Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2022 July 23

= July 23 =

Genealogy question - First cousins or second cousins?
In the first two paragraphs of this article I created I describe Fry's genealogy, as I understand it from the sources. His father was Thomas Cousins Fry and his mother was Charlotte Fry, a cousin of Thomas. Were they first cousins or second cousins? --Doug Coldwell (talk) 10:19, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * If they had the same parents, they were siblings. If the same grand-parents, cousins. If the same great-grandparents, second cousins, etc. In this case, from what you wrote it looks like their parents were siblings, e.g. that they shared grand-parents, so they were first cousins. — kwami (talk) 10:24, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:21, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Did they have a cousin born in Paris... a French Fry? --←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:51, 23 July 2022 (UTC)

emigrated or immigrated?
In the first paragraph of Henry Clay Fry's biography I use emigrated and immigrated. Am I using them correctly? --Doug Coldwell (talk) 11:39, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, you emigrate from and you immigrate to. Matt Deres (talk) 12:19, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Doug Coldwell (talk) 12:21, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * And you migrate from one place to another. All three of these terms have Latin roots. --←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:29, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * An easy way to remember:
 * immigrate = in
 * emigrate = exit
 * Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 15:13, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * "in" and "ex" are in fact the prefixes we're working with here; the n becomes an m when there's an m following and the x is removed when attached to an m. Or a b d g i l n r or v. Temerarius (talk) 17:29, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, all the way back to the Latin roots: — Preceding unsigned comment added by Baseball Bugs (talk • contribs) 18:00, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'd say viewpoint governs. From an Irish viewpoint, William emigrated to America; from New York's viewpoint, he immigrated from Ireland. —Tamfang (talk) 00:40, 26 July 2022 (UTC)

However, the statement that "Yes, you emigrate from and you immigrate to" is wrong as a prescriptive rule. Since the same event can be both an emigration and an immigration, both from and to can be applied to it. If someone says "Lots of people emigrated from Ireland that year", it's not wrong to ask, "And where did they emigrate to?" --174.95.81.219 (talk) 20:07, 24 July 2022 (UTC)


 * The point was made two days ago:

A little more nuance: during the era of the Ten Pound Poms people would say "He emigrated to Australia". It's the preposition, not the verb prefix, which conveys the direction of travel. 79.73.133.118 (talk) 14:49, 23 July 2022 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.31.140.208 (talk)

"White" as a dirty color
Look at the Colors table in:

(go to the Colors table)

The "white" color in the table isn't white at all; white is a nice, clean color; the "white" in the table is more beige. Does anyone know a more precise name for this color term?? Georgia guy (talk) 19:05, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Id probably call that beige. Cheers ❖hugarheimur 19:33, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It's a bit light for beige. Maybe cream ? --Trovatore (talk) 19:38, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Isn't that the influence of the colour shemes of Interior design? Beige in our X11 name chart also looked to me very near of the sample after I managed placing a zoom over it. --Askedonty (talk) 20:56, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * I seem to remember that the X11 color names were based on some guy looking at crayons once and matching them by eye. Yes, here's the relevent archived question. I enjoyed that one. Card Zero  (talk) 21:27, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * My first serious drawing out off the kindergarden was with crayons a reproduction of an Amerindian Chief, and I couldn't understand why the skin color made with poor crayons did not match that of the original. I had to wait for the UV crisis of 2005 and see people with their skin turning green, then dark Puce to understand for real that the rendering by light on earth may be subject to very specific conditions. --Askedonty (talk) 22:10, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * In general it's called an "off-white". It could be one of several, a light beige, cream, ivory, sandy white, etc. See shades of white for more possibilities. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shades_of_white#Floral_white or ivoryModocc (talk) 20:24, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I sense a kluge. Note that these are shiny moon-banana-objects. This is the kind of compromise an artist might be forced into when a white object needs to have a shiny highlight on it. It might still be supposed to be white. I think the lighting in this Mario game is fairly even, without much contrast between the lit sides of objects and the shaded sides, which makes the effect worse. Or it might just be these objects which are like that in the game. (Do they glow?) Card Zero  (talk) 21:37, 23 July 2022 (UTC)


 * "Does [the surrey with the fringe on top] really have a team of snow-white horses?"
 * "One's like snow, the other's more like milk."
 * --←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 22:49, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Is anyone else uncomfortable with how this question is phrased, or even why it is being asked at all? 'White is a nice, clean colour' - implying perhaps that colours other than white are less nice, and less clean? If there's a serious question here, I'm sure it would be possible to phrase it in a clearer manner. Girth Summit  (blether)  23:03, 23 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't recall ever seeing anything in GeorgiaGuy's posts that struck me as remotely racial. Also, the off-white under discussion is still much much whiter than the skin of virtually any "white person".  --Trovatore (talk) 01:24, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Absolutely agree. The implication that colors are dirty can only be interpreted as racist. It's disappointing that this isn't evident to everyone here. 74.64.73.24 (talk) 11:09, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * No, it can't. Many people prefer for most colors not to reappear bleached after washing (T-shirts). --Askedonty (talk) 11:50, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 74... is reading way too much into it. Pure white is often too bright a color. An off-white is easier on the eyes. --←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 17:21, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Here a similar, skightly lighter colour is called "cornsilk". --Lambiam 02:43, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * That, again, is derived from the X11 color names, and presumably therefore from John C. Thomas eyeballing crayons in 1989, even though Crayola cornsilk is much more yellow. Card Zero  (talk) 03:30, 24 July 2022 (UTC)
 * This is how you capture white in a painting :-) MarnetteD&#124;Talk 19:10, 24 July 2022 (UTC)