Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2010 July 9

= July 9 =

wiktionary
hello guys. I think someone should take a look at http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/get_laid. it says that the idiom verb is intransitive but the used "get him/her laid" (i.e., get someone to sleep with him/her) is valid and doesn't that mean the verb is transitive because it can take an object? I don't do it myself because I am a long way from my English grammar class days in high school so I want a second opinion. thanks 76.199.158.172 (talk) 00:03, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't see "get" in this context as having a direct object. "John got his passport" does, as you see the when you substitute "received."  "Get laid" is a phrase like "get drunk," "get fired," "get shot," "get older."  Wiktionary's examples for get include the felicitiously-named copulative form, "get" in the sense of "become (older, shot, fired, drunk, laid)." --- OtherDave (talk) 00:41, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * OtherDave's link also includes the second form ("get him/her laid"): "(transitive) To cause to become; to bring about. That song gets me so depressed every time I hear it. I'll get this finished by lunchtime." ---Sluzzelin talk  00:47, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks, Sluzzelin. I see I misread the original question, which had to do with arranging for Person A to have slept with Person B.  --- OtherDave (talk) 11:31, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Really, it's just the word lay that's meaningful in get someone laid. To "get OtherDave laid" is like to "get the room cleaned" or to "get the job done": get laid there is not a separate meaningful verb. That said, I've added it as an "also used literally" sense to [[wikt:get laid]]. (For the future, you can propose ideas to Wiktionary editors at [[wikt:WT:ID]].)&mdash;msh210 &#x2120; 16:02, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for pressing your thumbs??
Clearly a German idiom, but it's a new one for me! What does "Danke, dass Du uns die Daumen gedrückt hast." really mean? Thanks, that you ____ to (or for) us ... DaHorsesMouth (talk) 01:16, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * ...crossed your fingers (in the sense of rooting for good luck). ---Sluzzelin talk  01:18, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Gawd, I love this place ... two minutes for the right answer, that's got to be a new record -- thanks!
 * DaHorsesMouth (talk) 01:32, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * (It's certainly my personal record, though I had two tweak it twice after the timestamped post) . See also German wiktionary's entry on jemandem die Daumen drücken for possible origins. It translates the phrase as "to keep one's fingers crossed". ---Sluzzelin talk  01:46, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * We have exactly the same expression in Swedish too, hålla tummarna. The Great Cucumber (talk) 06:29, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Same in Polish, trzymać kciuki, literally "to hold one's thumbs". Might be more popular in most of continental Europe than "keeping one's fingers crossed". — Kpalion(talk) 10:55, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I've heard of it in continental Spanish, too, but I've forgotten how they phrase it. Steewi (talk) 04:07, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

What is a works team in motorsports?
In the article on formula one team Sauber it says "The team went into the 1994 season as Sauber Mercedes, now officially Mercedes' works team". What does works team mean? I thought that was only a term for a car manufactors own team, owned and operated by the manufactor in question, but that does not seem to be the case here as Sauber was never what Mercedes GP is now. Only in 2006-2009 I thought Sauber was a works team for a major car manufactor, when it was owned by BMW and called BMW Sauber. The Great Cucumber (talk) 06:45, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * If no one here can answer your question, you might ask at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Motorsport.—Wavelength (talk) 16:06, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * You're correct about the normal meaning of "works team". In this case, the Mercedes refers only to the engine supplier. What is meant is that Mercedes designed its engine specifically for the Sauber team that season, and that any other users of the engine would have been customers (but only Sauber used it that season). It is not the common usage of the experssion "works team", which, as you say, usually refers to a team officially put together by a manufacturer. --Xuxl (talk) 17:41, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Tome
Is there a difference between a tome and a book? I think of a tome as just a big, old dusty book, but does it actually have a more specific application then that? Googlemeister (talk) 13:47, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * It could be one volume of a multi-volume set (which is actually what "tome" still means in French). Adam Bishop (talk) 19:39, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * The word "tome" is derived from a Greek verb meaning "to cut".
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=tome&searchmode=term
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=atom&searchmode=term
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=entomology&searchmode=term
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=appendectomy&searchmode=term
 * http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=lobotomy&searchmode=term
 * —Wavelength (talk) 23:45, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * As a native English speaker, a tome to me implies a very large volume of ages past (I don't think of many modern books as tomes), often containing what is accepted to be factual information in that society (perhaps like all the laws of the kingdom, information pertaining to the occult, the annals of the kingdom, etc). Falconus p t   c 00:17, 10 July 2010 (UTC)


 * You can check many dictionaries at http://www.onelook.com/?w=tome&ls=a. -- Wavelength (talk) 01:35, 10 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I think I usually see it used either as a piece of exaggeration - or of a facetious use of the same. "If Matt was to list all his faults, it would indeed fill a voluminous tome." kind of thing. Here, voluminous (which is the adjective that springs immediately to mind to pair with "tome") means "occupying a large volume" rather than the sense of being a single volume of a larger set. Which makes me wonder if voluminous tome is indeed a very old adj+noun pair that goes back to the original meaning. Matt Deres (talk) 16:10, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

Newsletter names: plays on words
Wikipedia has Wikipedia Signpost as its newsletter. Also, WikiProject Military history has "The BUGLE" at WikiProject Military history/News as its newsletter. Signposts and bugles both give information. The word "signpost" appears to be a pun on the practice of editors signing their posts on Wikipedia. Bugles are associated with military bodies. I have seen other newsletters whose names are apparently intended as puns on communication together with something associated with the organizations which have the newsletters. What is the name for that type of newsletter name, and where can I find a list of such names? Maybe Wikipedia has an article about the topic.Wavelength (talk) 16:03, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't know that I've ever seen a category or generic name for newsletters that take topical puns for their names. I've seen "Bellman" for a church newsletter (a church bell also being useful for communication), but I don't know that there is a one- or even two-word categorical designation for this type of communiqué-titling. If you want to coin a pithy phrase for it, I think it's open season (though asserting notability may be a completely different kettle of fish). Good luck! ☯ Zen  Swashbuckler  ☠  21:26, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * It's not often one says this, but I think you need to be less specific. Are you really looking for a name for names of newsletters, specifically, which are puns? That seems an odd thing to expect to exist. You might have some luck finding a list of them, though: sites listing punning names of shops (particularly hairdressers) are plentiful, and it seems using a pun as the name of a newsletter is a similar cultural habit. 81.131.27.38 (talk) 21:29, 9 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I am, but would be interested also in a less specific name.—Wavelength (talk) 01:25, 13 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I once tried to title a newsletter for tech support people "The Technical Supporter". The title wasn't popular, but I did get a few good ideas for its logo. PhGustaf (talk) 21:39, 9 July 2010 (UTC)


 * So you weren't strapped for ideas, then? ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 14:07, 11 July 2010 (UTC)


 * No idea, but if you're into this sort of thing, this sounds like your kind of book. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Indeterminate (talk • contribs) 03:23, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Thank you for that link.—Wavelength (talk) 01:25, 13 July 2010 (UTC)