Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Language/2019 April 9

= April 9 =

Formula of three half-sentences
When announcing the negotiatied cease fire in Bosnia, Bill Clinton said "... the parties have agreed - to put down their arms - and roll up their sleeves - and work for peace." So he uses a rhetorical formula of three half-sentences. I vaguely remember that this is a well-known concept in rhetorics - but what's its name? --KnightMove (talk) 13:25, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * It is known, unsurprisingly, as the Rule of three. This is a common rhetorical device, and exists because three is the minimum number of items to establish a pattern.  In rhetoric, the first example establishes a concept, the second establishes a pattern, but the third is necessary to confirm the pattern.  This is subverted in comedy, where the rule of three is well known, in the case of comedy, the third is always the punchline, which subverts the pattern by taking the pattern established by the first two, and taking it in a different direction.  But even outside of the realm of comedy, three is a common number of completeness and sufficiency, and humans tend to (for whatever reason) find patterns of three particularly stable, interesting, and memorable.  -- Jayron 32 13:34, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I assume Jayron's answer is the one you're looking for (i.e. regarding the number), but if your question is more about the style or format, see parallelism. Matt Deres (talk) 17:48, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Just as a related example, German has a very common three-element construction ("von A über B bis hin zu C") to express a wide range of possibilities "from A to B to C", for example: "He produced a wide variety of compositions, from solo pieces to chamber music to symphonies and operas." Jmar67 (talk) 20:00, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * I see now that the OP is a native German speaker! Jmar67 (talk) 20:44, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Yes, this construction is a bit off my question - but thx anyway. --KnightMove (talk) 05:55, 10 April 2019 (UTC)

Origin of phrase: this will hurt me more than it hurts you
Can anyone help? Amisom (talk) 19:02, 9 April 2019 (UTC)


 * I was expecting to find it in some old novel such as Tom Brown's Schooldays, but I haven't found it. The Shorter Dictionary of Catch Phrases thinks that it originated around 1920, but they are wrong because I found "Please don't think that saying all this doesn't hurt me more than it hurts you" in Wind in the Willows from 1913, and a similar expression appears in Lippincott's Monthly Magazine of 1910.  I suspect that the phrase is much older.   Dbfirs  20:17, 9 April 2019 (UTC)
 * On Newspapers.com (a pay site, and not comprehensive), I found a similar expression in a Vermont newspaper in 1878. I expect you're right that it's a very old idea. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 00:46, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Interesting. Thanks people! Amisom (talk) 08:03, 10 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Abraham.--Shantavira|feed me 08:24, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Go on? Amisom (talk) 09:13, 11 April 2019 (UTC)
 * In Christian writings, Abraham does not tell Isaac that he is scared, sorry, or worried. He tricks him into coming along. In Jewish writings, Abraham knows that he will never be asked to harm Isaac. He knows it is a matter of going through the motions as a lesson for others. In Muslim writings Isaac is an adult and wants to be sacrificed. In none of the common views does Abraham state that harming Isaac will hurt him more. 12.207.168.3 (talk) 17:58, 12 April 2019 (UTC)


 * You could also try google's ngram search engine, which will show you if a given phrase appeared in any books back to 1800. It won't give you exact sources but a ballpark age. But only back to 1800! 70.67.193.176 (talk) 16:22, 12 April 2019 (UTC)


 * I tried that, but the earliest similar expression there seems to be in 1917.  D<i style="color: #0cf;">b</i><i style="color: #4fc;">f</i><i style="color: #6f6;">i</i><i style="color: #4e4;">r</i><i style="color: #4a4">s</i>  16:35, 12 April 2019 (UTC)