Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2012 June 29

= June 29 =

The Natural Laws of Naming Songs
What would you call the fact that when you first hear a new song you can almost always guess its name with high accuracy without being told? How can this be explained? The phenomenon is not the same as a hook (music). The phenomenon is so strong that even songs like Desert Song by America (band), (whose hook is lah lah lalah lalah lah) even end up being renamed to A Horse With No Name. μηδείς (talk) 02:22, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Songs and poems are usually written with something that's kind of a central theme, and it sticks with us. Sometimes it's the actual title, sometimes not, but can "become" the title, as you say. There are exceptions. If you didn't already know the title, what would you imagine the title is for a 1960s song whose chorus is, "Stop, hey, what's that sound? Everybody look what's goin' down." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 02:36, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, there are exceptions. They are notable as exceptions.  According to the article, record exec Ertegun wanted to call it "Stop, hey, what's that sound".  I'd have called it "Stop", "What's That Sound?" or "What's Going 'Round".  Such a brilliant fucking song. μηδείς (talk) 03:06, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Professional singers tend to learn songs by their real titles, and the names of the songwriters, too. A singer friend of mine says that at least once a night someone will call out for a really well known song identified by the first line of the chorus and the name of the current performer. It will bring him to a halt each time. Bielle (talk) 03:24, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I suppose it might annoy me if someone insisted on listening to Дорогой длинною by Mary Hopkin. But you'd think knowing the first line of the chorus would be a point of professional pride. μηδείς (talk) 03:36, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * The halt is the time it takes him to run through the whole chorus until he gets to the right opening line. Bielle (talk) 04:09, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Heh, I thought you meant an absolute halt! μηδείς (talk) 04:51, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm reminded of how often old church hymn books would be indexed "by first line". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 03:46, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Compare papal bulls, known by their first few words which rarely give any clue to the subject matter. —Tamfang (talk) 05:00, 4 July 2012 (UTC)


 * There is also Good Riddance with its subtitle. μηδείς (talk) 05:42, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * There are some exceptions - songs that you could NEVER guess the title by listening to the lyrics; Bohemian Rhapsody, Song for Guy, Annie's Song and Unchained Melody spring to mind. Alansplodge (talk) 20:02, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * If you were hearing Beethoven's Ninth for the first time, with no clue what it was, it would probably be tough to guess. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 23:37, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Beethoven never had that problem, as he didn't hear a note of it despite conducting its first performance. They could have been playing the William Tell Overture for all he knew.  --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  06:14, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Sure. For example, it's a little known fact that right after the well-known powerful finale, the piccolo finished it by playing "Shave and a Haircut". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:02, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Your appetite for the abasement of the sublime apparently knows no bounds. :)  --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  23:22, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I got that joke from a Far Side cartoon. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 11:15, 1 July 2012 (UTC)

I wasn't aware that the Ninth was considered a song. But the piccolo comment did make me laugh out loud and almost spill my soda. μηδείς (talk) 03:23, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * It's obviously not a "song" under any rational definition of that word. But I've had too many discussions to count, where my opponents contend that any musical composition can validly be called a "song".  They generally come from the world of popular music, where 99% of all compositions are indeed songs.  But that doesn't make it true in other parts of the musical world.  They also tend to call any piece of music they identify as classical, even works containing no voices, as "opera", which shows how much they know.  Most music of this type is not opera.  Nor is it "heavy", the other usual epithet.  --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  03:56, 1 July 2012 (UTC)
 * You can't get much lighter than 4'33. Bielle (talk) 04:04, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Why is Symphony No. 9 (Beethoven) not a song if it is the first ever Choral symphony and contains singing? It incorporates Ode to Joy. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 04:23, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * From Song: A song may be for a solo singer, a duet, trio, or larger ensemble involving more voices. Songs with more than one voice to a part are considered choral works. ... the term is generally not used for large vocal forms including opera and oratorio.
 * Beethoven's 9th is a symphony that happens to include parts for 4 solo singers and a chorus (but in only the last of its 4 movements); it is not properly classified as a song for 4 voices and a chorus that happens to be accompanied by a symphony orchestra and has a half-hour instrumental introduction in 3 movements. There are plenty of songs in classical music, but this ain't one of them.  --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  06:03, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Ah but if you change the bolding you get A song may be for a solo singer, a duet, trio, or larger ensemble involving more voices. Songs with more than one voice to a part are considered choral works. ... the term is generally not used for large vocal forms including opera and oratorio. CambridgeBayWeather (talk) 06:11, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * You can call War and Peace a nursery rhyme if you like. No law against that.  It doesn't change what it actually is.  These labels only have any real use when applied according to the definitions that have been developed over a long time.  Just because Beethoven's 9th Symphony happens to include some vocal writing doesn't make it a song.  It is no more a song than a musical or an opera are songs.  They contain songs, but they are not themselves songs.  --  ♬  Jack of Oz  ♬  [your turn]  08:43, 1 July 2012 (UTC)
 * The Ninth contains singing but is not a song. Songs have been written from the choral part, including the church hymn "Joyful, Joyful We Adore Thee" - which, by the way, is one example from the hymnnal "first-lines" thing. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 11:18, 1 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I was in a restaurant-bar the other day and was trying to discern the name of a groovin' Huey Lewis song that I hadn't heard before. I strained to catch some lyrics, any lyrics, that I could at least Google, and funnily enough, the only phrase I could catch was the very title of the song. So perhaps when the lead singer gets to the central theme, they really enunciate the words well because of their centrality. Vranak (talk) 05:36, 3 July 2012 (UTC)

Cricket Premier League of Bangladesh
Who are the teams of this cricket league and when did this thing start? The teams I know are Mohammedan and Abahani. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.95.104.73 (talk) 14:05, 29 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Bangladesh Premier League. --TammyMoet (talk) 14:49, 29 June 2012 (UTC)