Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2016 July 28

= July 28 =

Computer can't detect other computers on network when conected on wireless router.
I have a network here and the network was just wired, the internet modem was connected to a switch where the computer put their wires on.

We decided to include wireless and we plugged a wireless router on the switch.

The problem is: If you join the network by wireless conection or by plugging your network cord on the wireless router, this specific computer will just be able to see others computers plugged on the same router (by wireless or not), if I want to look at the others computers at the same network, i must do it by ip.

PS: Internet works fine no matter if I plug on the wireless router or switcher.

What can be the problem here?201.79.56.232 (talk) 13:21, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * It probably does not matter here, but next time you have an IT-related question, try to be more specific. What are the router's specifications? What operating systems do the computers use? How many of them are located on which point of the network? What does it mean to "see" other computers?
 * You are putting routers in series and trying to set up a local area network where every router can see everything. That is a hard thing to do because the default router configs are probably to have two modes, (1) internet access, (2) scan all other ports of the router. This means that if you are connected to router W (Wifi), itself plugged in router M (modem), you need to tell W to ask M if they have someone plugged in.
 * This is probably not in the standard configuration. Maybe you expected routers to be just "cable splitters", but it is a bit more complex (they need to keep track of which packet goes where when multiple computers connect on the internet, for instance).
 * On the other hand, depending on what you really want, there are multiple possible solutions, by increasing order of difficulty and decreasing order of convenience:
 * Plug all the computers that need to communicate on a single router (duh), either W or M.
 * Use the IP connection. It should not be much slower, as the access point just behind M (or even M itself) will just loop back the request to the correct place. If you know how to do it, perform a traceroute to know which it is - it may matter, because the access point may charge for data (I am not sure about a loopback though).
 * Set up port forwarding (or rather "adress-forwarding") telling M that some traffic coming from W ought to be redirected to other plugged-in computers. This requires more network knowledge than I am capable of, but maybe someone knows some pre-packaged software for that? Tigraan Click here to contact me 17:54, 28 July 2016 (UTC)

Win 10 Upgrade & Win 7 updates
Before upgrading my laptop operating system (Win7 Home Premium) to Windows 10, is it necessary to have all other Win7 updates  installed? As an aside, the free upgrade end date is 29 July in the US (which I didn't realise) as according to the countdown here, there is still about 33 hours and some minutes to go. 220  of  Borg 14:47, 28 July 2016 (UTC) • Did you just do the update via the 'standard method' the 'GWX' Win'10 upgrade 'box', as I was thinking of going the 'media creation tool' ISO download route. If the former, how long did the download take, if you can recall.
 * As I understand, not. Ruslik_ Zero 20:59, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * You MUST have Service Pack SP1 installed. If you've at all times kept up to date, it will already be present. Akld guy (talk) 21:48, 28 July 2016 (UTC)
 * More queries:Thanks for info guys. Yes I do have SP1 installed.
 * • I was thinking of creating another set of restore DVDs before the free Win' 10 upgrade (or maybe a USB this time), then I realised what I really needed was a HDD disk  image. Any good free downloadable software anyone could suggest?
 * • Does the upgrade 'preserve' all programs like games etc, or do these need to be (shudder) re-installed after the Win' 10 upgrade? (≈32 hours to go!) --220  of  Borg 01:45, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Last year, I did the upgrade on two Win7 laptops. The first went smoothly and from memory (and without starting the laptop to confirm), all non-essential stuff was moved into a new folder, C:\Windows.old. The second went smoothly but the sound driver was incompatible with 10 and no upgrade of the driver was available, so I reverted that laptop to 7. There are sites online that will tell you how to do that. I later tried twice to install new sound drivers and did the upgrade to 10 both times, but neither solution worked and I was forced to revert to 7 both times. It's very easy to revert, and even after the 3 reverts no trace of 10 remains. It's just a click and wait and reboot, so you can have confidence that it's all reversable. Akld guy (talk) 04:05, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the feedback & your personal experience (even without references ).
 * • I mean, it is 'just' a big update isn't it? Not like a whole new operating system? (≈28 hours to go!) -220  of  Borg 05:34, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Just to add that you only have 31 days to revert the Windows 10 "upgrade". After Microsoft forced the upgrade on me I didn't find this out until it was too late. I and a lot of other people have had constant trouble with it. And yes, some games such as FreeCell that come with Win 7 will disappear as they are not compatible, but you can probably find compatible versions and download them.--Shantavira|feed me 07:07, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I did it via the GWX offer. I can't remember how long it took. Akld guy (talk) 08:36, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Ok thanks. Akld guy., it sounds like you got the upgrade without meaning to? I hear that the 'close window' X turned into a 'download now' button at one stage? And what sort of problems has it caused? (≈22.5 hours to go!)- 220  of  Borg 11:25, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * The problems seem to vary from one PC to another. Ever since the "upgrade" my printer only works sporadically (and yes the driver is up to date). When it stops I have to restart the PC to get it going again. And every time I restart all my desktop icons have disappeared and I have to right click the desktop to get them back. Also I get constant alerts about low battery in my keyboard, which it is not. I have tried multiple solutions to no avail.--Shantavira|feed me 06:45, 30 July 2016 (UTC)
 * thanks for that info, my laptop is getting on (`5 years old!) so I have concerns. Don't have a printer right now though. Fingers crossed..--220  of  Borg 15:22, 30 July 2016 (UTC)

Download 'follies'
WT$! Despite what the countdown timer on the Microsoft site says, I clicked on the GWX icon on my laptop and now it says "Sorry, the free upgrade offer has ended" Note, I am in Australia so UTC+10. I am pissed off now! False 'advertising'?--220  of  Borg 19:13, 29 July 2016 (UTC)
 * That website seems to 'cue' off your PC local clock setting. I have now set my PC clock back a day, and, the GWX box now says I have about 18 hours, 40 minutes and the website says 1 day, 14 hours, 40 minutes. Wonder if it will download? 220  of  Borg 19:22, 29 July 2016 (UTC)


 * One interesting factoid I found out, after the 'deadline' passed was that it was based on 29 July Hawaiian time, UTC-10, here on east coast Oztralia  its UTC+10.

• I had an online whinge chat with a Microsoft support person and he said "Yeah you go ahead and install the windows 10 and can also activate it no issue". Hmmm, :-/ • There is also this and upgrade for customers who use assistive technologies which may help anyone who has missed the 'deadline'. --220  of  Borg 15:22, 30 July 2016 (UTC)
 * • "All upgrades must have completed and reached the "Welcome" screen by 11:59 PM UTC-10 (Hawaii) on July 29; this is one worldwide point in time" (third point on page)
 * • I am, via the Microsoft 'media creation tool', downloading the upgrade now to a USB stick. Downloading rather slowly, it was only at 30 % after 2.5 hours!
 * Well, after about 6 hours the download finally finished, but it's now saying I need a product key. (Which I presume  I'd have to pay for. Not happy. )  This was not mentioned in 20 minutes of on-line chat with Microsoft 'support'. "... activate it no issue." they said, sure, if I pay apparently! Sigh! Having just used up a quarter of my monthly download, I don't want to have to download it again via the 'assistive technologies' route. At least I got a reference number for the chat and can follow this up, again. :-/ - 220  of  Borg 20:08, 30 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I'm unclear exactly what you're trying to do. If the computer already has a qualifying copy of Windows installed and activated, and you don't mind simply installing from that Windows, you should be able to simply run the setup.exe on the USB key from within that copy of Windows and it will install without asking for a key. At least it still works when I tried it just now. (Well I don't have your exact USB, but I'm pretty sure any media with any RTM or post version that is the correct edition to upgrade your current Windows should work.)
 * If the computer does not have a qualifying copy of Windows installed and activated or you don't want to install from within Windows you've never officially been able to activate without entering a key (or already having a digital entitlement). In fact, prior to the Threshold update (1511), it wasn't possible to do this point blank without a Windows 10 key or having activated Windows 10 on the computer before (and so gained a digital entitlement).
 * Since the Threshold update, it's been possible to simply input the qualifying Windows 7, 8 or 8.1 key and install from a booted installer at least before the end of the period yesterday. I do not have any more valid keys, so I have no idea if this still works although from what I've read suspect it does. Note that they key will need to be a unique unused qualifying key. If the key is used, you'd need to be installing it on the "same" (i.e. same hardware ID) computer. If you have an OEM copy of Windows 7, the internal Windows key would likely be the OEM key, so you need the proper unique key from the COA (or possibly documentation). From Windows 8 onwards, the unique key itself is stored in the BIOS/EFI by OEMs so will normally be obtained by the installer and doesn't need to be inputed. If it's a retail key or upgrade key, you'd still need to input it yourself, perhaps obtaining it from the old copy of Windows if you don't remember it and can't find the records.
 * Nil Einne (talk) 03:37, 31 July 2016 (UTC)
 * This is the sort of info I have been looking for! Yes, I do have a qualifying OS, Win 7 Premium, SP1 was preloaded on my laptop when I bought it new, and it is activated. I haven't actually tried installing Win 10 yet. I did try to image my HDD via Windows backup before I started downloading, but got an error with Bitlocker and it didn't work. I want to try to do that first before upgrading.
 * I imagine I would be upgrading from "within Windows", would I otherwise reboot from the USB rather than as normally from the HDD? Or is there another way?
 * • COA, Certificate of Authenticity, the sticker on the bottom of the laptop right?--220  of  Borg 05:08, 31 July 2016 (UTC)
 * If Windows 7 came preloaded, it's likely the built in key is simply a non unique OEM key so it won't be accepted by the installer meaning using some key recovery program isn't useful. But the COA which is the sticker on the PC should have a unique key on it which I think the Windows installer will accept if you boot from the USB and start the install process from there. (At least it used to before the end of July.) Failing that, starting the install process within Windows should still work provided the copy of Windows is eligible for an upgrade including activated. (It doesn't matter that it only has the OEM key.) If you start the install process from Windows you can either choose to keep all your programs or do an almost clean install and keep nothing. IIRC there will also be an option to only keep documents etc. Whatever you choose, you generally should still have the option to downgrade back to Windows 7 for 30 days or whatever it is. Note that this requires there is enough space. The Windows.old directory which stores the old content may be deleted if you run low on space and also in certain other cases (e.g. you can choose to delete it via the built in Disk Cleanup).  The biggest difference starting the install by booting from the USB is you can do a completely clean install i.e. deleting the entire Windows partition (or the whole drive) and start fresh that way. I think you could also choose to set-up a dualboot setup if you have the prerequisites (partition or whatever etc) but I can't comment on whether that's technically allowed by the licence if you're using the same licence for both.  Either way, imaging is a good idea if there's anything you want to keep or if you may want to go back since things can always go wrong. (Of course since the content could be lost at any time for various reasons, you should already have a backup of the important stuff anyway even if perhaps not the Windows and lesser content you'd prefer to keep but can afford to lose.)  Nil Einne (talk) 12:14, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

XPATH query
I have an XML file (produced by a third-party application, so I can't change the format), which is as follows:  C:\SourceFiles\SourceFile1.txt C:\DestFiles\DestFile1.txt C:\SourceFiles\SourceFile2.txt C:\DestFiles\DestFile2.txt ... etc 

In other words, the only thing determining which source goes with which destination is the order the elements appear in the document. What I'm doing at the moment is:

IXMLDOMNodeList ndlSources = docFiles.getNodeList("CopyFiles/SourceFile"); IXMLDOMNodeList ndlDests = docFiles.getNodeList("CopyFiles/DestFile"); foreach (IXMLDOMElement eltSource in ndlSources) IXMLDOMElement eltDest = ndlDests.nextNode; String SourceFile = eltSource.text; String DestFile = eltDest.text;

and hoping that the two lists stay in synch, despite the tendency of Certain Users to fiddle about with things despite being told not to. What I'd like to do is set the XPATH query so that it only returns SourceFile elements that are followed by a DestFile element - ideally, one that would return SourceFile/DestFile pairs, but if I can at least ensure that both node lists are the same length, and any unmatched elements are omitted, the system will be a great deal more robust. I suspect the answer will involve "following-sibling", but I'm not knowledgeable enough to actually construct the query. Any suggestions? Tevildo (talk) 21:45, 28 July 2016 (UTC)