Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2007 December 19

= December 19 =

A name for this use of language?
Is there a name for a phrase where something is improperly put into the conditional tense? i.e. 'This question will be on the language desk if you are able to answer it?'

Obviously the question will be there regardless of whether or not you can answer it,but is there a proper linguistic term for this type of construction? Lemon martini (talk) 14:59, 19 December 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Lemon martini (talk • contribs) 14:58, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * "I brought some chips, if anybody wants some." Tesseran (talk) 15:29, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * (edit conflict) I think there is a problem of idiom with the example sentence. "This question will be on the language desk if you are able to answer it" sounds foreign to me. I'd expect something more like "This question will be on the language desk if you would like to try to answer it." I don't see a problem of tense but of sense, which makes it not a problem at all but a matter of idiom. The "if" (and the "would") is just part of an effort to be polite and doesn't carry its usual conditional force. "When" would be unacceptably direct: "This question will be on the language desk when you go to answer it."


 * It's just another way of saying "If you decide to try to answer this question, you will find it on the language desk." --Milkbreath (talk) 15:31, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I could see how the word "able" in the example would be proper if it intends to convey the message that the person answering the question should feel as if he or she is "able" or "ready" or "capable" of answering the question. It doesn't sound foreign to me at all. -- Saukkomies 11:49, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

I suggest that there is no particular name for "this use of the conditional"; it's simply an additional sense of the word "if" that it has in addition to the primary one. Incidentally, it's existed in the English language since at least the 19th century: it occurs as the very first word of Gilbert and Sullivan's play The Mikado. --Anonymous, 04:00 UTC, December 20/07.

Translation of Columbus monogram
The following is an alternate interpretation of a monogram by Christopher Columbus: Servidor Sus Altezas Sacras Christo Maria Ysabel : Servant (of) Your High Holy Christ, Maria, (and) Isabel.Is the translation of the Spanish correct? LShecut2nd (talk) 21:14, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Servant (of) Your Holy Highness(es), Jesus/Christ, Mary, and Isabel? Pallida  Mors  22:00, 19 December 2007 (UTC)


 * We have a section of a highly speculative article at Salvador Fernandes Zarco/Columbus sigla and monogram which you may find interesting. Xn4  02:00, 20 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I've nominated the Zarco article for deletion: Articles for deletion/Salvador Fernandes Zarco. --Lambiam 09:10, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * I see your point. Then here's the image that article has of the curious signature... Xn4  10:17, 22 December 2007 (UTC)