Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2017 May 23

= May 23 =

Misplaced valor and the US Merchant Navy
In the United States, have any public figures advocated altering the status of the Merchant Navy as a "branch of the military", to prevent people from technically becoming "war heroes" just by working on a merchant ship that wasn't actually involved in the war effort? Neon Merlin  22:22, 23 May 2017 (UTC)
 * I think the US merchant navy is actually called the United States Merchant Marine, and unless I'm mistaken it is not, generally, "a branch of the military". But why would it be less heroic to serve on a merchant ship that wasn't actually involved in the war effort than on a military vessel that wasn't actually involved in the war effort? --Stephan Schulz (talk) 22:47, 23 May 2017 (UTC)
 * And of course as AnonMoos pointed out above, in certan cases they can be involved in the war. Our article notes:
 * "P.L. 95–202, approved November 23, 1977, granted veteran status to Women Airforce Service Pilots and "any person in any other similarly situated group" with jurisdiction for determination given to the Secretary of Defense who delegated that determination to the Secretary of the Air Force.[16] Although the Merchant Marine suffered a per capita casualty rate greater than those of the US Armed Forces, merchant mariners who served in World War II were denied such veterans recognition until 1988 when a federal court ordered it. The Court held that "the Secretary of the Air Force abused its discretion in denying active military service recognition to American merchant seamen who participated in World War II.""


 * This also illustrates the point that the Merchant Marine aren't normally considered veterans etc.
 * Nil Einne (talk) 09:55, 24 May 2017 (UTC)


 * I don't think I'm getting this. I have a friend who was in the merchant navy, he was dropped off in Cuba when he needed some medical help and that caused a deal of trouble for him in America - I think that is the closest he ever came to being a war hero as far as I'm aware ;-) Dmcq (talk) 23:22, 23 May 2017 (UTC)

Here's a relevant British WW2 poster -- File:INF3-127 War Effort Under the Red Duster they sustain our Island Fortress.jpg... -- AnonMoos (talk) 01:54, 24 May 2017 (UTC)