Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2014 April 23

= April 23 =

the meaning of "drive"
I am not sure about the meaning of "drive" in the following sentence: "Most of that traffic comes from social-networking sites, driving readers toward BuzzFeed's mix of cute animal photos and hard news." Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 1.202.187.153 (talk) 09:12, 23 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Despite the hi-tech context, this is a relatively old-fashioned use of drive, to mean propel, direct. At one time this would have been the primary meaning - as in driving cattle, for example - but nowadays the meaning control a vehicle has become dominant. AlexTiefling (talk) 10:28, 23 April 2014 (UTC)


 * It's still often used in association with pushing or being pushed, which is its root. Prior to the automobile, you would drive a team of horses, hence the modern use of driving a horseless carriage and truck drivers being called teamsters. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 12:50, 23 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Wow Bugs, I didn't know that last point. (I assume you realise that it's only in the USA that truck drivers are called teamsters.) The language DOES evolve in interesting ways, doesn't it? HiLo48 (talk) 23:32, 23 April 2014 (UTC)
 * I am not familiar with teamster as a general word for truck driver. I had heard it only as it related to their union (or rather their best-known and most politically powerful union). --Trovatore (talk) 00:49, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * As noted in EO here, the term "teamster" originally referred to one who drove a team of horses, and was transferred to truck drivers as early as 1907. The article on International Brotherhood of Teamsters may be of interest, especially as they still use horses as their symbol. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:01, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * OK, but as far as I know it is not commonly used today to mean "truck driver", except insofar as the driver belongs to that union. At least I have not come across it.  Maybe it's different in your part of the country. --Trovatore (talk) 01:05, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Anecdotally, I would say "truck driver" is the more common term in the USA. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 01:13, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * ... and, of course, "lorry driver" in the UK. (I wonder which term they use in English-speaking Beijing where 1.202.187.153 is probably editing from.)    D b f i r s   09:23, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * What sort of driver would drive a pantechnicon? Hack (talk) 12:23, 24 April 2014 (UTC)
 * One who drives by the seat of his pants? {The poster formally known as 87.81.230.195} 212.95.237.92 (talk) 13:13, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

"Sherpa" as a surname
2014_Mount_Everest_avalanche lists several sherpas named "Sherpa", which is also the name of their ethnic group. So:

1) Is this an error ?

2) If correct, are they named after their ethnic group, or is the ethnic group named after the most common surname of the members ?

3) Are those people who are not named "Sherpa" from other ethnic groups ?

4) Has "Sherpa" also come to mean "mountain climbing guide" ? StuRat (talk) 21:47, 23 April 2014 (UTC)


 * See This for a pretty good rundown of Sherpa culture and naming practices. There are 18 Sherpa clans, you'll note on that page that the 18th clan listed is "Sharwa" which is itself an alternate spelling of "Sherpa".  See also the question titled "Q: Do all Sherpas use "Sherpa" as their surname?" which makes it clear that the surname "Sherpa" is indicative of the clan Sharwa or Sherpa.  Additionally, the word "Sherpa" can mean a mountain guide who is not strictly a member of the Sherpa people, so some people called "Sherpas" come from other ethnic groups who also help guide.  And sometimes, Sherpas will take the surname Sherpa even if it isn't their own clan.  Just to clarify all of that:
 * All Sherpa people come from one of 18 Clans, and their surname indicates which clan they come from
 * One of the 18 clans is itself named "Sherpa"
 * The surname "Sherpa" indicates that the person is a member of the Sherpa clan named Sherpa. Other surnames indicate membership in one of the other 18 clans.
 * Sometimes, Sherpas will take the surname Sherpa even if they don't belong to clan Sherpa.
 * People from other ethnic groups will be described as Sherpas even if they aren't of the Sherpa people, if they act as Himalayan mountain guides.
 * Hope that helps. -- Jayron  32  22:20, 23 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Are all 18 clans part of the Sherpa people ?  If so, I suppose one could say "I hired a Sherpa named Sherpa of the Sherpa clan of the Sherpa people". StuRat (talk) 22:59, 23 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo. -- Jayron  32  23:54, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

Surnames in northern India and Nepal don't fill the same function as Western surnames. The surname indicates which community one belongs to, often in terms of caste (which is also linked to guilds/trades in some cases) and/or ethnicity. Notably, progressives from upper caste backgrounds often shed their surnames completely, to avoid this casteist practice. --Soman (talk) 19:54, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Thanks all. I'll mark this Q resolved now. StuRat (talk) 17:30, 28 April 2014 (UTC)