Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2021 April 7

= April 7 =

Tasmanian electoral divisions


Does anyone know the years when Tasmanian electoral divisions had these names and boundaries? Lyons was given its name in 1984 and Denison got renamed in 2018, so it has to have been between those years, but if Tasmania redistributes its electorates in line with federal redistribution, I assume the boundaries would have changed repeatedly in those 34 years. Nyttend backup (talk) 15:23, 7 April 2021 (UTC)
 * This site is the Tasmanian Electoral Commission. Someone listed on their contact page may be able to help you with your research.  -- Jayron 32 15:31, 7 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Hi, Jayron32’s link points people to the Australian Electoral Commission site for the 2016-18 redistribution which itself links at the bottom to the redistribution before that, which was in 2008 . It’s hard to tell from your map, but I think Denison is wholly west of the river in the 2008 map  and includes a piece to the east in your map, so the answer may be 2008-2018. 70.67.193.176 (talk) 16:42, 7 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you for a useful response, 70.67.193.176. Nyttend backup (talk) 16:45, 7 April 2021 (UTC)

How is the first name "Menzie" pronounced "Mingus"?
Just thinking about someone I vaguely knew once, years ago. He didn't know either, but everyone always wrote his name as "Mingus" unless he spelled it for them.

Is this some British thing like how "Leicestershire" is pronounced "Lester" or "Featherstonhaugh" is pronounced "Fanshaw"? --Iloveparrots (talk) 20:32, 7 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Menzies has an explanation, though unfortunately unsourced. Something similar is found here: . Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:42, 7 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Yes, but not exactly as in Charles. It's actually . And frequently abbreviated to "Ming" as in Ming Campbell. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:43, 7 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Leicestershire is not pronounced "Lester", Leicester is. Fgf10 (talk) 00:33, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Robert Menzies was a prime minister of Australia. It was always pronounced as written, but one of his nicknames was "Ming". --  Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  01:13, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * The proper pronunciation might be more commonly observed in its native Scotland; but in England, the former newsagents' shop chain, John Menzies, was almost invariably (in London at least) pronounced phonetically. Alansplodge (talk) 08:20, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Having lived in Scotland in the 70s and 80s, I can confirm that Scots people then generally pronounced it as "Ming'əs" or "Ming'is" (which, by the way, does not include a hard 'g' in its sound), though many English visitors afforded them amusement with their "Men'zeez". Though myself a mere Sassenach, I was even then concerned with languages and also worked in an allied trade, so was careful to accord with the native practice.
 * Yes, John Menzies explains a little, but unfortunately is unsourced. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:37, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Classic  :D I think 0-1,   :)   ——  Serial  12:07, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * "I didn't get where I am today by spelling Menzies with a yogh!" Martinevans123 (talk) 12:35, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * There is no shortage of weird pronunciations in English, and not just abbreviations like "Lester" for "Leicester", "Wooster" for "Worcester", and "folks'll" for "forecastle". How did "Ralph" become pronounced "Rafe"? How did "Maurice" become pronounced "Morris"? How did "Belvoir" become pronounced "Beaver"? And so on. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 08:30, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Because the "z" in Menzies is not a "zed" it is a Yogh. British isle typesetters in the early days of printing imported their presses from the continent, where the typefaces didn't have all of the characters used in English.  Written English at the time had letters not present in continental language like yogh, thorn, eth, ash, etc.  Printers simply swapped out the letters for ones they had available, which is why we get the Menzies spelled the way it is, and also why "ye olde shoppe", the "y" is pronounced "th".  -- Jayron 32 11:20, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Thanks, Jayron. That's an excellent summary. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:34, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Another common-ish name with a yogh is Dalziel, pronounced "dee-ELL", as in another politician, the late Tam Dalziel, and the TV series Dalziel and Pascoe. AndrewWTaylor (talk) 11:54, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * What may be more interesting is that the spelling of Menzies with a pseudo yogh (a "z" with a lower tail) can still sometimes be seen. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:35, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * In the United States, a name "Ming" would be more likely to call to mind the character Ming the Merciless from Flash Gordon, or the Chinese Ming dynasty, and not Scottish surnames... AnonMoos (talk) 15:41, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * He could be quite ruthless, you know. Martinevans123 (talk) 16:26, 8 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Good point, see Ming the Merciless strikes back and Ming the merciless: Menzies Campbell hits out at senior Lib Dems. Alansplodge (talk) 18:19, 8 April 2021 (UTC)