Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2014 June 15

= June 15 =

Prince of Denmark
How long can the title Prince of Denmark be passed down? Usually most monarchies restrict the title of Prince/Princess to the children and male-line grandchildren of a monarch. Is this title inherited through the male line as long as the person marries with the permission of the monarch. The Greek Royal Family has held the title Prince of Denmark since the 1800s as male line descendants of Christian IX. The other male line of the Danish Royal Family have all been demoted to Counts Rosenborg since they married unequally before the acceptance of unequal marriage. Or is it up to the reigning monarch to decide? What is the rule on the title at this point? --The Emperor&#39;s New Spy (talk) 06:35, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


 * I don't know about Danish, but in German there's a systematic difference between a ruler of a principality (Fürst) and a junior non-reigning member of a royal family (Prinz). Possibly this could clarify matters... AnonMoos (talk) 07:20, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't see how it helps, but thanks for trying. —Tamfang (talk) 07:35, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


 * The two generations rule was adopted for Britain by royal decree circa 1917; before then I believe the title of Prince was transmitted indefinitely in the legitimate male line – though (at the time) no royal British male line in centuries had persisted more than two or three generations. —Tamfang (talk) 07:35, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * The Hanoverians did. Why did Prince Ernest Augustus of Hanover (1914–1987) have to be granted his British title in 1914 by George V if the two generation rule hasn't started yet and the Germans weren't deprive of their titles until 1918; he was a great-great-great grandson of George III. By the ambiguity of the rules of the title, George V didn't have to do anything. Ernest Augustus' father was born Prince Ernest of Cumberland and was a great-great grandson of George III. --The Emperor&#39;s New Spy (talk) 08:04, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Let's avoid getting side tracked... what other nations do has no bearing on what happens in Denmark... the OP wants to know about the Danes. Blueboar (talk) 11:43, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * The OP asked about Denmark, but invoked a two-generation rule in "usually most monarchies". The BRF is the only specific case where I happen to know of such a rule, so I was reminded by a wisecrack of Shaw in Caesar and Cleopatra. —Tamfang (talk) 22:56, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


 * It is passed down indefinitely. When a Danish prince has permission to settle abroad (as William and Charles of Denmark did when they became kings of Greece and of Norway, respectively) he and his issue no longer need to seek permission to marry to pass on the title. Only in Denmark do Danish princes have to abide by the marital laws or seek permission from the sovereign to marry. This was in the royal law (I forget the exact year...) that has never been rescinded, predating the reign of Christian IX. Seven Letters 21:34, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Sophia Dorothea of Celle
What Sophia Dorothea of Celle do in her 33 years of imprisonment? Did she spent every waking moment of it in (or around) Ahlden House?--The Emperor&#39;s New Spy (talk) 07:59, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I remember reading - though I do not remember where - that every day she was able, Sophia Dorothea went for a long walk with an appointed escort, through the area round about the house where she was imprisoned. I don't think she ever tried to escape, nor was she ever allowed to go further afield for official reasons - so to the best of my knowledge, the answer to your second question is 'yes'; I'd be interested to learn otherwise. AlexTiefling (talk) 21:26, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Looking for funny law tutorial situations
Hi all, I once saw a classic law tutorial question, that consisted of a ludicrous tale about a nurse who was obsessed with Tom Cruise, Nicole Kidman and various actors from her favourite soaps. It involved various petty things like vengeance, negligence and so forth involving the nurse and the various actors. Then it was followed by a simple question asking the various legal implications of the whole thing. Does anyone know where I can get more of the same? I'm interested in setting up fun discussion topics for ESL classes, so I don't really need the legal question at the end, but it would really be a bonus. It would be even better still if it had some online forum-style discussion of the law associated with these fictitious cases. The law tute was at Murdoch University, but I couldn't find anything on their website - it was just in a course reader. Thanks, IBE (talk) 16:12, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * If English law is a suitable vehicle, I would recommend the works of A P Herbert (he of the negotiable cow) - does anyone know of an equivalent American author? Tevildo (talk) 19:23, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * That sounds like it would be counterproductive - ESL students aren't likely to need to know the kind of wordplay and legal obscurantism that drives the humour in Herbert's stories. AlexTiefling (talk) 21:29, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the heads up, but you can often adapt things, if you are willing to take a bit of time. The students also won't know most of the words or the grammar, and a lot of ESL teachers here would baulk at things we read. The point is that even if I have to discard the entire exercise, I have had the chance to read something interesting along the way. I should add that I do prefer fictitious, fun tutorial questions, if it's possible. IBE (talk) 01:21, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * You might like User:Newyorkbrad/Newyorkbradblog, and the external link at the end of that section.- gadfium 04:42, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * There's more about the law against animals in parks at, but the treatment is more mathematical than legal.- gadfium 23:11, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that's really good - wasn't sure I'd get anything much with this question. Still on the lookout for wacky law tutes, but this is a great start. IBE (talk) 00:03, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Opposition leaders of Rhodesia
I've copied this from WP:AN, where it was originally posted. Nyttend (talk) 17:47, 15 June 2014 (UTC)

Hello everyone! I already posted this at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Zimbabwe, but maybe it would be helpful to post it here too:

For some time now, I want to create an article about leaders of the opposition of Rhodesia, from introduction of the responsible government in 1923 until the demise of Rhodesia in 1979. Also, that article could contain opposition leaders of Zimbabwe-Rhodesia and Zimbabwe, since 1980 (in the same fashion as List of Speakers of the House of Assembly of Zimbabwe contain parliamentary speakers of all three entities). As you know, all the countries which adopted Westminster-style system at some point in their history have lists of leaders of official opposition (UK, Canada, Australia, South Africa, etc), so I want to make a list like that for Rhodesia/Zimbabwe-Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. Unfortunately, I was unable to find any source online which contain list of Rhodesian opposition leaders. So, I'm asking all of you for help. If anyone knows where to find sources about this, please let me know. Cheers! --Sundostund (talk) 13:52, 15 June 2014 (UTC)
 * might be aware of some references given his expertise on Rhodesian political history Nick-D (talk) 11:56, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Nick, I asked him already, some months ago. Unfortunately, he was unable to find references so far... --Sundostund (talk) 13:08, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Hi Sundostund, for the more recent ones, you can apparently read the Zimbabwe parliament’s Hansard online from 1994: and . I haven’t found a Rhodesian Hansard online yet. Beyond that, several of people you need are in the Dictionary of African Biography some of which can be viewed online.
 * Here is a source for Josiah Gondo in 1966
 * and here are some other sources for some of the later, Zimbabwe part of the equation:
 * Ian Smith in 1980 (see footnote on p 4)
 * Gibson Sibanda in 2000
 * Morgan Tsvangirai in 2002, in 2005
 * I didn’t find anything that listed them all though, so this is only a very small start. 142.150.38.155 (talk) 20:24, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * 142.150.38.155, thank you for your effort. I really appreciate what you found so far... As you said, this is a small start, so any creation of an article about Rhodesian opposition leaders will need to wait until a comprehensive source is found (especially for the 1923-1979 period). --Sundostund (talk) 22:13, 16 June 2014 (UTC)