Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2023 May 28

= May 28 =

Last U.S. troop deployments Korean War
Hi all, when was the last U.S. troop deployments to the Korean War? Or asked another way were there fresh U.S. troops to Korea in 1953? Thanks!2600:1702:690:F7A0:C4BD:D25D:38D2:2E03 (talk) 09:24, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Korean War Order of Battle (p. xxiv) says that on 2 July 1953, "24th US Infantry Division redeploys to Korea for rear-area security" (note that they had earlier been heavily engaged in the war and were withdrawn in January 1952 to reserve in Japan, so not all "fresh troops"). On 2 July, 187th Airborne Regimental Combat Team redeploys to Korea" (also from reserve in Japan and had previously deployed twice to Korea). Alansplodge (talk) 17:27, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Thanks so much for the info and link Alansplodge. I will look at the link but maybe I should clarify the fresh comment, in short were there recruits that went through boot camp from the states and then were deployed to Korea in 1953?  I will search the link but for instance I remember how Nixon stopped sending troops to Vietnam in 1972 even though it didn't end for months later (and really 1975).  So to clarify was there any U.S. recruits who went to boot camp and then Korea in 1953?  Or when was the last street to bootcamp to Korea U.S. service member?  Thanks again!2600:1702:690:F7A0:2D12:DE71:B696:B550 (talk) 02:13, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Sorry if I am being dense, but the US has an ongoing presence in South Korea to this day. Is there any reason a new boot camp recruit graduating today could not be sent there?  See United_States_Forces_Korea RudolfRed (talk) 02:44, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes technically the war 'never ended' so for those that may misread my question its the 1950-July 1953 conflict. And just in case fresh new-from-stateside-bootcamp troops, any in 1953?  When was the last?  (I realize most already assume this, just trying to do the favor of making my inquiry clear :smile: ) These are all great links and I am learning new things but I still can't find the exact last deployment I described, appreciation for all and any help! 2600:1702:690:F7A0:2D12:DE71:B696:B550 (talk) 03:27, 29 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Not really my field, but looking at the source linked above, it seems that the same formations were kept in the Asia theatre, but rotated from the front line to rear areas or reserve in Japan. Some of these units would have experienced quite heavy casualties that would need to be replaced from training camps in the US. So although there were no fresh formations, it seems certain to me that the in-theatre formations would have had recruits fresh from training integrated into them. I can't find a source to support that, but see FNG syndrome for the Vietnam War equivalent. Alansplodge (talk) 10:05, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

How related are Finns and East Asians?
After watching the movie Big Game, I mistook Finnish child actor Onni Tommila for being East Asian just because he resembled one. I also heard that Finns were originally considered as a Mongoloid race in the United States. Furthermore, Finns do have epicanthic folds, high-cheek bones, and small noses, similar to Chinese people, Japanese people, Koreans, Taiwanese people, and Mongolians. 95.144.204.68 (talk) 18:10, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Helsinki Times commenting on this report in Nature: It's perfectly correct to say Finns are not Europeans due to their lack of genetic resemblance to Europeans. But Finns are also Asians as they really don't resemble anyone [...] in this respect. --136.54.99.98 (talk) 19:47, 28 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Not very much at all. This is a false trope that pops up from time to time, particularly in North America. People with ancestry from Finland (ethnic Finns, Swedish Finns, and Sámi) do not typically have epicanthic folds or East Asian-style small noses. I don't have a reliable source with data for the whole population but against that one child actor I invite you to take a look at the current Finnish government. Not one looks East Asian. So where does this false myth come from? Probably from the fact that Finnish and Sámi are part of a language family that is sometimes described as "Asian", but in this case that mainly means northern/western Siberia, not East Asia. It's a geographical description, not a racial one, but people who think in racial categories (as many North Americans have historically done) may jump to the wrong conclusion. And speaking a Siberian language does not mean all your ancestry comes from Siberia. At some point in their past, the ancestors of Finns did mix with Siberians who carried some East Asian ancestry, but this amount is small and not enough to affect their phenotypes much. Sámi, who some might expect to look more Asian because more of their customs are shared with Siberia, are similar. This is an ancient paper for a very fast-moving field, but is not paywalled and makes the key point succinctly: Their results suggested "the large genetic separation of the Saami from other Europeans is best explained by assuming that the Saami are descendants of a narrow, distinctive subset of Europeans." I'm not an expert but even the briefest look at subsequent research in the area confirms this (e.g. here). Matt's talk 21:21, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Seriously now, does Ismo look Asian? HiLo48 (talk) 07:27, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Are you replying to me? If so, then obviously no. Matt's talk 08:39, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Genetic studies on Sami has some details of genetic links with Siberia, but Sámi tells why it's a touchy subject. Demographics of Finland notes that the Sámi represent a 5% minority of the Finnish population. The majority are Finns, who "originate between the Volga, Oka and Kama rivers in what is now Russia". Alansplodge (talk) 11:52, 29 May 2023 (UTC)


 * OP, be aware you've linked to a term, "Mongoloid", which is largely discredited as meaningless. It was created as part of a highly bigoted non-scientific racial theory which no one takes seriously, and has not for almost a century.  -- Jayron 32 11:22, 30 May 2023 (UTC)
 * I did find a news article claiming that Finns and Chinese people are related. I can't get the source up because of CAPTCHA. 95.144.204.68 (talk) 10:12, 4 June 2023 (UTC)

Jeanne Calment
One paragraph in Jeanne Calment's article says:

Geneticists have noted that, since Jeanne Calment had 16 distinct great-great-grandparents while her daughter Yvonne had only 12, the question of identity could easily be settled by a test for autozygous DNA, if a blood or tissue sample were to be made available.

The link is now 3 years old. Has such a blood/tissue sample been done yet?? If the answer is no, please explain what people have to wait for. Georgia guy (talk) 22:33, 28 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Reluctance to dig up a dead body to satisfy people's idle curiosity, possibly? AnonMoos (talk) 02:02, 29 May 2023 (UTC)