Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2020 May 20

= May 20 =

National Education Union - 19th century Anglican organisation
The National Education Union (not the National Education Union) was set up by elements of the Church of England to oppose the National Education League and free and universal education in the 19th Century. I would be interested to learn more about it - we could do with an article! Thank you, DuncanHill (talk) 15:28, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
 * fn246 On Catholic policy between 1851 and 1870, see A. A. C. F. Beales, “The Struggle for the Schools,” in George Andrew Beck, ed., The English Catholics, 1850–1950 (London: Burns, Oates, 1950), pp. 367–38.
 * fn247 D. E. Selby, “Henry Edward Manning and the Educational Bill of 1870,” British Journal of Educational Studies 18, no. 2 (June 1970): 197–212.
 * fn248 Keith Evans, The Development and Structure of the English Educational System (London: University of London Press, 1975), pp. 30–31. snippet pp. 40-2
 * The whole of British Journal of Educational Studies 1970 no. 2 might be useful, has Selby, also saw McCann cited.
 * Possibly out of jstor reads and their search don't work
 * fn246 On Catholic policy between 1851 and 1870, see A. A. C. F. Beales, “The Struggle for the Schools,” in George Andrew Beck, ed., The English Catholics, 1850–1950 (London: Burns, Oates, 1950), pp. 367–38.
 * fn247 D. E. Selby, “Henry Edward Manning and the Educational Bill of 1870,” British Journal of Educational Studies 18, no. 2 (June 1970): 197–212.
 * fn248 Keith Evans, The Development and Structure of the English Educational System (London: University of London Press, 1975), pp. 30–31. snippet pp. 40-2
 * The whole of British Journal of Educational Studies 1970 no. 2 might be useful, has Selby, also saw McCann cited.
 * Possibly out of jstor reads and their search don't work


 * A brief mention and useful background at: . Alansplodge (talk) 19:57, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
 * What's the correct title? National Education Union (1869)? fiveby(zero) 21:25, 20 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Thanks and . Not quite sure what the right title would be, perhaps Fiveby's suggestion or National Education Union (19th century)? DuncanHill (talk) 23:02, 21 May 2020 (UTC)

Moral relativism in Asian cultures
Is there any academic material which can help to understand how moral relativism is viewed in Asian cultures? In particular, I’m aware that in classic western philosophy, relativism is generally seen as a controversial concept. So how does moral relativism work in modern day Asian cultures? Clover345 (talk) 21:53, 20 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Moral relativism has a paragraph that may lead you to something more. DOR (HK) (talk) 09:40, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
 * So, you are interested in the relativism of moral relativism? --Khajidha (talk) 14:40, 21 May 2020 (UTC)

Sussex - "an old smithy that cried out aloud how it had once been a hall of the Knights of the Temple"
In the short story They by Rudyard Kipling, collected in Traffics and Discoveries, the narrator is driving through Sussex. He tells us One view called me to another; one hill top to its fellow, half across the county, and since I could answer at no more trouble than the snapping forward of a lever, I let the county flow under my wheels. The orchid-studded flats of the East gave way to the thyme, ilex, and grey grass of the Downs; these again to the rich cornland and fig-trees of the lower coast, where you carry the beat of the tide on your left hand for fifteen level miles; and when at last I turned inland through a huddle of rounded hills and woods I had run myself clean out of my known marks. Beyond that precise hamlet which stands godmother to the capital of the United States, I found hidden villages where bees, the only things awake, boomed in eighty-foot lindens that overhung grey Norman churches; miraculous brooks diving under stone bridges built for heavier traffic than would ever vex them again; tithe-barns larger than their churches, and an old smithy that cried out aloud how it had once been a hall of the Knights of the Temple. Gipsies I found on a common where the gorse, bracken, and heath fought it out together up a mile of Roman road; and a little further on I disturbed a red fox rolling dog-fashion in the naked sunlight.

As the wooded hills closed about me I stood up in the car to take the bearings of that great Down whose ringed head is a landmark for fifty miles across the low countries....

The "precise hamlet" is Washington, the great Down is Chanctonbury Hill, the "Knights of the Temple" are the Knights Templar, but where is the old smithy? Thank you, DuncanHill (talk) 22:56, 20 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Shipley, about 7 miles north of Washington, has a 12th-century church said to have been built by the Templars, though why Kipling should call it a 'smithy' is uncertain Shipley, West Sussex from Daniel Karlin editor of this collection by Oxford University Press. fiveby(zero) 00:06, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
 * apparently also a messuage with garden variously Shipley Manor or Shipley Rectory. Ibid., 250-1, 256 The Templars' and Hospitallers' preceptory building mentioned, for instance, in 1308 (fn. 107) has not been located, but may have been no bigger than a manor house since the number of brethren was presumably small.
 * apparently also a messuage with garden variously Shipley Manor or Shipley Rectory. Ibid., 250-1, 256 The Templars' and Hospitallers' preceptory building mentioned, for instance, in 1308 (fn. 107) has not been located, but may have been no bigger than a manor house since the number of brethren was presumably small.


 * Thanks, when I am allowed to I shall fire up the Locomobile and see if I can find the smithy. DuncanHill (talk) 11:34, 22 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Maybe the the views to the east and Devil's Dyke called first? Then from Saddlescombe north? fiveby(zero) 16:09, 22 May 2020 (UTC)