Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2012 August 23

= August 23 =

NBA/NBAPA, NFL/NFLPA and NHL/NHLPA (Players Association--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 01:47, 23 August 2012 (UTC)) CBAs (Collective Bargaining Agreements)
What the heck has been happening with NBA/NBAPA, NFL/NFLPA and NHL/NHLPA (Players Association--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 01:47, 23 August 2012 (UTC)) CBAs (Collective Bargaining Agreements) ever since free agency came a factor? With all these lockouts and especially, the NHL last one (2004-`05 season long one) and etc. At the same time I'm excluding MLB/MLBPA because it seems like they have it under control ever since 2002. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mybodymyself (talk • contribs) 01:11, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Why exclude MLB? They're the second-most-recent major US league to have cancelled their playoffs (with the 1994 strike).  Additionally, I question whether "free agency" is a major contributor to the issue; I'd say effective collective bargaining and the ever-increasing amount of cash at stake is what's driving the labor disputes.  Certainly it's not relevant if you're restricting yourself to 2002 and later; free agency far predates that in all leagues mentioned. &mdash; Lomn 02:45, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for the revisions to my original question here. Yeah, you got a point here. I mean the last CBA between MLB and MLBPA was done in quietly. As to opposed when their strikes and lockouts.--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 02:56, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Indeed, the NFL is still the league which has gone the longest with not having missed any regular season games (they missed one preseason game last year due to the lockout). The NFL hasn't missed any real games due to labor issues since 1987, but prior to that they had three strikes, with actual games canceled in 1982 and 1987.  The National Football League Players Association covers all three strikes a bit, while you can find a wealth of detailed information at the website of the Professional Football Researchers Association, which is the preeminent NFL historical organization.  The history of labor relations in Major League Baseball is quite deep, starting with the Players' League, a short-lived league which arose out of a labor dispute between the Players Union and the two major leagues at the time (The National League and the American Association).  Other key events and figures which are closely tied to Labor relations in MLB include the Black Sox Scandal, the Reserve clause, the Curt Flood case (see Flood v. Kuhn), Andy Messersmith and the Seitz decision.  There have been many strikes and work stoppages in MLB, besides the 1994 season there were notable strikes in 1972, and 1981.  The NHL has had several lockouts and strikes, notably the 2004–05 NHL lockout when a whole season was lost, the 1994–95 NHL lockout which lost about half a season, and the 1992 NHL strike which was a short action.  The Ted Lindsay case, when he was driven out of Detroit for his efforts in organizing the NHLPA, is a compelling one.  The story of the National Hockey League Players' Association is also rather interesting given the number of NHLPA executives that have been criminally charged for their actvities while leading the Union, including Alan Eagleson and Ted Saskin.  The NBA, over history, has probably had the best labor peace, but it has had a Union the longest; it was also the league that first instituted a Salary Cap, which has tended to bring greater labor peace than other leagues (the NFLs own labor peace has also been tied to its salary cap), though the NBA has also had its share of lockouts and labor actions, in 1999 and 2011.  -- Jayron  32  03:20, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for further explanation into all of this and it helped.--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 23:53, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Is it a good/ bad sign when both parties meetings or whatever they are called don't go as planned?--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 23:51, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * What do you mean "go as planned." In any contract negotiation, each party plans to get what it wants.  The players want as much cash as possible, and the owners want to hold on to as much cash as possible.  I'm not sure what infomation you need.  Could you rephrase or expand your question?  -- Jayron  32  01:41, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Basically, what I meant is they break down or something else along those lines as opposed to anything else. Hope this helps, but thank you for the other info that you provided here.--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 04:32, 24 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Talks do frequently break down, but the results of that breakdown can vary. Sometimes, players will agree to play without a CBA, and other times there will be a labor action, either a lockout (if the owners don't want to let the players play without a contract) or a strike (if the players refuse to play without a contract).  I don't know what you mean by "bad sign".  Judging by fan/media reaction to the labor strife in American sports over the past several years, most fans seem to just want to watch games get played, and aren't particularly interested in the minutia of labor negotiations, so it's generally "bad" for the fans whenever games get cancelled.  As for whether it is good for players or owners, that depends on how much each side has to compromise to get a news contract.  -- Jayron  32  12:36, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for your recent answe to my question here and hmm interesting.--Jessica A Bruno (talk) 21:11, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Mercenaries: Playground of Destruction-unexplainable chinese lantern
After entering the Northern Province, enter the Chinese HQ. You only get one chance, but there's a lantern on Colonel Peng's Desk. pressing Y (Δ on PS2 but i have it for Xbox) will switch it on and off, and Peng says "That lamp belongs to the people of China. if you break it, i will deduct the cost from your contract." After this, it never gives you the option to switch it on again, you can do it as many times as you want while in the HQ at that time, but it doesnt seem to do anything useful. Does this have any real significance in the game? I couldnt figure out any use for this. the juggresurection (>-.-(Vಠ_ಠ) 20:52, 23 August 2012 (UTC) 19:50, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Looking at the Wikia Mercs Wiki, I don't see any mention of it. I think it's just there for atmosphere. Compare to Deus Ex, where a character complains that you went into the ladies toilet, or Half Life 2 where (10 year later) someone complains you mis-cooked their microwave dinner. Some video game characters are just there to whinge about trivia. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:28, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Ah, i see. Seems misleading to me, i sat there for 20 minutes clicking it on and off trying to break it. Thanks for answering my 5 year old question. the juggresurection  (>-.-(Vಠ_ಠ) 20:52, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

What is "The Elephant Song" on The Simpsons?
The episode is "Bart Gets an Elephant". I found a YouTube video but it was merely a parody and the song wasn't the right one.— Vchimpanzee  ·  talk  ·  contributions  · 20:31, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * The music under all that yelling is Popcorn (instrumental). I don't remember the specifics of that episode, but the Simpsons do love Mancini, and use Baby Elephant Walk in Dancin' Homer. -- Finlay McWalterჷTalk 20:37, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Definitely "Popcorn" under Bart yelling about where his elephant is. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:17, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * (ec) Is it not Baby Elephant Walk available here by the 20th Century's most storied classical composer, Henry Mancini? 20:38, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Finlay McWalter and Baseball Bugs, you watched the video, and that's not the episode. It is also not "Baby Elephant Walk".— Vchimpanzee  ·  talk  ·  contributions  · 21:00, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm only talking about the first video posted. I don't know the episode. One thing you all may or may not have noticed about the Mancini tune is that it ends with "Good Evening, Friends", kind of a lesser-known blurb than "Shave and a Haircut", but serves kind of the same purpose. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:29, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * If I've got the right scene then it's "Un homme et une femme" - . - JuneGloom    Talk  22:26, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Either way, we're back in the mid-60s. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:33, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

JuneGloom got it right! Thank you.— Vchimpanzee  ·  talk  ·  contributions  · 22:34, 23 August 2012 (UTC)

Neither the video as presented nor the music from the "parody" given is original to any simpsons episode. Baby elephant walk was on at least one early episode. Unless the OP is more specific, it will be hard to give the correct answer, but "popcorn" isn't it. μηδείς (talk) 22:36, 23 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Ah, yes, Un Homme et Une Femme is the music from that episode. μηδείς (talk) 22:58, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Great movie, too. Haven't seen it for decades. --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  06:16, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Promotional tour
How is a "promotional tour" different from a "concert tour"? We have 3 lists, but I can't find an explanation for what distinguishes them. Google hasn't helped (One result suggested that a promo tour is when an artist is primarily touring radio stations to get additional and live airplay. Our articles don't seem to follow this definition). Thanks. -- Quiddity (talk) 21:58, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * A promotional tour is a tour where someone is trying to get people to buy something. Authors go on promotional tours all the time to get you to buy a book.  A concert tour is a tour where someone is playing music in different places.  Insofar as people can use a concert tour to sell a new album, some (but not all) concert tours are promotional tours.  You can have concert tours where they just play music, and aren't trying to sell you a new album.  -- Jayron  32  22:09, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Is that described anywhere within Wikipedia? (Ie. somewhere that we would link promotional tour to, in the lead of those 3 lists.)
 * Is it [often/ever] a clear enough separation to base lists on?
 * Should more concert-lists be (in the future) split into 2 parts? Or, might it be good to consider merging those 3 existing promotional-tour-lists into their main concert-tour-lists?
 * (I'm not familiar with the topic-matter, so am looking for background and guidance :) Thanks again. -- Quiddity (talk) 23:55, 23 August 2012 (UTC)
 * No. All musical acts playing songs in a string of cities are on concert tours.  Some of these are promotional concert tours.  But noting the difference isn't really a big deal.  It's not of interest, really, why an act goes on tour (whether it's to promote a new album, as a "reunion" tour, just to make some scratch, etc.)  You're safe calling them all concert tours.  In any one article on a concert tour, it will often explain if the tour is in support of an album or not, but really, it is of small concern.  -- Jayron  32  01:38, 24 August 2012 (UTC)