Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 April 6

= April 6 =

Etymology of "This is why we can't have nice things"
Where did the phrase originate (I know it predates computers, so it can't be an internet meme), and where (outside of the web) is it most commonly used nowadays? 24.189.90.68 (talk) 07:54, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Long ago, in a galaxy far, far away, someone broke something and someone else said this. ¦ Reisio (talk) 09:18, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * No more Death Stars for you, Darth. Wellll, maybe just one more. But that's the last one. I mean it. Clarityfiend (talk) 02:28, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * In what context did you hear the phrase used? I think it's used by parents to complain after a child or another family member has broken something in the home to lament the fact that "nice" things in their home are susceptible to being destroyed...--达伟 (talk) 11:47, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * It's generally thought to have originated on The Simpsons (episode "Trilogy of Error", 2001). How do you know it predates computers? That's an interesting assertion. This discussion attributes the use of it in comedy to Paula Poundstone, and also says that it was generally used by parents scolding children when they break stuff, and presumably still is. 213.122.3.202 (talk) 06:05, 7 April 2010 (UTC)


 * The line was popularized by Paula Poundstone, who was using it by 1988: "She was one of those angry moms that use to get mad at absolutely everything. I remember the time I knocked a Flintstone glass off the kitchen table, and she said, 'Dammit, that's why we can't have nice things.'"  There are anecdotal reports of non-famous people (usually mothers) saying this earlier, so she probably did not originate it.  It was further popularized in 1999, when Colin Quinn used it on Saturday Night Live:  "American warplanes attacked newly installed Iraqi anti-ship missile launchers along the Persian Gulf. An enraged Saddam Hussein scolded his troops saying, 'You see, this is why we can't have nice things!'"  John M Baker (talk) 14:54, 8 April 2010 (UTC)


 * This was a common phrase used in southern Missouri during the first half of the 20th century, spoken after something precious was destroyed. -Paisley Amish

German garb, early 1940s
In a German-language list of garments and sundry textile articles produced in massive quantity for the Wehrmacht and the civilian population by an industrious Schneiderei in the Lodz ghetto, I don't understand what's meant by the following (if I've deciphered the printing correctly...) : I have a rough idea from the literal components, but what would be the equivalent terms in English, either of that period or present-day? -- Deborahjay (talk) 11:15, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Feldblusen
 * Windhosen
 *  Kragenbinder Kragenbinden

Feldbluse = field blouse for the army, according to the mr. Google, who also provides image results. 195.35.160.133 (talk) 12:15, 6 April 2010 (UTC) Martin.
 * A Feldbluse is a field jacket (we don't have an article on that specifically, but see Army Combat Uniform, M-1941 Field Jacket, M-1965 field jacket, etc., for some examples). The only meaning of Windhose I know of is tornado; I'm unaware of it being used for a literal pair of trousers (but WWII-era German military uniforms are hardly my area of specialty!). A Kragenbinde (plural Kragenbinden; I don't think Kragenbinder is a word) seems from the German Wikipedia article to be a kind of detachable collar used with field jackets. +Angr 12:18, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Would Windhose by any chance be Wendehose, or reversible trousers? The Kragenbinde is indeed a detachable collar protector, meant to protect your tunic collar from sweat.--Rallette (talk) 12:41, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Further from the OP: The lettering is clearly Windhosen, though perhaps by the hand of a non-native or undereducated speaker of German. It even occurred to me that it might be a back-translation from Yiddish, but checking my Weinreich YI>EN dico yielded only ווינדל (Windl), meaning "diaper" or "swaddling cloth". Might this be some garment that's padded or lined? Another possibility would be puttees or gaiters, if perhaps the Germans (military or civilian) used these? -- Deborahjay (talk) 13:09, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * | This eBay page suggests it *might* be rain pants, i.e. pants you wear over your normal pants when cycling etc. in the rain. 195.35.160.133 (talk) 13:50, 6 April 2010 (UTC) Martin.
 * The German wikipedia "Regenhose" says that rain pants are pants which are wind an rain resistant, so perhaps Windhose and Regenhose are the same. 195.35.160.133 (talk) 13:59, 6 April 2010 (UTC) Martin
 * When I was young, we certainly had "Windjacken", i.e. jackets that had no stuffing, but worked as a windbreak - typically made from tightly woven and possibly waxed cotton. The term seems to have fallen out of use with the rise of high-tech functional clothing based on synthetics and Gore-Tex-like membranes. But I'd expect a "Windhose" to be pair of wind-resistant trousers to wear as an extra outer layer. --Stephan Schulz (talk) 14:14, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Exactly my thoughts, so the English term would *probably* be "wind pants" (or "rain pants"). Mr. Google has plenty of (modern) hits for these. 195.35.160.133 (talk) 14:27, 6 April 2010 (UTC) Martin.
 * In UK English, they would probably be called overtrousers. Alansplodge (talk) 17:05, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * When I was in the Canadian Armed Forces, "wind pants" were a crucial part of our cold climate gear. These were heavy, insulated, waterproof overpants worn with suspenders. They were worn overtop the regular combat uniform pants, usually when the parka and mukluks were worn. pic. Seeing how armies borrow ideas/terminology from each other, this may we what you were looking for.  caknuck °  needs to be running more often  23:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Here are some photos: . ---— Gadget850 (Ed)  talk 00:37, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Auto / Otto
In my dialect of English, "auto" and "Otto" are homophones. Are they always homophones in English? In which dialects might they not be homophones? The Hero of This Nation (talk) 14:16, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * They are homophones only in accents with the cot-caught merger, which includes Canada and some U.S. accents, and maybe some Scottish accents. They're distinct in the rest of the English-speaking world. +Angr 14:23, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * They are distinct in Detroit. StuRat (talk) 14:28, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I think they're distinct in RP and Black Country/Brummie too. --TammyMoet (talk) 14:49, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * They're distinct in London and southern England too. Alansplodge (talk) 17:00, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * The OP's user page doesn't indicate where he's from, at least that I saw. I'm in the American midwest, and the words are pronounced "AW-toe" and "AH-toe" respectively. They might be used in plays-on-words that might also include "ought to", but the pronunciations would not actually be identical. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 18:32, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Angr's link explains really clearly where these vowels are merged. Everywhere else, they are not.  Marco polo (talk) 20:19, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * And those of us who live deep in cot-caught-merger-land have trouble understanding how "AW-toe" and "AH-toe" differ... -- Coneslayer (talk) 15:14, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * And those of us who can't remember any English word spelled with "ah" in a stressed syllable have trouble understanding what the hell is "AH-toe" supposed to mean anyway. Can someone write it in IPA, please?—Emil J. 15:44, 7 April 2010 (UTC)


 * When your midwestern doctor puts a tongue depressor in your mouth, he says, "Say 'Ah'." In New York City, I suppose he would say, "Say 'Aw'." To a midwesterner, "Aw!" is what you say when you see a new baby or a kitten or something. New Yorkers pronounce "water" as if it were spelled "wawter", to rhyme with "slaughter". Midwesterners pronounce it "wahter", to rhyme with "otter" (or maybe the Latin mater et pater). Which probably doesn't help that much to those who say them all like "aw". :) Anyone who can decipher IPA is welcome to clarify here. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 15:52, 7 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes, that's the problem&mdash;"slaugher," "water," and "otter" all rhyme, as far as I'm concerned! And I never figured out why "Dawn from Seattle" kept insisting that I was calling her by a man's name... -- Coneslayer (talk) 15:55, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * And I wonder how they get an "ah" sound from "au" or "aw". Of course, that does raise the question of why "laughter" and "slaughter" don't rhyme (except for the "er" part). And then there's "aunt", which can be pronounced either "ant" or "ahnt" or maybe even "awnt". Good ol' English. The way English works may well be an insidious plot, to drive crazy those foreigners who try to learn it. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 16:02, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Water has several different pronunciations. Even in accents where otter and daughter don't rhyme, there's variation as to which of those words it rhymes with, though I think rhyming with daughter is more common around the English-speaking world. I've heard that the Philadelphia accent rhymes water with butter. As for "how they get an 'ah' sound from 'au' or 'aw'", the difference between the two for many Americans who distinguish them is just a matter of lip rounding, and since lip rounding usually doesn't otherwise distinguish vowel phonemes by itself in English, it's easy enough to understand why some accents would lose the distinction between two sounds distinguished that way. +Angr 16:17, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Ignis/Lapis
Is there any German word deriving from Latin ignis (fire)? Like in English: igneous, ignition, ignescent, ignicolist, igniferous, ignifluous... And from lapis (stone), like lapidation, lapidary? I have only found Lapislazuli.--151.51.45.45 (talk) 14:22, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * See and  for some German Wikipedia articles starting with those elements. I'm sure there are more words than just those, though. +Angr 14:27, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually, Angr's link for "ign..." suggests that there may not be any commonly used German words derived from ignis. Most of the German Wikiarticles beginning with those letters seem to be English titles or names of bands.  There is the "ignitron", whose name came from its American inventor or his American employer, but I think this is a fairly obscure technical term.  There is also Ignimbrit, a geological term, and that's about it.  For lapis, there are a few non-technical words that most educated Germans would know.  My German is these days a little short of fluent, but I can think of the word lapidar without even checking a dictionary.  Marco polo (talk) 14:54, 6 April 2010 (UTC)

Oronym
I learnt today of the word oronym and wondered what the corresponding word for prose is, as in the example 'Godisnowhere'. It reads 'God is nowhere' and 'God is now here' depending on what you see. Thanks 92.11.43.155 (talk) 15:40, 6 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Rebracketing is the general etymological process. Not sure if there is a term for the word game.  meltBanana  18:55, 6 April 2010 (UTC)