ago and five minutes later the windows is running again. Many thanks --AboutFace 22 (talk) 16:13, 28 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, if they are actually trying to hide bits from you, then the system restore is the way to go. Again, kudos for making restore point before doing the download.  StuRat (talk) 16:19, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Google Search iOS app is a browser, no? Apple terms say apps can't reproduce core iOS functions (like Safari, no?)
I thought I had heard that the reason there's no FireFox app for iDevices is because part of Apple's App Store terms of service is that apps can't reproduce apps that already come standard with their devices, like Safari or Messages. But isn't the Google search app pretty much a browser? Is there any other reason/technicality that Google can do this but Joe Individualdeveloper can't than money and clout? 20.137.2.50 (talk) 17:19, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * I'm not well informed about this, but I know that third party apps can use iOS's HTML renderer. That's what Chrome for iOS does. Firefox is not WebKit-based, so it would probably be much more difficult to make a "Firefox for iOS". -- BenRG (talk) 20:10, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Registered Apple developers are protected by the Apple Registered Developer Agreement. The last time I checked, additional terms and legal arrangements require a non-disclosure agreement for registered developers in the iOS program.  So, like many other things, chances are good that "what you heard" on the internet is hearsay, and might not be an accurate representation of any legally binding terms.
 * If Joe Individual Developer has a question about terms of use regarding his work as an iOS developer, he ought to ask Developer Technical Services (as described in the agreement and documented on the Developer page), where he will get better answers than Wikipedia can possibly provide. Nimur (talk) 00:50, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

What is the price of youtube trueview instream?
What is the price of youtube trueview instream?201.78.217.183 (talk) 21:02, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Customers in Brazil can get information on advertising with Google by calling 0800 724 6650 Rojomoke (talk) 23:21, 27 December 2013 (UTC)
 * So, the price isnt fixed??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.78.156.28 (talk) 17:27, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Microsoft virtual PC and linux
My recent posts and comments they elicited have lead me to launder this idea. What if I install Microsoft Virtual PC on my Windows 7 OS and then Linux OS on top of it. (1) Will it slow my execution speed down significantly? (2) I will have to probably learn a lot of new stuff to explore the new OS. How difficult would it be? What is the volume of this "new knowledge?" Would it be "cost effective?" (3) Any other possible warnings about hidden underwater rocks in this project? Thanks --AboutFace 22 (talk) 21:39, 27 December 2013 (UTC)


 * 1) Yes, emulators slow things down dramatically. Alternatively, I suggest you set up your PC for dual boot system, so only one is running at a time.  If you have two hard drives, you can put Windows on one and Linux on the other, and select the boot device to control which one starts up.  Or, you can have it boot into Windows normally and use a boot disk to get Linux.


 * 2) Yes, Linux is a fair amount to learn, for a PC user. Depending on what variant of Linux you get, some require a lot of work just to do basic things.  For example, downloads often require many steps, and they lack a download manager to do it all for you quickly.


 * 3) Transferring/sharing files between Windows and Linux can sometimes be a bit painful, as they may use different file structures, again depending on your Linux install. StuRat (talk) 14:34, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Products like Virtual PC generally have very low "emulation" overhead—see below. -- BenRG (talk) 14:47, 28 December 2013 (UTC)


 * (1) If you mean the speed of (say) gfortran programs in a Linux VM versus on native Windows, probably not, since Virtual PC (and its competitors VirtualBox and VMware) run user processes directly on the CPU. But if the Fortran code needs more RAM than you allocated to the virtual machine, and Linux ends up swapping, it will be much slower. If you mean the speed of other Windows applications while Linux is running, again no unless you've starved them of RAM by giving it to the VM. (2) This depends entirely on why you're doing this in the first place. If it's just to run gfortran without malware, the effort will probably be fairly small, but I still think it isn't cost effective unless gfortran is substantially better on Linux (I don't know) or the side effect of experiencing Linux has value to you. -- BenRG (talk) 14:47, 28 December 2013 (UTC)


 * Gfortran should be identical, or nearly so, on both platforms. StuRat (talk) 16:21, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Hello. StuRat gave me an excellent idea: to use a second disk. I do have one and even have an OS sitting on it I haven't used for a long time: Windows Server 2008. I've lost the password. So, now I can format the disk and install Linux if that will give me additional safety. Also I will need to edit the bootstrap file which I had done long time ago many times but now do not really recall how to do it. So, I do have my work cut out for me. Thanks again. --AboutFace 22 (talk) 16:41, 28 December 2013 (UTC)


 * There are several advantages for using a virtual machine instead of dual-booting:
 * You can run both machines simultaneously, including cutting and pasting between them.
 * The VM runs with the privileges of the host machine user, which means you can restrict its access to the host PC files.
 * You can easily backup/restore/snapshot the VM at any time, by just copying one file on the host - very useful if you're experimenting.
 * Mitch Ames (talk) 07:54, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

If all you really want is a unix like command line and a full suite of unix tools then cygwin is an excellent option. This gives you a window on your PC with a unix shell and a library which allows most unix programs to be compiled on a windows box. There is a package management system which lets you install most of the things you need, gcc, X etc and you can run it at the same time as your windows programs.--Salix alba (talk): 08:49, 29 December 2013 (UTC)

Thank you Mitch and Salix for your input. It is interesting. I have another questions. Let's suppose I installed a virtual machine. Will I be able to use Microsoft Visual Studio for instance which will remain in the Win 7 domain area? How about other useful program (e.g. Sql Server) I have here? Do I have to reinstall them on VM? Thanks --AboutFace 22 (talk) 16:08, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * I fear you may be getting too many conflicting answers. If you want to use your existing machine then I agree with StuRat on a duel boot (and to be doubly sure you can install VitualBox on the second as a VM). As StuRat's points out (3) Transferring/sharing files between Windows and Linux can sometimes be a bit painful but Linux VM to Linux OS host and back again is painless (as Mitch Ames points out). However, you won't be able to run any windows apps whilst  it is running. If you use a windows VM, then you're back to painful experiences and wasted time. Which is why, I suggested before, that time-wise (and time is money) it would be better to obtain a spare machine, solely running Linux. If you choose the second hard drive option, then consider a very stable (and user-friendly to newbies) version called Linux Mint. There is a Youtube introduction to installing it on a second drive here:. The problem with Cygwin as I see it is Quote: Keep in mind that Cygwin can only do as much as the underlying OS supports. Because of this, Cygwin will behave differently, and exhibit different limitations, on the various versions of Windows.    This equals: more pain and lost time, for the newbie if he uses windows as his host. I fear you may be getting too many conflicting answers. If you want to use your existing machine then I agree with StuRat on a duel boot (and to be doubly sure you can install VitualBox on the second as a VM). As StuRat's points out  (3) Transferring/sharing files between Windows and Linux can sometimes be a bit painful but Linux VM to Linux OS host and back again is painless (as Mitch Ames points out). However, you won't be able to run any windows apps whilst  it is running. If you use a windows VM, then you're back to painful experiences and wasted time. Which is why, I suggested before, that time-wise (and time is money) it would be better to obtain a spare machine, solely running Linux. If you choose the second hard drive option, then consider a very stable (and user-friendly to newbies) version called Linux Mint. There is a Youtube introduction to installing it on a second drive here:. The problem with Cygwin as I see it is Quote: Keep in mind that Cygwin can only do as much as the underlying OS supports. Because of this, Cygwin will behave differently, and exhibit different limitations, on the various versions of Windows.    This equals: more pain and lost time, for the newbie if he uses windows as his host. Windows is for running Microsoft approved applications and since the sources code is hidden, one does know  what little surprises one is going to come up against next. --Aspro (talk) 19:56, 29 December 2013 (UTC)


 * "Let's suppose I installed a virtual machine. Will I be able to use Microsoft Visual Studio ... Do I have to reinstall them on VM?
 * If you want to run software on the VM, then you need to install it on the VM, even if it is already installed on the host. From a software installation perspective, the VM is logically like a separate physical machine, potentially seeing some or all of the host hard drive as a network drive. (My experience is mostly Windows VM running on Windows host with host directories visible as network shares on VM, but I've also run Linux VM on Windows host without sharing drives.) Mitch Ames (talk) 10:10, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Aspro, thank you. You gave me a comprehensible analysis of many options. Your paragraph should be studied. As always, thanks to StuRat. The question about the software running on VM I consider somewhat naïve in retrospect. I should have answered it myself actually. It looks like I will run Linux of VirtualBox perhaps on Hyper V on my WinServ2008. --AboutFace 22 (talk) 02:12, 31 December 2013 (UTC)