Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2012 July 9

= July 9 =

Chinese (I suppose) ideogram
Composed of three parallel horizontal lines and one vertical line in the middle. What's that? OsmanRF34 (talk) 12:45, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * . --Viennese Waltz 13:03, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Nope, that's a symbol. In the ideogram that I saw, the vertical line is not so long. OsmanRF34 (talk) 13:11, 9 July 2012 (UTC)


 * First off, the term "ideogram" is not really an appropriate word to refer to most Chinese characters; linguists much prefer "logogram". It could be a rotated form of a contraction for "30" (卅, see here); otherwise, it doesn't seem much like a typical Chinese character... AnonMoos (talk) 13:52, 9 July 2012 (UTC)


 * 王, perhaps? Deor (talk) 13:59, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I also think it must be 王, "the one 一 who connects heaven, humanity and earth 三". No idea if that interpretation is true. —Kusma (t·c) 14:04, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * See also Wang (surname). Deor (talk) 14:05, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I assumed from OsmanRF34's unclear description and interaction with Viennese_Waltz that the vertical had to extend above and below the horizontals; if that's not the case, then of course you're right... AnonMoos (talk) 14:22, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * 丰 is apparently also a character, by the way. In Japanese I'm pretty sure that one is not very common, but I'm not sure about Chinese... 86.179.7.34 (talk) 17:18, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * 丰 isn't too uncommon in Chinese - probably one of the top 1000 characters. It's mostly seen in the fairly common word 丰富. But still far less common than 王, which is a very common surname and also means 'king'. 59.108.42.46 (talk) 04:01, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Viennese_Waltz happened to pick the similar-looking symbol rather than the character 丰, which is common and means "prosper" or "abundant". I do not agree that it is "mostly seen" as part of the word 丰富 (richly varied), it is also very commonly seen as part of the word "丰收" (good harvest) and various idioms. --PalaceGuard008 (Talk) 11:27, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Chic emporium?
In the context of the edible underwear article, what is a "chic emporium"? Dismas |(talk) 13:16, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * A small, trendy clothes shop. --Viennese Waltz 13:32, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Were you hoping to hear chick emporium? μηδείς (talk) 22:01, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I knew what the two words meant but not together. Dismas |(talk) 23:16, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Before investing in edible underwear, it might be advisable to check a similar discussion on the Misc. ref desk. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 09:03, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * And by the way, "chic" means "stylish". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 09:03, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Etymology of Chic?
Can anyone give the actual etymology of the French word chic? I once had the hardest time because I told a Dominican woman she looked trẻs chic, which she interpreted as meaning girlish, given the meaning of chica in Spanish. She wouldn't believe me when I said it meant elegante. μηδείς (talk) 03:00, 10 July 2012 (UTC)


 * chic, chic, chic have some information; it's unsourced though. By the way, how did you manage to get the Vietmanese letter modifier? The hook above-modified letters don't seem to be available in the box beneath the edit window. --Theurgist (talk) 03:26, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Funny, I knew of the German word schick and didn't think of it at all. Somehow they don't sound alike in my head. μηδείς (talk) 03:57, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Oops, didn't see that wasn't grave. I used the Latin extended, should just have used the Latin. μηδείς (talk) 03:56, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * In MacOS with the Extended keyboard, I get the Vietnamese hook with opt-z before the vowel: ảẻỉỏủỷ. —Tamfang (talk) 19:58, 10 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Here's what EO has to say about it: Despite the obvious punning opportunity, I think we can rule out "chic" having anything to do with "chick". ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 09:01, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Terms derived from Hebrew
Why does the list of English words derived from Hebrew not include "riffraff", from the Hebrew "ayrev rav", as used in the Book of Exodus? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 32.178.222.120 (talk) 21:06, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Possibly because that's an exceedingly unlikely etymology of the English word? See here, for instance. Deor (talk) 21:14, 9 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Per the OED, "riffraff" is probably derived from Anglo-Norman/Old French rifraf, ryfraf, rif et raf; the first element may come from a Germanic source. A possible Hebrew origin isn't mentioned at all; this doesn't rule it out, of course, but it does suggest it's not thought likely. Andrew Gray (talk) 21:16, 9 July 2012 (UTC)