Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2015 June 6

= June 6 =

Scottish pop/rock stars who don't sing with a Scottish accent
It has been widely observed that when The Beatles sang, they sang with fake American accents--or at the very least, it was hard to detect any English accent in their vocals. Similarly, when Bono of U2 sings, you don't really hear much of his Irish accent.

But I can't think of any Scottish bands or singers where you can't hear their Scottish accents quite clearly. Are there any examples (examples should include people who clearly have a Scottish accent when they speak, but not when they sing) you are aware of?

The difference between the examples above could simply be that the Beatles and U2 deliberately courted huge, worldwide audiences and were very popular, whereas the Scottish bands I can think of tend to be "indie" or alternative bands with limited popularity.--Captain Breakfast (talk) 07:21, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Showing my age a bit here, but Elizabeth Fraser, Annie Lennox and Jim Kerr come immediately to mind, and I'm sure the list can be extended. Tevildo (talk) 08:03, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * The Bluebells, Rod Stewart (whose Scottishness is tenuous at best though), Franz Ferdinand, Lulu for starters. (Actually I'm pushed to find a Scottish band or singer that does sound Scottish, wonder if the OP is talking about folk singers?) --TammyMoet (talk) 09:16, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I suggest The Proclaimers and Runrig both sound Scottish - well they do to me. Scottish rock singers who don't sound Scottish include Bon Scott, George Young, Angus Young and Jimmy Barnes - they all sound Australian.  --TrogWoolley (talk) 16:27, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Hello, I was thinking Belle and Sebastian, Arab Strap (showing MY age) and, more recently We Were Promised Jetpacks. As I said, fairly "indie"-type bands but not completely obscure. All of their accents sound very thick to me when they sing. I'll have to think about Franz Ferdinand... As an American, they definitely sound foreign/British to me, but perhaps not Scottish. Does Annie Lennox speak with a Scottish accent?  That's kind of interesting.--Captain Breakfast (talk) 10:38, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I've heard radio interviews with all 3 on Tevildo's list and yes they all have Scottish accents. And The Proclaimers and Runrig are folk-based acts I'd say. I'd also say Biffy Clyro sound Scottish but not in the folk genre. --TammyMoet (talk) 17:55, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I believe Biffy Clyro was a big influence on We Were Promised Jetpacks (of whom I'm a big fan), and I reckon their vocal styles are similar. My knowledge of accents is limited, but whenever anyone sounds like a character from the movie Trainspotting (as opposed to phony Scottish accents from the Simpsons or Braveheart), then I automatically say, now that's a REAL Scottish accent.--Captain Breakfast (talk) 06:39, 8 June 2015 (UTC)


 * I'd like to see a source for the claim that the Beatles sang with "fake American accents". Singing tends to flatten out accents, unless someone is trying to deliberately sound ethnic. The Stones don't have much of a British twang when they sing. Sheena Easton sang a number of songs that gave no hint of her strong Scottish. Toni Tennille talks with a fairly strong southern U.S. accent, but it doesn't show up in her singing. The Beatles gave away their British when they would drop a trailing "R" sound. We used to laugh at "I Should Have Known Better", when they would sing, "Give me Moe, hey-hey-hey, give me Moe." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:19, 6 June 2015 (UTC)


 * The perception that the Beatles sang with American accents was quite widespread--see Alansplodge's quote below. My original research tells me that some performers allow their very British accents to shine through almost every syllable.  Take Liam Gallagher of Oasis or Damon Albarn of Blur/Gorillaz--or Morrissey, for that matter--and compare him to the Lennon/McCartney of the 60s, and tell me you don't hear the Britishness in every note (as opposed to sporadically or occasionally, as with the Beatles).--Captain Breakfast (talk) 06:32, 8 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Concur with BB here. If sources are difficult to find, examples of lyrics pronunciations by the Beatles that are distinctly American and not British would be appreciated. --NorwegianBluetalk 20:39, 6 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Also concur with BB. Try listening to Paul McCartney singing "In a Penny Lane the barber shaves another customer". Widneymanor (talk) 21:24, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Also the line from "No Reply": "This happened once befoe / When I came to your doe..." ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:41, 7 June 2015 (UTC)


 * I'd say they were attempting at least some aspects of American accents in a lot of their early songs: e.g. "somebody noo" at about 1:01 of Love Me Do, and the American vowel of "you think you've lost your love" in She Loves You. AndrewWTaylor (talk) 22:42, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * That "lost" reminds me of a TV Poirot episode: a character cries out, "My last shoe!" I think what? and then work out that she's meant to be American and not quite getting it right. —Tamfang (talk) 01:38, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * She must have been channeling her inner Ed Sullivan and his "really big shoe". Clarityfiend (talk) 08:02, 7 June 2015 (UTC)


 * User:Baseball Bugs, a reference from the horse's mouth: the Beatles interviewed by Pathe News on their return to London from their first American visit in 1964... Q: "Did they [the Americans] reckon you sang in an English accent or an American accent?" PAUL: "No, some fella said, 'How come, because you're from Britain, and you still sing in an American accent,' or something. We were trying to explain it to him.... oh, it was funny." Alansplodge (talk) 01:40, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * See also Rock'n America: A Social and Cultural History by Deena Weinstein (p. 102), "When the Beatles sang, they used a standard American accent". Alansplodge (talk) 01:44, 7 June 2015 (UTC)

Ah, Tevildo I wish I was that young but I seem to recall the Bay City Rollers didn't have a Scottish accent. CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 07:00, 7 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Possibly showing my age and my dubious musical taste here, but Kelly Marie didn't show much of a Scottish accent when singing Feels Like I'm In Love.  Hassocks  5489 (Floreat Hova!)  11:49, 8 June 2015 (UTC)
 * David Byrne? Ghmyrtle (talk) 12:05, 8 June 2015 (UTC)

I always found it fascinating that Gavin_Rossdale sounds like a dead ringer for Eddie_Vedder; I just assumed that he grew up listening to grunge, so when he sang, it came out sounding that way. OldTimeNESter (talk) 20:28, 9 June 2015 (UTC)

Shirley Manson from Garbage? --Canley (talk) 04:41, 11 June 2015 (UTC)

Monty Python televised comedy shows: laugh track or live audience?
Is the laughter on Monty Python televised comedy shows a laugh track or a live audience? Contact Basemetal   here  21:15, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Studio audience, like most UK TV comedy shows. If particular sketches fell flat on the night, they were cut. The externally filmed scenes were shown to the same audience during breaks to re-dress the set so that their reaction could be recorded as well. Nanonic (talk) 21:32, 6 June 2015 (UTC)


 * I read somewhere that one skit required numerous takes because one of the cast was drunk, and the audience's hurrahs when he finally got it right had to be cut. —Tamfang (talk) 01:32, 7 June 2015 (UTC)


 * Is there any British comedy with a laugh track at all? 82.21.7.184 (talk) 21:50, 6 June 2015 (UTC)
 * It's been against the Producer guidelines on BBC sitcoms since the 1990s and was rarely used before that (To the extent of broadcasting the imported series M*A*S*H without one, see M*A*S*H (TV series)). Even on other channels it's extremely rare on multi camera sitcoms. All channels finding it much easier to just offer free tickets to recordings. But, some (non sitcom) shows that are filmed entirely on location, have single camera setups or were made pre-1970s had canned laughter added. Clip-shows (You've Been Framed, XYZ do the funniest things) also use them regularly. Current sitcoms do sometimes have their audience tracks manipulated to louden the laughter or use the track from another take (as laughing in the same way and at the same point after the 10th take leads to a very unnatural and forced sound). As an aside - there are no BBC restriction on canned applause, as used on Top of the Pops for years and currently on the 'draw' sequences of the National Lottery broadcasts. Nanonic (talk) 22:34, 6 June 2015 (UTC)


 * The first few series of Red Dwarf were recorded before a live audience. There is a scene in the episode "Polymorph (Red Dwarf episode)" where Kryten is trying to take off Lister's ever shrinking underpants that has one of the loudest and most hilarious uproars that I have ever heard from an audience for a TV show. Then, at some point, a few series went without an audience, but, later series returned to having one. In one of the DVD commentaries or "making of" extras the actors mention how much they liked the return to having an audience. Especially in regards to the immediacy it brought to there performances. MarnetteD&#124;Talk 02:25, 7 June 2015 (UTC)