Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2011 September 22

= September 22 =

Is Morrissey's line in The Smiths' Cemetry Gates antisemitic?
"There's always someone somewhere, with a big nose, who knows, who trips you up and laughs when you fall."

Morrissey has a history of making racist statements and the 'big nose' is a Jewish stereotype.--Nothingeverhappensever (talk) 21:36, 22 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Or he could be talking about someone simply being nosy. Dismas |(talk) 22:25, 22 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Was there any other indication of antisemitism or disdain for Jews in the book? If not, chances are no. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie &#124; Say Shalom! 23:56, 22 September 2011 (UTC)


 * It's not a book, it's a song by the band The Smiths whose lead singer was named Morrissey. Am I seriously getting that old that people don't know who The Smiths were anymore?  I don't know what Morrissey meant in the song in question, but Morrissey has some background on similar controversies regarding his lyrical choices.  It should also be noted that describing Morrissey as "enigmatic" is something of an understatement.  Personally, I think Morrissey can be intentionally provocative and aloof, but I don't know that there is definitive evidence that he's racist.  When asked directly, he does appear to have steadfastly denied any such charges.  -- Jayron  32  00:10, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Nah, I just don't have a good musical knowledge. :p Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie &#124; Say Shalom! 00:17, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think it is antisemitic. Why would reference to someone with a big nose be antisemitic? Bus stop (talk) 00:26, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Stereotypes of Jews. Avic ennasis @ 01:04, 24 Elul 5771 / 01:04, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * "Why do Jews have such big noses?" ... "Because air is free!" ←baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:34, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Eh, I've heard that joke a few times, was funny the first time. I was thinking of asking that as a serious question here. Why do many of us seem to, in fact, have large noses? (I had a honker till I had it fixed :p) Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie &#124; Say Shalom! 03:43, 23 September 2011 (UTC)
 * The different shapes of noses of different races and ethnic groups must have been studied somewhere along the way. The "Jewish" type of nose I would associate with the Mediterranean peoples in general, on all sides of it. The broad, flat nose more with African, Asian and Native American. The slender nose more with northern European. There must be some genetic advantage to particular nose shapes in particular climates. ←baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:51, 23 September 2011 (UTC)
 * It has to do with warming air in cooler climes. The Shape of a Nose. Only in the last sentence of that short article does it get to the point that might be relevant to this discussion: "Although you can’t tell much about the external shape of the nose when looking at its internal structure, a narrow, longer internal cavity is generally linked to a relatively narrower and more projecting nose..." Bus stop (talk) 03:57, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Personally I always thought it referred to a pratfall in slapstick comedy, which is (I think) more of a likely cultural reference than anti-Semitism. --TammyMoet (talk) 09:47, 23 September 2011 (UTC)
 * My fist association too was that of a clown's big red nose. Unless, of course, he's implying that the clowns are lying. ---Sluzzelin talk  10:28, 23 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Q. If you think a "big nose" means jewish then it may be you that has the prejudice issues?? Personally I always assumed it meant a negro. (joke). .. Seriously though. - it may be you in your innocence. Also why repost yahoo answers questions? - or is this coincidence? Imgaril (talk) 13:42, 24 September 2011 (UTC)
 * I had the same thought about connecting big noses with Jewishness - I know plenty of non-Jewish people with perfectly enormous hooters and several Jews with petite ones. I have heard it said that in Spain, a big nose is considered a sign of having an aristocratic bloodline. Alansplodge (talk) 14:49, 24 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Perhaps something to do with the so-called "noble Roman nose"? ←baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:41, 26 September 2011 (UTC)

America's Next Top Model, Cycle 17
Can I have some input or help with the America's Next Top Model, Cycle 17 article, I have tried to find sources for the "Episode summaries" and "Call out" lists but the only place that seems to list them is WP. Mt king  (edits)  23:47, 22 September 2011 (UTC)
 * At least for America's Next Top Model, Cycle 17, the summary seems to be a cut-and-paste copyvio of TV-links.eu, which in itself seems to be a poorly formatted copyvio of movieweb.com. Avic ennasis @ 01:01, 24 Elul 5771 / 01:01, 23 September 2011 (UTC)