Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2023 March 23

= March 23 =

End of the Battle of the Caribbean
Our article says it lasted until 1945 but this paper from the US Naval Institute claims it ended in 1942. Which is correct? Ericoides (talk) 05:42, 23 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Well, as you can see from the table I added to Battle of the Caribbean, 336 Allied ships were lost in 1942, 35 in 1943 and 3 in 1944. You can draw your own conclusion. Clarityfiend (talk) 08:48, 23 March 2023 (UTC)


 * Thanks, nicely ambiguous. Ericoides (talk) 13:04, 23 March 2023 (UTC)


 * It's ambiguous because that's the nature of these sort of things. The boundaries are frequently not objective and vary from source to source. Your USNI paper sets the end in Nov 1942 because of the strategic shifts associated with Operation Torch (unsubstantiated -- did the German navy really have such a strategic shift then? If so, to what extent?) and because there were no sinkings cited in the region in Dec 1942. Our article cites roughly 85% of sinkings bu hulls and tonnage having occurred by the end of 1942, a German withdrawal of significant forces in Aug 1943 and notes Allied losses through July 1944 (all in the US Army source that informs Clarityfiend's numbers above). Antisubmarine patrols and activities no doubt continued until the cessation of hostilities in 1945. Any of the years 1942 - 1945 are accordingly reasonable answers for the question, depending on your preferred criteria. &mdash; Lomn 16:39, 23 March 2023 (UTC)

Anyway this is a very good finding, and the ambiguity should well be reflected in the article. --KnightMove (talk) 12:14, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I've inserted an endnote on Commander Smith's alternative dates into the article. Ericoides (talk) 05:58, 28 March 2023 (UTC)