Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2015 September 30

= September 30 =

French licensing statement
Please see the copyrights page for a certain website. Over at Commons, someone has told me, alternately, that (1) the page prohibits commercial use, and (2) that the page specifically permits commercial use. A couple of minutes ago, I asked him whether it mentions derivative works, but of course he's not yet replied. Since I'm trying to see whether the website's contents match our definition of a free license, would you please translate the parts of the page that would be helpful in deciding this? Nyttend (talk) 01:20, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * A possible source of help from a copyright policy end of things is WP:MCQ. I'll let someone who is more knowledgeable in French comment on the language issue.  -- Jayron 32 05:48, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * à des fins d’enseignement […] permet aux enseignants d’inclure […] des articles means it's an educational-use-only license ("…for teaching purposes […] allows teachers to include […] articles"). Thus definitely not suitable for us. Fut.Perf. ☼ 05:59, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * MCQ help isn't needed, as I'm quite familiar with our copyright standards; I was solely trying to understand what their standards said, so my thanks to FPAS. Nyttend (talk) 13:22, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * The webpage you linked to is not "the copyrights page for [that] website" (vteducation.org). That website is about helping the personnel of colleges and universities in matters related to information technologies. Among other things, it includes articles written by their collaborators, providing information on various topics. The webpage you linked to is one short article, which is part of a series of articles explaining to teachers some notions about copyright law in Canada and how it applies to teaching material in various situations. The topic of this particular article is an explanation of the conditions under which teachers in a college may legally reproduce licensed contents from Canadian newspapers obtained through the service of a provider (eureka.cc) to which that college subscribes. The article lists some newspapers whose contents can be reproduced under the licensing agreement with that provider and some newspapers whose contents can't be reproduced under that licensing agreement. The article also gives some advice about using unlicensed material under the fair dealing provisions of the Copyright Act of Canada. You can compare the situation to an article in Wikipedia about how newspapers may license their contents. The Wikipedia article about the copyrights of the newspapers is not the copyright policy of Wikipedia. So, the answer to your question depends on what you want to know. Do you want to know the licensing terms under which the contents of the website vteducation.org may be used? In that case, the notice at the bottom of the pages specifies that the contents of that website are under the license Creative Commons by-nc-sa 3.0, which is a license with the "non commercial" restriction that does not allow commercial use. Or do you want to know the licensing terms under which the contents of Canadian newspapers can be used through a subscription to the service eureka.cc? In that last case, then it is what the reply by User:Future Perfect at Sunrise is about: the author of the article says that the contents of the newspapers that are included in the service eureka.cc may be reproduced in teaching material by teachers of a college who subscribes to that service, because of the effect of another contract between that service and a collective copyrights management agency. But that reply by User:Future Perfect at Sunrise has nothing to do with the copyright of the contents of the website vteducation.org. Like translating a part of a Wikipedia article about some aspect of the copyright of newspapers would not have to do with the use of the contents of Wikipedia. Information about eureka.cc can be found on the website of that service.  -- Asclepias (talk) 03:49, 7 October 2015 (UTC)

Do Scandinavians have a word for non-Scandinavians?
Do Scandinavians have a word for non-Scandinavians?--Yppieyei (talk) 08:05, 30 September 2015 (UTC)


 * A Finn here: I haven't heard any, but sometimes people do use the word "Europe" when they leave Finland for another European country that is not a Nordic Country (i.e. Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Iceland, Finland). I believe that "the Britishers" also leave their Isles and "go to Europe" as well. But I couldn't say whether anyone really uses the term "European" in that sense – unless jokingly. --Pxos (talk) 11:59, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Norwergians and Danes call Germans "Tyskerne", if that's any use. Martinevans123 (talk) 12:11, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Well, Norwegians call Finns "Finnene", and Finland is, strictly speaking, not part of Scandinavia. May be that's the magic word? --Pxos (talk) 12:59, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * JIP might know; he's Finnish, and if I remember rightly, he travels a bit in countries to the west. Nyttend (talk) 13:19, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Once upon a time, when Finns went west, they became known as "Finnjävel". Can that be the word? A non-Scandinavian drunk who kills his buddy with a knife. At least the Swedish had a word, but I don't think it's very useful here. --Pxos (talk) 14:24, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I don't know of any Finnish term meaning "non-Scandinavian" or "non-Nordic". The only word that comes to my mind is "ulkomaalainen", but that just means "foreign". I'm not a native Swedish speaker, but I understand it to a very good degree, and I don't know of any such term in Swedish either. J I P  &#124; Talk 14:26, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Actually, the answer to the original question might be the same as the answer to my new question: Do people of North America (or the British Isles) have a word for "non-Northamericans", or "non-Britishers"? And, what's a "Scandinavian" anyway? --Pxos (talk) 14:31, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * A British person might describe a non-British person as a "foreigner". --Viennese Waltz 14:38, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * We usually call them 'immigrants'. KägeTorä - (影虎)  ( もしもし！ ) 15:13, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Hundreds of immigrants flock to Trafalgar Square every day, leave thousands of pounds in Britain, and when their holiday is over, they fly home. Bloody immigrants! --Pxos (talk) 15:16, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * (e/c) Where did you get that idea from? The question was about non-British people in general, not people living in the UK. --Viennese Waltz 15:18, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * This might turn into a joke, if we're not careful. "A Dane, a Swede and a Finn travelled to Newcastle. What did the locals call them?" I don't know the punchline but maybe someone does. --Pxos (talk) 14:51, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * "Potential goalies like, why aye man." Martinevans123 (talk) 15:25, 30 September 2015 (UTC)

Or in general

 * Why are you asking about Scandinavians only? Let's put it universally: Are there: any nation, any language, and any word, meaning - in that language - a person not belonging to that nation? Really, English has the word "foreigner", but its reference is not on a national basis (because even a person not living in my neighborhood may be considered a "foreigner" from my point of view). HOOTmag (talk) 15:02, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * The word "gentile" means non-jew. 77.127.47.30 (talk) 15:46, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Also see Goy in connection with non-Jew. Akld guy (talk) 21:12, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * A related example (but, again, not a nation) are the German-speaking people of the Swiss canton Valais who refer to all German-speaking Swiss from other cantons as Üsserschwiizer (outer Swiss). It's even mentioned in our article on Walser German. ---Sluzzelin talk  18:08, 30 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I would guess many languages have a word specifically for people from another nation, but maybe I just think so because my own language Danish has it: udlænding. A similar English construction would be "outlander". Another word fremmed means foreigner in general or stranger. Danish doesn't have a separate word for non-Scandinavian or non-Nordic. Danes usually don't include Iceland and Finland in Scandinavia but include both in the Nordic countries. PrimeHunter (talk) 18:40, 30 September 2015 (UTC)


 * I've marked this subthread as a separate question. First, "foreigner" is indeed such an example; just because it has other shades of meaning, that doesn't mean it doesn't have the one that was asked about.  Another such word in English is "alien".  Second, as I understand it the Greek and Latin words that give us "barbarian" derive from the concept that "foreigners can't speak our language, so when they talk it just sounds like bar-bar-bar-bar-bar"; and I've read that there are other languages with a word for foreigner that eymologically means "non-speaker", but I can't recall specifics to cite an example. --174.88.134.156 (talk) 20:15, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * They turned that into a song: Bar-Bar-Bar-Bar-Barbara Ann. Went to a dance, Looking for romance, Saw Barbara Ann, So I thought I'd eat her pants ...  .  --   Jack of Oz   [pleasantries]  22:17, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Alien? I feel Hurt. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:33, 30 September 2015 (UTC) ("is it coz I is Welsh?")
 * I presume (possibly recklessly) that all nations have a word for "foreigner", including the Scandinavian nations. I don't think that was what the OP was asking about though.  I think that they were asking about was whether the Scandinavian nations distinguish between "foreigners that are still pretty much like us because they come from another Scandinavian nation" and "foreigners that come from further afield".  The more general case would be "is there < > that has a specific word for foreigners not from that group of nations?"  I expect this would only occur where you have a group of nations with a clear group identity, and not necessarily even then.  I don't think the British, for example, have such a word except for sticking "non-" on the beginning of whatever group they're referring to, e.g. non-European, non-Western, non-Anglophone, etc.  (Unless you consider "Britain" as a group of nations rather than a nation, in which case it the answer would be "foreign"). Iapetus (talk) 11:33, 2 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Anectodal: Many years ago, when living Down Under (for 20-odd years) my Austrian passport was embellished with a sticker reading “Alien” (possibly alien resident, I can´t remember).  Unlike other Germanic imigrants to Anglo-Saxon shores I was highly amused.
 * As to the question by the OP: When - even longer ago -I briefly worked in Sweden, my "mates" at work frequently mumbled "jävla utlanninger".  Which JIP my translate, it they so wish.  --Cookatoo.ergo.ZooM (talk) 20:28, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * As you might already have guessed, that translates to "bloody foreigners". J I P  &#124; Talk 05:41, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
 * The Maori people of New Zealand have a word in the Maori language for non-Maori people. Pakeha is a term for white-skinned immigrants or residents. It has in recent years been extended to refer to any non-Maori of any race or colour, such as Asians and dark-skinned individuals. Akld guy (talk) 20:54, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Palagi is a word used in Samoa that has similar meaning to Pakeha. Akld guy (talk) 21:05, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Haole is the equivalent in Hawaiian. Rmhermen (talk) 00:19, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
 * People from Yorkshire have been known to refer to anyone not born and bred in Yorkshire as "them bloody Pakis" (*) ... allegedly. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:22, 30 September 2015 (UTC) (* please insert xenophobic rant of your choice).


 * The Inuit use Qablunaaq or a variant to refer to all non-Inuit. Originally just a term for white people who were the first outsiders it now encompasses everybody. See Inuinnaqtun English Dictionary CambridgeBayWeather, Uqaqtuq (talk), Sunasuttuq 00:10, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Here in Liverpool, UK, we refer to people not from Liverpool as 'woollybacks''. KägeTorä - (影虎)  ( もしもし！ ) 06:56, 1 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Gaijin appears to be the Japanese version. Akld guy (talk) 07:00, 1 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Further examples might be found in this list of Digital Resources for The Other in World History. ---Sluzzelin talk  09:55, 1 October 2015 (UTC)

Pre- WW1 German paper 3
In the following text:

Vernachlässigung anderer Strukturwirkungen berechtigt ist, zeigt die Rechnung selbst, und durch äußere Felder (die wir w. u. Einzuführen haben) kann die Dichte der Elektronen innerhalb der Bildkraftsphäre nur unwesentlich verändert werden.

What does w. u. stand for?

In googling I found it can stand for "wehrunwürdig", "Wirtschaftsuniversität Wien" and a few other things that cannot be appropriate, or possibly "Wissenschaftliche Untersuchungen" ( = scientific research or scientific/academic tests/investigations/inquiry) which doesn't fit very well - seems redundant. 120.145.150.244 (talk) 13:13, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Pretty sure it stands for "wie unten", meaning "as stated below". --Viennese Waltz 13:28, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Aha! That fits perfectly.  Thanks.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.145.150.244 (talk) 14:22, 30 September 2015 (UTC)
 * It stands for "weiter unten", meaning "below". --Pp.paul.4 (talk) 15:37, 30 September 2015 (UTC)