Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Entertainment/2017 April 26

= April 26 =

What film was that please?
In one scene a proud father introduces the pair of his offsprings to a visitor. The son can barely speak, even in his gibberish mumble-jumble due to insanely high number of piercing-rings he is wearing on almost every part of his face (including eyelids) - which are almost hidden behind 'em.

As for the girl, when dad mentions her talent at dancing, she gets inspired rather too quickly, fortunately finding a miscellaneous pole nearby, instantly starts showing off her talent thru a comically energetic form of strip-dancing of a most cheap style.

Can someone please be kind enough to let me know it's title?2405:205:408C:49B5:0:0:21BE:E0AC (talk) 03:49, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * What's your guess on when it was released? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 04:41, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Given the subject matter, it's unlikely to have been a silent film. We're obviously looking for something in the 21st century. Matt Deres (talk) 12:04, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Maybe the OP could tell us whether it was closer to 2001 or closer to 2017. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:14, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Also don't assume it is an English movie. Questions from IPs in that region are regular here, asking many questions about movies from India. 209.149.113.5 (talk) 17:23, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * OP: No, it was a Hollywood for sure, I saw it on Star Movies or HBO. I remember clearly the cast was white. Saw it in late '80. 2405:205:4082:5214:0:0:22DD:40AD (talk) 08:48, 28 April 2017 (UTC)


 * This exact scene was in National Lampoon's Vegas Vacation from 1997. The son and daughter are the kids of Randy Quaid's character Cousin Eddie. --Canley (talk) 13:00, 29 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks, Canley. Thanks very much ! Jon Ascton    (talk)  00:49, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

The ballad of the green beret, the butcher's boy,
In the article Ballad of the Green Berets, one line reads "The tune is borrowed from a traditional American folk song, The Butcher Boy." I've listened to multiple versions of both and can't hear the resemblance, the chords for both ("The Butcher's Boy" chords, "The Ballad of the Green Berets" chords) do feature a similar CGC sequence, but comparing the sheet music ("The Butcher's Boy" sheet music, "The Ballad of the Green Berets" sheet music) and admittedly my ability to read music is somewhat lacking, the two don't appear to be the same. I've tried googling "The Butcher Boy" and "Ballad of the Green Beret's" together and all the top ghits appear to quote the two involved Wikipedia articles.

So my questions are, are the two tunes in fact the same and there is a transposition that I can't hear or see, or if the tunes I've found are different, is there another American tune of the song "The Butcher's Boy" that differs significantly from the Irish and English traditions. Thanks in advance to anyone who can help me with this.--KTo288 (talk) 12:39, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * "Nature I loved, and next to Nature Art, and Art, you know, was the butcher's boy". DuncanHill (talk) 15:23, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * You are correct in your assessment. The problem is, we really don't know the "American" version of "The Butcher Boy" as much as we know the "English" and "Irish" versions of the tune. If you try and match up those melodies with "The Green Berets" you will be shaking your head. The chord progressions and tunes are completely different. Listen to the Clancy Brother's here: who reference this tune as an English tune but better known in America as "Tarrytown" . The format of the original lyrics for "Butcher Boy":  definitely served as a model for the "Green Beret" lyrical format and structure; and I would imagine if you heard the original American Folk Song; there would be a better alignment between the two that inspired Staff Sgt. Barry Sadler to model his lyrics after. I think the article, though, needs a reliable source to back up the claim since most online sources tend to cite WP / Wiki. In the end, I think Sadler wrote a set of verse, and with a faint familiar tune in mind (not being a songwriter); and someone wanted to cash in on it. So they hired an arranger who tweaked the melody and chords (and feel) to make it into the hit song we know today. Which is far from the original "tune": Butcher Boy. Maineartists (talk) 17:42, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Kelly Harrell's 1925 American version sounds more like Green Berets to me. Listen on Youtube: Rmhermen (talk) 15:29, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

British accents in films
With my American ears, I can distinguish three different kinds of accents in British actors - fancy accent (spoken by the upper class), not-so-fancy accent (spoken by the lower/uneducated class), and pirate accent. The fancy accent type is extremely widespread. If you want a stereotypical British person in a movie, then that is the go-to accent. The non-so-fancy accent type is manifested in the Artful Dodger in ''Oliver! (1968)''. The Artful Dodger says, "In me own carriage . . . I'll do anything for you deah anything!" He just doesn't talk or sing like a typical British person in film. Are actors all required to audition in that fancy accent during auditioning regardless of origin? 50.4.236.254 (talk) 13:07, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * The fancy accent is usually received pronunciation, which is often called posh. There are numerous "lower-class" English accents including Geordie (northeast England) (Brian Johnson), Cockney (Michael Caine) and other dialects of estuary English (Adele) (southeast England), Mancunian (Noel Gallagher) (Manchester area), Scouse (Paul McCartney) (Merseyside/Liverpool), Brummie (Ozzy Osbourne) (Midlands/Birmingham), and many more.  The Pirate accent is West Country English; that spoken along the southwestern peninsula including Devon and Cornwall.  -- Jayron 32 13:17, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I disagree with you (and with the posh accent article). RP is not posh, the whole point is that it's a neutral accent stripped of class and regional associations. Brian Sewell did not speak in RP. --Viennese Waltz 13:59, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Then you're going to have to find citations and fix it. I will note that this article and this discussion at quora, and this article and this article.  Those were random selections from the first two pages of a Google search.  If you have competing sources, please fix the relevent Wikipedia articles using information from them.  -- Jayron 32 14:04, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I've added some well-known speakers of each dialect, so you can pull up youtube videos and listen for yourself. -- Jayron 32 13:22, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * The West Country English article has a sound clip in it, but I can't say she sounds much like a pirate. The typical movie pirate accent seems to be a strange mix of middle English, as in "ye", and ebonics, as in "Where ye be ?" StuRat (talk) 13:49, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * The referenced citation in the article West Country English states, and I quote, "The West Country accent is probably most identified in film as "pirate speech" – cartoon-like "Ooh arr, me 'earties! Sploice the mainbrace!" talk is very similar." It is cited to reference #24, which is the book Piracy, The Complete History.  Here, on page 313, it discusses the West Country Accent being used for Robert Newton's portrayal of Long John Silver, which became the type-standard for the "pirate accent" in popular culture.  -- Jayron 32 13:59, 26 April 2017 (UTC)


 * That accent is Bristol - head down to Devon or Cornwall (which was where many of the sailors came from) and it gets quite a lot stronger. You must also distinguish accent and dialect - "where d'ye be" is dialect (which you could say in any accent. There are also a lot of specifically nautical phrases like "splice the mainbrace" which can also be said in any accent. Wymspen (talk) 14:03, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * The Bristol accent is very different indeed from those of Cornwall or Devon, and even from those of Somerset or Gloucestershire. No one would mistake a Bathonian for a Bristolian. There's a blogpost with some interesting links here. DuncanHill (talk) 14:22, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * To the o.p., maybe for "pirate accent" you're thinking of the Rhotic accents of south-west England, which are distinct from most of the rest of England? Valenciano (talk) 12:15, 2 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Don't forget the Birmingham Brummie "Ow am ya?" (How are/am you?), "Or-right" (Alright), "Tarrah" (Goodbye? Fuck-knows...). We have lots of accents, all with their own quirks. Thanks ツ Jenova   20  (email) 12:31, 2 May 2017 (UTC)