Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2011 July 13

= July 13 =

Group pressure
Hello. For my life- Orientation asignment, I need to interview three different people about group pressure that had a deep influence on their life, but I don`t know anybody in my family or or in my social group that were affected by group pressure so deeply that it touched their lifes. Can I ask three people to please answer the following questions honestly?


 * If you have ever made a big mistake under the negative influence of someone else, how old were you?
 * Describe what happened
 * How did it touch your dreams?
 * How did it touch your self-image?
 * Please give a message to young people today who tend to be under group pressure to fall

Thank you for your time, trouble and honesty (If I had make a few language mistakes, please excuse me, English is not my home language) 41.14.99.163 (talk) 07:23, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Question: Do all or most of the members of your family follow the same religion? If so, it would probably be due to group pressure. HiLo48 (talk) 08:06, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't have answers to your questions (and I am not sure that the Wikipedia reference desk is the right place to ask these questions anyway), but I do have a comment. Your assignment seems to be encouraging you to view group pressure as an entirely negative force. I don't think this is always true. Here are some more positive examples of group pressure:
 * High positive expectations of family, colleagues and friends can be inspirational.
 * Many companies use group pressure to motivate their staff - they call it "team building".
 * Group pressure is a motivational factor in many sports - here it is called "competitiveness". Gandalf61 (talk) 08:14, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * If you were to survey a statistically significant number of people, smoking would probably be near the top of the list. 99.24.223.58 (talk) 00:53, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

Rose
Rose_Revolution

Why did people carry roses when they burst into that room?Curb Chain (talk) 10:18, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * They were used as a symbol of non-violence. Former President Zviad Gamsakhurdia was remembered as saying something along the lines of "we shall throw roses instead of bullets at our enemies"  (sometimes given as just "flowers").  This interview mentions the influence. Warofdreams talk 16:30, 13 July 2011 (UTC)

College vs. University
Having gone to add a category to my userpage reflecting the fact that I'm headed off to the University of Oklahoma, I got rather stumped by the fact that there is both Category:Wikipedian college students and a separate Category:Wikipedian university students. Through all my life "college" and "university" have been used pretty much synonymously (e.g. "Which college are you going to attend?" and "Which university are you going to attend?" would mean exactly the same thing), so I'm a bit confused as to what the difference is between the two. Is there some sort of difference that I'm oblivious to, and given that I'm going to attend the University of Oklahoma which category would I categorize my userpage into? Thanks in advance, Ks0stm (T•C•G) 19:53, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * In the US, universities can award doctorates whereas colleges can't. But some universities retain college in their name after being given university accreditation, like Boston College. Colleges are generally smaller than universities, and many universities divide their different programs into college (Harvard College is for undergrads at Harvard University).  As for which one to include on your userpage, either is correct.  But since you're American (I assume since you're going to Oklahoma) you'd probably but yourself in a college student, as it's standard in US english to say "I'm in college" as opposed to the more British "I'm at university"  Hot Stop (t) 19:57, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * In the UK, a university confers degrees, while a college is for other kinds of qualifications. See, in particular, sixth form college. Some secondary schools, particularly private ones, have "college" in their name too. --Tango (talk) 22:29, 13 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Also in the UK, a "constituent college" can be a semi autonomous part of a Collegiate university. For instance, King's College, Cambridge or Balliol College, Oxford. Imperial College, London has parted company with the University of London altogether. Alansplodge (talk) 12:59, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * In Australia most private schools (at high school level) had the word college in their name from the start, well over 100 years ago in some cases. From maybe 40 years ago, many government high schools started using the word college too, seemingly to try to improve their image. We even have P-12 colleges (that's Prep to Year 12) in the government system. The word has now lost all status value. University is where you go to get a degree or even higher qualification. HiLo48 (talk) 06:33, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Not sure which state HiLo48 is describing, the situation in New South Wales is a little different. Some private secondary schools have "college" in their names, while government secondary schools called "colleges" are a relatively recent creation and offer only the two senior years of secondary school (years 11 and 12 in the Australian system).
 * In New South Wales "prep(aratory)" is used by private schools only, government schools are divided into primary (kindergarten to year 6) and secondary (years 7 to 12).
 * There are also tertiary colleges in New South Wales, but these are not degree-conferring institutions and instead offer vocational and technical education and training.
 * The above aside, to follow up on the OP's query - in the US, would "at university" be unambiguously understood by everyone? Or would it sound unnatural compared to "in college"? For example, if someone wants it to be unambiguously understood that they attend a degree-conferring university rather than a non degree-conferring college, would they say they are "at university", or would that be so unnatural that they would still say they are "in college", despite the ambiguity? --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 09:35, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * My comments were based on Victoria, but details aside, the general drift is still the same. I'm pretty certain some NSW private colleges have primary components too. One can be in college at 4 years old. HiLo48 (talk) 10:35, 14 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Usage is potentially confusing, wherever in the English-speaking world you are. I have posted at WP:UNI to try and get some improvement to our article College. If anyone would like to help out, with good sources... Itsmejudith (talk) 12:48, 14 July 2011 (UTC)

William Tell
Did William Tell (a.k.a. Wilhelm Tell) really exist? --20:06, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Please read William Tell and come back if there is something you do not understand. -- Jayron  32  20:08, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Not the OP here, but I read the first paragraphs (the lede) - it just says he was a "folk hero" and uses the word "legend". Did he really exist?  188.222.102.201 (talk) 20:13, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Reading the Contents box is often a good idea. There's a "Historicity debate" in the article.  Maybe read that and then come back if there is something you still do not understand.  --   Jack of Oz   [your turn]  20:18, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Still not the OP here, but I followed JackofOz's advice, and can now report that I know the answer. Marking this thread resolved. 188.222.102.201 (talk) 20:33, 13 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Reading the article, he seems very likely to be an actual historical figure. The upstart revisionist historians denying it is especially convincing that the legend describes in some way actual historical events. As real a person as Moses, King David, Jesus of Nazareth, Pontius Pilate, St. George the Dragon Slayer, St. Nicholas,  King Arthur, Molly Pitcher, John Henry the Steel Driving Man, Ol' Dan Tucker, Johnny Appleseed, or Casey Jones, and with about as good documentation as all but the last three. A human being did something remarkable, or was admirable in some way, and tales were told and songs were sung long after his passing. We should all be so lucky. Edison (talk) 00:52, 14 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Aww. I'll sing your songs after your passing, Edison... for a while... 188.222.102.201 (talk) 08:13, 14 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Bawdy songs, I'd hope. ;-) --Mr.98 (talk) 13:55, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Or, at least, songs about light bulbs and phonographs. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 20:13, 17 July 2011 (UTC)