Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2024 January 12

= January 12 =

Time of day boundaries
Concepts such as noon and midnight are well defined but when does afternoon become evening and evening, night? Oddly it seems the transition from night to morning is not as vague, at least in English, as "dawn" is from first light to the end of sunrise. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 10:17, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * I suspect these depend upon culture, context, latitude and time of year. For me (an indigenous Brit) evening usually starts around sunset or 6:00 pm, whichever is earlier, and night follows dusk at the end of twilight, which typically lasts for about half an hour after sunset (and yes, I know that Civil, Nautical and Astronomical twilight are different, in practice I am most interested in the last). This means that for me it can be simultaneously evening and night, depending on context. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 51.198.104.88 (talk) 10:36, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * For me, a South African of no (relevant) religious persuasion, living just a bit outside the tropics (~30 deg S), evening begins at the end of the workday (~ 5 to 5:30 pm), and becomes night at suppertime about 2 to 3 hours later. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 10:37, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * At my latitude at this time of year "morning" starts well before dawn. "Evening" seems to start after dinner. Folly Mox (talk) 11:10, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Day has some info. I believe that some cultures (Islam?) using an evening-evening definition for a day use various astronomical observations, such as so many stars visible, to define the change point. -- Verbarson talkedits 12:04, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * According to Islamic calendar, Islam uses sunset, whereas Zmanim suggests that Judaism is less certain, though 'A third Talmudic passage (Shabbat 35b) states that nightfall occurs when three medium-sized stars become visible'. -- Verbarson talkedits 12:12, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * And there are a whole host of rules about when sabbath/iftar times are to be observed above the Arctic Circle.  Before people travelled so far afield, there was (and still is) much debate in Judaism about the meaning of the term "between the two evenings" which governed start and finish times. 2A02:C7B:11B:9000:102:E620:5DF:9CB1 (talk) 15:56, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Noon is ambiguous anywhere where daylight saving (or even any standardised time-zone) is observed. Is noon "the time when the sun reaches the meridian" or is it "twelve o'clock in the day"? (Both from a single definition in OED). Midnight likewise, is it "The middle of the night" or is it "12 o'clock at night"? DuncanHill (talk) 00:56, 14 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Too bad we can't get Gene Ray to chime in. —Tamfang (talk) 19:45, 25 January 2024 (UTC)

Artist Imre Góth
He lived in the UK and it would be great to have an English language version of this: hu:Góth Imre 2A00:23C8:C106:7E01:4D9C:C271:1625:8244 (talk) 15:13, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * Why not do it?  Articles for creation explains how. 2A02:C7B:11B:9000:102:E620:5DF:9CB1 (talk) 15:48, 12 January 2024 (UTC)

Four men charged over theft of £4.8m gold toilet from Blenheim Palace
"The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) said on Monday it had authorised criminal charges against four men, who will appear at Oxford magistrates court on 28 November."

That was last year. Can someone tell me if there's an update on this? Is it ongoing or were they released? Or something else? Preferably with a WP-usable source. And if you haven't heard of America (Cattelan) before, I recommend that article. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:06, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * There are news reports of the court appearances here and here. The accused men were bailed and were due to appear at Oxford Crown Court on 4 January, but I can't find any reports of that appearance. AndrewWTaylor (talk) 19:21, 12 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks! That is something. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 21:28, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * I heard that the police had nothing to go on Chuntuk (talk) 15:30, 17 January 2024 (UTC)


 * This humor is getting lavatorial. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 16:12, 17 January 2024 (UTC)

Napoleon Bonaparte
Who was the commander/owner of the La Fère Army where Napoleon Bonaparte began his military career? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.207.112.165 (talk) 20:45, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * I take it that you mean Régiment de La Fère (1765). According to Napoleon: A Biography by Frank McLynn, it was a "Colonel de Lance". A fairly thorough Google search finds no other references to him, although this finds an officer called Auguste Michel Hyppolite VALLON de LANCE who was born in 1790 and is possibly related. Alansplodge (talk) 19:56, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * French Wikipedia has an article fr:Régiment de La Fère artillerie which lists "Louis César de Cheverzy chevalier de Lance" as the commanding officer in Bonaparte's time, followed by "Pierre Abel de Sappel". There's some more detail here and here in French. Pages 53-54 in the latter source quote a letter to the chevalier de Lance from the minister of war announcing "Napoléone de Buonaparte"'s attachment to the regiment as second lieutenant in 1785. Jean-de-Nivelle (talk) 20:25, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Ok, closed. 193.207.140.133 (talk) 21:20, 13 January 2024 (UTC)

Charles X of France
I once read somewhere that the Law against the sacrilege under his reign made only a victim. Can you find who was? Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.207.112.165 (talk) 20:49, 12 January 2024 (UTC)


 * I presume you are talking about the Anti-Sacrilege Act. According to that page and the source linked there, it was a weaver from Mossans (presumably, modern-day Maussans) named François Bourquin, sentenced to perpetual forced labor for the sacrilegial burglary of Eucharistic objects from three different churches (his own parish's church, a church in Hyèvre, and a church in Cuve.) GalacticShoe (talk) 03:00, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you. About François Bourquin, can you find info about his life? 193.207.102.224 (talk) 07:10, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * There's some information about the case in the French source given in that article, here. I can help with translation if required. Jean-de-Nivelle (talk) 21:06, 13 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you, but I meant info about his life: birth, family, career, death? 193.207.140.133 (talk) 21:23, 13 January 2024 (UTC)